I don't think you're being unreasonable when criticizing meaningless friendlies, but yes, the importance of this match for the Haitian people would be diminished if Ronaldo, RG, Roberto Carlos and other stars couldn't go and instead we saw only guys playing in Brazil. As far as meaningless friendlies go, this one, because it is a humaitarian effort, is not entirely meaningless, and I think the clubs, as much as they want to complain, should shut up here. They complain automatically for any meaningless friendly and they are right to do so in most cases. Criticizing participation in a friendly like this, where all players have said they want to be there and contribute to the effort, just looks bad.
Really? Players really want to go and participate? If so could you please tell me at least one Brazilian player who said he wanted to go. He doesn't even have to play for Milan, it can be anyone in Europe to make things easier
I realize you probably don't read O Globo, JB, Folha or Estadão regularly, but if you do, then you know that Ronaldinho Gaúcho, Roberto Carlos and Ronaldo have all stated they want to participate.
the Italians are just jealous. they jealous to see the beautiful Brazil.. doing the right things for the world. they want to take control over the brazilians. it's a fifa date.. and the players want tp play so AC milan should have nothing to say about the players.
Yes, that's a good theory But here's mine. Maybe Milan want Crespo, Kaka, Cafu, and Dida not to play in the Brazil/Haiti friendly because they have the Italian SuperCoppa against Lazio two days later. I know it sounds crazy but it might be true.
True, it does look bad to say that they don't want them to participate in the humanitarian effort. And I also understand that Haitians would rather see Roberto Carlos than Maicon. But really, they'd go if only half the stars were there. I bitched like everyone else when ManUtd played their C squad in Chicago and made for a horrifically boring game. But its the team's right to do that. At any rate - in a perfect world, we could all go to Haiti, see the game, and contribute some money. But in the absence of that perfect place, I think we'll have to settle for a good half of Brazil's A squad. That one might not be so bad either.
Of course they'd go, but for a humanitarian effort (as opposed to a money-making tour where the businesses don't care about the fans beyond that one game), I'd say sending the A-team makes a difference. Milan have asked the players not to be taken because they always will prefer that and, as Spartak points out, they could've played for Milan 2 days later otherwise. If it weren't a humanitarian effort, Parreira would gladly comply. Already he has made efforts to call up more Brazil-based or alternate squads on occasion (the Copa America only being the most obvious example) and this game won't serve as preparation for the Sept. 5th WC qualifier anyways.
Fair enough. In all honesty, Milan don't need Cafu or Kaka to beat us for the SuperCoppa given our sad state, but I'm sure they think they're a better side with those players. In all honesty, moste of my argument is on a more theoretical level - I don't keep up with Brazilian friendlies for the rather obvious reason that I'm not Brazilian. Oh, and like Brazil needs practice to beat Bolivia! P.S. Where is the WCQ against Bolivia? I might be in Brazil that week, and while I'm guessing its far, far too late to get tickets, it might make (perhaps?) for a cool atmosphere. Last real game I went to was a Chelsea - West Brom game. This would be a nice way to follow it.
I knew it was the fifth because I could see it in your sig. I don't think I'm going to Sao Paulo though, not unless I claim to have a pressing need to visit our clients there, and I have no intention once so ever of even thinking about work on my vacation. (Blackberries don't work in South America!!!) Thanks Ombak.
Necessary? It´s your opinion and nobody can say you´re wrong. In fact, I agree with you. Football is as good as any other sort of entertainment. It’s just a matter of opinion and it’s up to each individual. So, it is not really necessary. But at the same time it has to do with emotions, pride and the innermost core of our hearts. Sometimes a certain degree of cinicism is a healthy thing. But sometimes it´s only a poor attempt at recaptivating the attention of the spectator.
I meant in a strictly sporting sense, not in a "life raft to a sinking man" sense. Having Cafu, Kaka, Ronaldinho and ZeRoberto is crucial for World Cup qualifiers. Its not crucial for friendlies.
To my mind it is well within context. The brasilians that I know, as well as what I've gathered from Globo International news broadcasts and national papers, are proud that their country is taking a leadership position in an area of international need. Though the game is a symbolic gesture, it represents the fact that the Brasilian nation is giving of its treasures to help Haiti (with soldiers and aid workers being the most valuable treasures for sure). In the US we're used to Uncle Sam being involved everywhere so we don't take the same type of pride in all our involvements globally; but for other nations these events are a big deal. The game is powerful symbolism to both peoples involved.
While this is true, I guess in my mind I just don't make the connection of being more proud of fielding a team in the name of a good cause that has Kaka rather than one without Kaka.
Fair enough, but on a FIFA sanctioned date Kaka should make that decision without undue cohersion. I think we understand each other. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Slightly off topic, but tangential to your stated preference of club to country (I apologize if I misread); I value club and country equally. The relative strengths of both is part of what makes football the game that it is and differentiates it from all others. Country competitions come with a pageantry all their own, different from the club variety (didn't say better, but different). The day that international competitions between country select teams become obsolete (as Berlusconi (sp) once predicted) is the day that part of my love for the sport would die. In my travels around the world, whenever I've run into persons of my vintage (old) who love football we easily bond through discussions surrounding players and teams that have marked us. The best and most amazing part (something that rarely happens say in conversations about basketball, another global sport) is how often I've had conversations with relative strangers about specific games. What each of us were doing at that time in our lives, what was the context of the event (competition, date, phase of tournament), who the scorers were, how the goals were scored and in what sequence, which plays could have changed the nature of the game, how a particular defender was made to look stupid on a feint, what hairstyle a particual player was sporting, and on an on in the most minute detail. In my experience the overwhelming majority of these conversations -- this common database among football fans globally -- have been around international NT encounters. The game would lose part of its soul without meaningful NT competitions. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- PS - interesting take on Redondo, I was not aware that he had taken such a stance. I do clearly remember Redondo jonezing hard to get on the Argentine squad for the 1998 WC, and for some reason Pasarella chose to do without him. I remember reading about him being very disappointed. Seems that if he indeed made statements to the fact that his country should take a back seat, it came back to bite him in the a@@. Maybe an Argentine poster can illuminate...... However, one notes that half a year after the WC 1998 Redondo was present for the new Bielsa era, playing in two "meaningless" friendlies against Brasil within the span of a week (BA and Porto Alegre 1999).Seems Redondo may have had several changes of heart about NT service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- You are going to vacation in Brasil? You'll have a blast. You must take time to go see the documentary "Pele, Eterno" and grace us with a post on this thread https://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showthread.php?t=86621&page=3 Be safe bro.
The reason? Redondo´s haircut. And I´m not joking. Yes, it´s strange. Passarella told him to cut his hair. He refused Passarella's "orders". Well, it´s a long story.
CBF is gonna have to do something to get stuff like this straightened out. Brazil can not let these piss ant clubs tell it what it can or can not do. It's really simple actually, get the Brazilian clubs to demand clauses in their player contracts before sending them overseas. I read an article where it says Cafu was in constant contact with Parreira and expressed anger about the possiobility of being denied a spot in the squad because of his club's attitudes. If a coach can't count on a player, for whatever reason, he's gona be reluctant to call that player for games, and Cafu knows that.
Piss ant clubs? Since when is Milan a "piss ant" club? Good luck. You'll immediately lower their value for those clubs. Clubs won't got along with that. Yes, making a boatload of money sometimes requires sacrifices. Cafu could have gone to Brazil on a free. He chose Milan. What's he got to be complaining about? He knows European clubs aren't happy to let their aging stars fly all over the world for friendlies.
Everyboady will be there. this is Cbf man, you can't mess with them. whatever club you are. this is serious. i already saw Edu with the Crew in the dominican Rep.
People need to understand that the club vs. country argument has been going on for years. The best South Americans are going to play in Europe because that is where the money is. The obvious drawback is that clubs dont like their players travelling 9,000 miles round trip to play in a single EXHIBITION game in another hemisphere. For that matter, clubs are often at odds with the national team of their own country. In the past, Milan (or rather Berlusconi) has contested the need for so many national team games etc., not liking the idea that his players be involved in a useless friendly vs. Belarus or San Marino midweek (in Italy mind you), when 4 days later Milan was playing against X team in Serie A, etc. etc. It comes down to business. Soccer, now more than ever, is business. It's money. Friendlies are nice, so are traditions. But money talks. Cafu can complain all he wants that he wont be "allowed" to play in an individual friendly, but it was his choice to go to Milan, and the flip side of that coin is that he is making much more money than he probably would in Brazil (Im sure he doesnt complain about that very often), gets to play in the Champions League, blah blah blah. In an ideal world, national team interests, whether official or friendly/humanitarian/etc. would always come first. But unfortunately we live in a world where money talks more than anything.
Parreira made a bold move today and dropped 5 players from the squad for the Bolivia and Germany games. In his mind, the players did not do enough to convince their clubs to release them so he is punishing the players. This has to be the stupidest thing I have ever heard. It is not the players' fault. Parreira is letting his pride get in the way. I know Brasil has incredible depth and should be fine for these games but Parreira is now creating unneeded tension with those players. This could lead to chemistry issues in the future. Interestingly, this controversy has opened the door for some new blood. As many came to find out in a different thread, I am not the biggest Robinho fan. But I cannot deny he is playing well at the moment. It will be interesting to see if Parreira gives him or Diego a chance in these games. Kaka's absence is also another chance for Alex to make a move and we also may get our first look at the Ronaldo-Adriano combination everyone is so excited about.