Andres Chitiva? [R]

Discussion in 'Colombians Abroad' started by ryu79, Jun 11, 2006.

  1. ryu79

    ryu79 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Oct 17, 2005
    NYC
    Club:
    America de Cali
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Apologies to Pibe if this topic already exists but I am curious if others agree with me that it is bizarre that Chitiva hasn't played a single game in qualifying for Colombia over the past two eliminatorias.

    Chitiva is a star on one of Mexico's biggest teams and has won a couple of tournaments over there. When on loan at Cruz Azul he looked absolutely dynamite in the Copa Libertadores (two brilliant performances against Santos particularly stood out) against top South American competition. He's also pretty versatile since he can play as a striker, on the wing (where I like him because he can cross the ball) and sometimes (though I don't think as effectively) as a 10.

    He's also still pretty young and would probably have a had a lot of future in front of him if he'd done well when called. I've never read any explanation or comment from Rueda, Maturana or Garcia on Chitiva and was curious if any posters here had. Considering how many players we've tried at his position I find it bizarre that this guy hasn't ever been given an opportunity.

    I'd like to see him get a shot at our Copa America team if he keeps his form in Mexico.
     
  2. ogopogo

    ogopogo Member

    Oct 13, 2005
    Lake Okanagan
    Club:
    Millonarios Bogota
    Re: Andres Chitiva?

    He's from Bogota and was a star player for Millonarios. of which he's also a fan. Therefore he's not in the " rosca". Seems silly, but that's how stupid (and corrupt) the regional/team rivalaries are in Colombia. Had he gone to Argentina and done as well as in Mexico, the coaches wouldn't have been able to ignore him.
     
  3. Pirru

    Pirru Member+

    Sep 21, 2004
    Club:
    CD Chivas de Guadalajara
    Re: Andres Chitiva?

    so because he plays in mexico they ignore him that's b.s.
     
  4. ryu79

    ryu79 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Oct 17, 2005
    NYC
    Club:
    America de Cali
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Re: Andres Chitiva?

    Not necessarily so: Tressor Moreno, Choronta Restrepo and Luis Gabriel Rey are all fixtures in Rueda's first team and they ply their trade in Mexico as well.

    What is Chitiva's reputation in Mexico?
     
  5. Pirru

    Pirru Member+

    Sep 21, 2004
    Club:
    CD Chivas de Guadalajara
    Re: Andres Chitiva?

    en pachuca es un hidolo
     
  6. ogopogo

    ogopogo Member

    Oct 13, 2005
    Lake Okanagan
    Club:
    Millonarios Bogota
    Re: Andres Chitiva?

    No, they ignore him because he didn't come from a Cali team(America, Deportivo) or a Paisa team (Atl. Nacional, DIM or Once). BTW, the only reason that ex-Atlante "Pachequito" was called to the team was because he is from Barranquilla, and since that's where the Col. NT plays, the people in Barranquilla said that they wouldn't support the team if Pacheco wasn't called. Now, compare Pacheco to Chitiva, same league and can play the same position. Who would you call?
     
  7. ogopogo

    ogopogo Member

    Oct 13, 2005
    Lake Okanagan
    Club:
    Millonarios Bogota
    Re: Andres Chitiva?

    Also for Millonarios of Bogota.
    When I said that he wouldn't be ignore if he played in Argentina is because any player, (regardless of region or team that he came from originally) that makes it there is first in line along with the ones in Europe for the NT.
     
  8. Pirru

    Pirru Member+

    Sep 21, 2004
    Club:
    CD Chivas de Guadalajara
    Re: Andres Chitiva?


    chitiva, you guys will have a strong team in 2010
     
  9. Pibe#10

    Pibe#10 Member

    May 1, 2003
    ArmeniA
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Re: Andres Chitiva?

    Chitiva was called up by maturana for the games against Venezuela/Argentina, but he never made it on the pitch, he could have playeda couple of minutes, but if I remember right he never did play.
     
  10. ryu79

    ryu79 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Oct 17, 2005
    NYC
    Club:
    America de Cali
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Re: Andres Chitiva?

    Why play him when Giovanni can have a nervous breakdown on the pitch! I remember that!

    He never played a minute.
     
  11. lfsr1544

    lfsr1544 Member

    May 9, 2001
    Glen Rock, NJ
    Club:
    America de Cali
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Re: Andres Chitiva?

    I disagree. Although Tressor and Rey are now 'fixtures', these guys weren't called up consistently until mid- to late in the qualifying process. And even when they were called they wouldn't start. Rey wasn't a starter until the very last 5-6 games and even then Rueda would take him out and leave JPA. Rueda went as far as blaming Rey (according to the media) for the 1-1 tie vs. Chile that cost us the qualification.
     
  12. ryu79

    ryu79 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Oct 17, 2005
    NYC
    Club:
    America de Cali
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Re: Andres Chitiva?

    Choronta has been a constant in Rueda's squad, dude. Rey didn't get a starting role in the qualifiers until late because he played terribly when called for a trial during some friendlies in Miami early during the qualifiers. I wish we'd gone to 4-4-2 earlier and played with Rey, but that's history.

    Those guys atleast got some attention from our coaching staff, yet Chitiva who has objectively achieved more than any Colombian player in the Mexican league and impressed in the Libertadores hasn't even got a touch of the ball with the national side.
     
  13. Steef

    Steef New Member

    Jan 30, 2006
    The Colombian that impressed me at Pachuca was/is Mosquera. He deserves a recall to the Colombian NT.
     
  14. Pibe#10

    Pibe#10 Member

    May 1, 2003
    ArmeniA
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    he'll get called up for Copa America, since Cordoba nor Yepes would probably play, and I would rather see him than A. Orosco (this guy is horrible)
     
  15. efernandez9

    efernandez9 Member

    Jun 6, 1999
    Joe Pool Lake
    you guys are going to change my mind about the way I see chitiva!

    mosquera is better than orosco in 2006! I will like to see him next to amaranto in the next nat. team game
     
  16. ryu79

    ryu79 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Oct 17, 2005
    NYC
    Club:
    America de Cali
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Efer, how do you see Chitiva? That's why I started the thread. Thanks.
     
  17. Pirru

    Pirru Member+

    Sep 21, 2004
    Club:
    CD Chivas de Guadalajara
    man I hate mosquera, he scored a goal against my team in the last second which made pachuca go to the final. His a great defender.
     
  18. efernandez9

    efernandez9 Member

    Jun 6, 1999
    Joe Pool Lake
    too small for todays futbol demands
    not enough ambition on his part
    en pachuca lo veo cada fin de semana y se pierde despues de jugar bien por 5 minutos.....tan perdido que frecuente mente se va para la banca.

    no le puedo quitar sus 2 campeonatos con pachuca...pero NO es definitivamente el LIDER que colombia busca en el medio campo!

    es algo que no se explicar al detalle, pero me parerce que cuando lo convocan se siente MUCHO menos que el resto del grp y no muestra ganas de liderar o ganarse el puesto.
     
  19. ryu79

    ryu79 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Oct 17, 2005
    NYC
    Club:
    America de Cali
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Agradezco tu opinion, Efer.

    Coincido que Chitiva a veces juega partidos de cinco minutos en Pachuca y que eso frustraria en la seleccion. Pero tambien, me pregunto si el tendria que ser "el lider" absoluto del grupo para mejorar el mediocampo que tenemos hoy en dia. De los nuestros, quien tiene ese liderazgo? Aparte de Soto, casi no lo veo, y hasta el se pierde a veces. Quizas Abel Aguilar lo mostro en Sub20s pasados, pero todavia se tiene que ganar continuidad con Udinese para ser un factor en la seleccion.

    Lo positivo de Chitiva para mi es que nos haria un ataque mas veloz y nos facilitaria juego por las bandas - que casi nunca explotamos - el chico sabe centrar la pelota cosa que a Murillo, Viafara, Patino les cuesta hacer.

    Lo fundamental para mi es que no tenemos IDEA ALGUNA de como seria Chitiva en la seleccion porque jamas se le ha dado la oportunidad. Recibio UNA convocatoria cuando la seleccion estaba bajo la direccion de Pacho Maturana. Si no lo probamos como sabremos, quizas nos sale otro Conejito Rey?
     
  20. dapip

    dapip Member+

    Sep 5, 2003
    South Florida
    Club:
    Millonarios Bogota
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Exactaly what I was thinking, after all why put him when we have size and skill in the names of Ferreira, Pachequito and Hernandez. Besides he has no place in the team since we have one of the best double purpose midfielders in Choronta and his play pushes up the level of the whole midfield.

    Furthermore when they play you always see them figthing for the ball and putting the team on their shoulders. We have never seen them lost in the field or making strange gestures that earn them nicknames like Angustias or something like that.:rolleyes:

    si, lo mismo que a Rey, hay que llevarlo despacio, convocarlo a los amistosos en Miami y mantener nuestra alineacion de base. Ya vendra su oportunidad.



    Ayyyyyy efer, que explicaciones tan absurdas, que ganas de justificar a los tecnicos, especialmente a los que fracasan. Aparte de Tressor no existe en este momento otro armador capaz de echarse el equipo al hombro, pero Chitiva en combinacion con Moreno y con Rey o Renteria pueden ser una combinacion interesante. Rey duro años pidiendo campo en la seleccion y no le daban la oportunidad y cuando finalmente Rueda se la dio su impacto fue inmediato. Tal vez Chitiva no es titular, pero es una alternativa muy interesante para jugar media punta o armador cuando se necesita encarar mas con equipos recostados en sus areas.

    En Pachuca puede que no sea inicialista, pero su papel en momentos importantes es incuestionable. Y aunque no soy fan del futbol Mexicano, pues el nivel de su campeonato es decente y la mayor parte el esqueleto de la seleccion (al menos en esta eliminatoria jugaba en tierras manitas (Calero, Chorontisima, Moreno, Rey). Que tienen esos 4 de diferente a Chitiva?
     
  21. ryu79

    ryu79 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Oct 17, 2005
    NYC
    Club:
    America de Cali
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Desde cuando no es inicialista? No recuerdo verlo fuera del XI aparte de lesiones.
     
  22. dapip

    dapip Member+

    Sep 5, 2003
    South Florida
    Club:
    Millonarios Bogota
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Si tienes razon, como que me quedo la idea de cuando venia de la lesion que lo metian en los segundos tiempos...

    El punto es, que es un jugador rendidor en una liga competitiva, merece una oportunidad de la misma manera que Rey se merecia una desde mucho antes que finalmente lo pusieran en el terreno con la seleccion.
     
  23. efernandez9

    efernandez9 Member

    Jun 6, 1999
    Joe Pool Lake
    ese man no sabe de este negocio: se LLAMA FUTBOL


    HAY QUE SABER como funcionan las cosas por dentro, y el tema no es solo rendimiento....pero este man cree que vive en el paraiso, y si uno tiene opinion distinta dice que los MODS somos muy "confrontationals":eek:

    es una cortina de Humo y mi comentario no es absurdo - empenzando por tu comentario de choronta (te quita toda tu credibilidad como veedor del futbol), son posiciones TOTALmente distintas y de un juego que no debe de ser vistoso -solo productivo-


    si.......chitiva empieza todos los partidos (brilla y se va por ratos muy largos)
    Tressor se gano su puesto con experiencia, a pesar de ser un futbolista con maleta lista al final de cada temporada. G Rey su dio a conocer en mexico y la idea de su futbol se demoro en cuajar en el ambiente de colombia ( o vos crees que lo que hizo en divisiones inferiores o banca del bucaramanga le abren los ojos a un tecnico nacional?)


    sigan aprediendo! aguante Rueda y cia.
     
  24. ryu79

    ryu79 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Oct 17, 2005
    NYC
    Club:
    America de Cali
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Wow, Efer. Francamente, me parece una contribucion demasiada aggresiva de parte de un Mod. Porque no coincida contigo no quiere decir que es un tipo que "es una cortina de humos" o que "viva en la nubes" - no sera mejor que dejemos comentarios personales fuera de la conversacion?

    Ademas, no se a quien te estas referiendo! A mi? A DaPip?

    Pero quiero entender bien, Efer - Tu argumentas que Chitiva no merece oportunidad en la Seleccion porque solo juega por ratos en cada partido?
     
  25. dapip

    dapip Member+

    Sep 5, 2003
    South Florida
    Club:
    Millonarios Bogota
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia

    Perdon, no sabre tanto como vos efer, y podre no estar de acuerdo en muchas cosas, pero al menos cuando cometo un error lo acepto. Ademas algunas de las verdades obvias hoy, algunos mods, no las aceptaban cuando yo era uno de los que se las cantaban. Por ejemplo:

    Quien pedia a Rey desde antes de que lo llevaran a la seleccion (Rey ya habia sido goleador en Mexico y no lo llamaban a la seleccion BTW)?

    Quien puso el grito en el cielo desde que nombraron a Maturranga?

    Quien dijo que colombia debia renunciar al 4-3-2-1 por un 4-3-1-2 o un 4-4-2?

    Estoy seguro de que ese no fuiste vos....


    Ademas yo no estoy pidiendo a Chitiva como reemplazo de Tressor, que tambien se demoraron en encontrarlo manteniendo otro favorito de la vieja guardia (Angustias). Yo digo que le den la oportunidad porque puede ser una alternativa cuando necesiten juego por las puntas o encarar el contrario.

    Y yo no se cual es el amor por Choronta, el hombre no quita balones, la principal funcion de un volante de recuperacion... Personalmente a mi no me sirve que haga el quinto gol en las goleadas contra Ecuador y Peru, me sirve que se coma la cancha en partidos como los de Chile y Uruguay... Asi como existen los talentos indiscutibles creados por el DIM (Amaranto por ejemplo), Choronta es un jugador del monton que tuvo la fortuna de estar en un buen momento y ser transferido a un club donde no lo hace mal.
     

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