2020 MLS Cup Referee Discussion

Discussion in 'MLS Referee Forum' started by Scrabbleship, Dec 12, 2020.

  1. Scrabbleship

    Scrabbleship Member

    May 24, 2012
    December 12 – 8:30 PM ET
    Columbus Crew SC vs. Seattle Sounders FC
    MAPFRE Stadium – Columbus
    TV: FOX, TSN
    • Referee: Jair Marrufo
    • Assistant Referees: Corey Parker, Kathryn Nesbitt
    • 4th Official: Alex Chilowicz
    • VAR: Drew Fischer
     
  2. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    AVAR is Tovar.

    Richardson and Radford there as reserves.
     
  3. StarTime

    StarTime Member+

    United States
    Oct 18, 2020
    Imagining a scenario where Marrufo, Chilowicz, and Fischer go down and Radford needs to step into the middle... that would be a fun one for the Seattle fans out there :)
     
    rh89 repped this.
  4. rh89

    rh89 Member

    Sep 29, 2015
    OR
    As a Columbus article pointed out, Marrufo and Parker were officials on the 2015 MLS cup also in Columbus where the ball went out of play at the touch line but was not spotted, leading directly to the Timbers winning goal.
     
  5. gaolin

    gaolin Member+

    Apr 21, 2019
    Just watched that.

    How do you get ANOTHER final appearance with such a ghastly error in 5 years? Why not give other referees a shot?
     
  6. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Because it was one mistake 5 years ago, they were the best or near the best at their position this season and others have had a chance since?

    If missing a ball slightly out of play 5 years ago is a capital offence,.. well, at some point you’d have no referees left. I mean, “ghastly?”
     
    Thegreatwar, GoDawgsGo, IASocFan and 3 others repped this.
  7. gaolin

    gaolin Member+

    Apr 21, 2019
    When you put it that way, you make a very valid point and I retract my statement.

    I've been (poorly) led to believe that making mistakes leading to game-winning goals like this from PRO is not a good look so that's what I was thinking.
     
  8. incognitoind

    incognitoind Member

    Apr 8, 2015
    It wasn’t popular at the time but since then one went to a World Cup and they might both go to the next
     
    StarTime repped this.
  9. Scrabbleship

    Scrabbleship Member

    May 24, 2012
    How does a striker get to play another game after missing an open goal in a big game?
     
    Thegreatwar repped this.
  10. roby

    roby Member+

    SIRLOIN SALOON FC, PITTSFIELD MA
    Feb 27, 2005
    So Cal
    In my defense....somebody moved the goalposts! :(
     
    jarbitro repped this.
  11. GlennAA11

    GlennAA11 Member+

    Jun 12, 2001
    Arlington, VA
    I like that he's actually calling fouls. Not a fan of allowing himself to be manhandled when issuing that first caution
     
  12. fischietto

    fischietto Member

    Apr 13, 2018
    Watching my annual MLS game ...

    Perhaps it’s just how he carries himself but in some instances Marrufo didn’t seem super at ease or comfortable out there. I also like the strict standard-ness of his directional signals, very crisp.

    Actual decisions have been good. Not all too much from a refereeing perspective.
     
  13. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Unfortunately, the scenario is impossible. Radford isn't in Columbus. He was sent to Atlanta (Hawkeye HQ) and would have only been used in a VAR (or AVAR?) role if needed.

    Also, being that he only does MLS VAR now, he likely hasn't passed fitness for on-field duty.
     
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  14. ptref

    ptref Member

    Manchester United
    United States
    Aug 5, 2015
    Bowling Green, KY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If Marrufo wasn’t so slow in the whistle, then that retaliation by Smith probably doesn’t happen. In my opinion, Smith is lucky that he wasn’t sent off for that.
     
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  15. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I was just about to respond to this by saying that anyone who has ever seen an MLS playoff match or a Jair Marrufo match--nevermind a Jair Marrufo MLS playoff match--knows there was 0% that was ever going to be a red card. So I find it hard to say Smith was lucky. Maybe in a local amateur match. But not here.

    And that's the same reason (alongside the 3-0 score line) that what I felt was a pretty obvious DOGSO foul by Smith ended with a no-foul call.
     
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  16. GearRef

    GearRef Member

    Manchester City
    United States
    Jan 2, 2018
    La Grange Park, Illinois
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is incorrect, I believe. He has pictures on social media at MAPFRE from today. However you are right on the second part. No fitness test = nothing on-field.
     
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  17. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Oh, I had heard otherwise when the assignment was finalized earlier this week. I think it's much better to have him in Columbus anyway so that's nice to hear!
     
  18. ptref

    ptref Member

    Manchester United
    United States
    Aug 5, 2015
    Bowling Green, KY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I know Marrufo’s reputation, but that doesn’t mean that something like that should go unpunished. What Smith did was beyond reckless, and should not be tolerated. This attitude of “let’s keep all 22 players in the game” gives the players the idea that they can just about get away with murder with no real consequence.
     
  19. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm not too interested in debating the merits of the decision (though I do think, given all the factors in this particular scenario, yellow was the best decision).

    All I'm saying is that if we all know that's never getting a red in the playoffs and we all know Marrufo is never giving that as a red... Smith wasn't really lucky because the decision that everyone expected was given. Unless the "luck" portion has to do with it being the playoffs and/or Marrufo.
     
  20. StarTime

    StarTime Member+

    United States
    Oct 18, 2020
    My gut instinct on the Smith play was DOGSO, but the more I think about it, the more I am in doubt due to having to sort of stretch the “distance to goal” consideration to make it work. Anyone have a video of it?
     
  21. GearRef

    GearRef Member

    Manchester City
    United States
    Jan 2, 2018
    La Grange Park, Illinois
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  22. refinDC

    refinDC Member

    Aug 7, 2012
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I assume we should not read anything into CSA being left out of this paragraph?

     
  23. StarTime

    StarTime Member+

    United States
    Oct 18, 2020
    I don’t think it’s anything. Please somebody correct me if this is wrong but I’m pretty sure PRO was literally formed as a partnership between USSF and MLS.
     
  24. refinDC

    refinDC Member

    Aug 7, 2012
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    PRO has included CSA before though, and went out of their way to say they were working on officiating in North America or USA & Canada.

    Even their LinkedIn (probably not updated in awhile) includes that https://www.linkedin.com/company/professional-referee-organization

    I'm not saying this is something, but was just curious if there was a change
     
  25. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    PRO doesn't have anything to do with the CPL, right? I wonder if that's what has prompted the change in language or at least de-emphasis on the Canadian part. Of course, given the original involvement of the CSA in the formation of PRO and the language about professional leagues in Canada, I guess I could also ask why PRO doesn't have anything to do with the CPL.
     
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