2010 Moves and Trades

Discussion in 'Sporting Kansas City' started by vividox, Oct 18, 2009.

  1. Buzz Killington

    Buzz Killington Member+

    Oct 6, 2002
    Lee's Summit
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    I don't think we necessarily we get rid of him over Josh, I'm just saying that you listen to offers for Davy as well just to see what you could possibly get.
     
  2. JimK

    JimK Member

    Mar 9, 2008
    WaldoKC
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    Poland
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    Just my two cents' worth, but I would argue that we rebuild around the following players: Kamara and Zoltan (no surprise here, right?) and Hirsig.
    I would also like us keep/protect Herculez, but given the lack of playing time the last several rounds, I would not be surprised to see him somewhere else next year.

    I get that Davy is and probably always will be a favorite, but I'm not sure I would keep him. As others have said, he has his ups and downs and certainly has some fantastic goals, but he has pretty much been absent since the end of 2008. Trade him? Who knows, his value is probably not the best right now - leave him unprotected in the expansion draft.

    As far as the back line goes, outside of Jimmy and Lance (I know, not a popular guy), I don't really see one better than the others. I mean Besler was played like a violin several times this year, but then so were Leathers and Holbein. We may need to suffer through another year until these guys get more experience.

    I like Lopez and Wolf - no they are not as fast as they used to be, but I like the creativity that both bring to the pitch. Sure Wolf is not the guy in the air, but then everyone knows that so we should question why the Wizards continued their aerial assault through Wolf - It seems more of a strategic lapse then something inherently wrong in Wolf's game.

    Lopez? Again, a source of frustration for many on these boards, but I can't help myself, I like his play - even when he makes really poor passes, one can see what he wanted or where he thought the run should have been made. I guess I am partial to Lopez the way many are partial to Davy.
     
  3. j_m_t

    j_m_t Member

    Aug 27, 2005
    KC
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    i wouldn't care if i don't see these guys anymore (or not care too much)

    Lopez; he disappears too much like stated and i'm not sure his moments are worth it

    wolff yes he scored goals but i think someone else can score a lot more in his place

    watson gained ground with me this year but i think he has come as far as he can and it's just not good enough

    defense: keep jimmy everyone else has to be worried. they have potential but it may be potential that we can trade for

    hirsig moments where he looked good but some moments that looked like me on the pitch...not good
     
  4. j_m_t

    j_m_t Member

    Aug 27, 2005
    KC
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    the only ones that i wish to be here next season

    Jimmy can't get rid of the "face" of the wizards. not as good as past years but then a pretty serious injury as well

    Kamara showed he can be very dangerous

    espinoza the kid has impressed me and i'd like to see him get more 1st team time

    harrington has tons of potential that i hope onalfo didn't destroy. play him right and let him grow

    everyone else at this point has to be worried about being here (as long as they still like here) next season...even davy
     
  5. Buzz Killington

    Buzz Killington Member+

    Oct 6, 2002
    Lee's Summit
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    We don't know the value of a guy so you want to potentially let him leave for nothing???
     
  6. cjgwizard

    cjgwizard Member

    Apr 25, 2006
    LSP, section 129
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    No kidding! If we left Davy unprotected, it's almost a guarantee he would be picked by Philly. If we get rid of him, at least do it with a trade to get something in return.

    Personally, I agree with those that say he will be roaring in like a lion for us in March. Take some time off.....get mentally and physically recharged....come back like a beast on DC in March. :)
     
  7. MtMike

    MtMike Member+

    Nov 18, 1999
    the 417
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    I'm not that worried about the defense, they're phenomenally young. Besler was a Rookie, Harrington was a 2nd year guy, Holbein and Watson were in their 3rd years or so and hadn't played much before this year?

    They just need more seasoning and maybe a better destroyer in front of them.
     
  8. Buzz Killington

    Buzz Killington Member+

    Oct 6, 2002
    Lee's Summit
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    Actually Harrington is in his 3rd season with Hohlbein, Watson just finished his 4th.

    But a true destroyer type in the midfield would be very nice. Jack's and Hirsig have done well at that position, but getting a true destroyer in there would be nice.
     
  9. Buzz Killington

    Buzz Killington Member+

    Oct 6, 2002
    Lee's Summit
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    I wouldn't say he's automatically taken, he IS our highest paid player according to the salaries on the player's union website. It depends on how Philly wants to build their team.
     
  10. glenthas

    glenthas Member

    Apr 3, 2009
    Kansas City
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    I agree with this to an extent. I think it would be a definite mistake to give up on Besler this early. Holbein is pretty solid and makes a great backup. I feel much the same way about Leathers/Watson. I think they'd be decent backups. Unfortunately, they aren't backups. I'd like to see an upgrade at RB and give Harrington another shot at LB.

    As for midfield, I was happy overall with Hirsig and Jewsbury. Disappointed with Davy, but not enough to get rid of him unless we get offered a great trade for him. Gomez was good at times but certainly didn't impress. I'd like to see Espinoza get more playing time and think Zusi has enough potential to stick around. Assuming we don't run into salary cap issues, which I don't expect, I think we keep Lopez for another year. I guess Meyers has transitioned to the midfield. He definitely looked dangerous at times and is still very young. Hopefully he can stay healthy and develop into a solid player. Similarly, Souter may make a good back up/sub.

    I really liked what I saw out of Kamara during the last game and Zoltan has definitely given us a different look. I think our best bet here is to try and get something out of Wolff and, maybe, Christman.

    I agree that we should be willing to trade most anyone other than Conrad, Besler & Espinoza, it's just that Wolff is the only one I see us getting enough out of to make it likely. Then again, we did get Kamara for Thompson so who knows.
     
  11. kopiteinkc

    kopiteinkc Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 1, 2000
    Shawnee
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    I think we need to "build a spine" for our team. Goalie, central defender, central mid, goalscoring forward.

    Hartman and Conrad are a start, but we are severely lacking in midfield and forward.

    I agree that we need a destroyer in midfield, but we need a playmaker even more. The record is broken on that issue and it has not been resolved.

    I am not sure if Kamara is the answer up front or not. Not enough time on the team to tell. Even if he is, he needs more help.

    Whatever you look at it, we are in serious need of some fresh faces this off-season.
     
  12. MtMike

    MtMike Member+

    Nov 18, 1999
    the 417
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    I will say that we miss a Z-man/McKeon (yes I said it) type of destroyer in the midfield in front of the center backs. Hartman's fine, but we need a better backup in case of injury.
    I think Holbein is fine next to Jimmy, there are more pressing needs, but upgrade if you can. I like Besler on the left and Harrington on the left side of midfield.

    Something like this:

    -----------------------Hartman

    --upgrade/Myers--Conrad--Holbein----Besler

    -----------------------Davids, REdux

    -------Arnaud-------------------------Harrington

    -----------------------Upgrade

    ----------Lopez--------------Kamara
     
  13. cjgwizard

    cjgwizard Member

    Apr 25, 2006
    LSP, section 129
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    Cristman had some bad luck with a foot injury that took him out for half of the season, then probably played before he was really in shape and got injured again. Given what he did with NE as a rookie, I am not ready to give up on him yet. He is a big kid that can make runs at goal. I think we keep him and hopefully he stays healthy during the preseason. If he keeps getting injured, then drop him.
     
  14. SombraAla

    SombraAla Member+

    Apr 2, 2006
    Waldo (Kansas City)
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    You mean like a replacement for Zavagnin? Honestly, end of last year, I thought Morsink was going to take this position... while he had a rough start, he definitely started to gain traction there near the end... though I didn't disagree with Hirsig in that spot this year. Of course, you'd have to have an adequate backup for Morsink for every 7-8 games due to consistent yellow card accumulation.

    Ultimately I was somewhat confused about Hirsig - he seemed to have good on-ball skills which seemed somewhat wasted in the holding position. The few times he did get forward under PV he looked dangerous.

    I would love to see someone find a young Zavagnin clone... I do believe that we've missed someone like him, possibly more than we've felt the inexperience at the back line.

    ...

    Other than that - keep our young backs... Chance can go in at RB... we've been looking for a real (read: non-converted midfielder) RB for some time. Keep Conrad as well - still quite capable, and also for the leadership

    Arnaud - keep, while his play towards the end season was off, I'd rather take the risk that it continues than to watch him break that slump and play a major role for another team.

    Jewsbury - keep, if nothing more than his ability to play back-up for anyone but Hartman, and with his adaptability I wouldn't discount seeing him put the gloves on sometime and giving that a try.

    Hirsig - keep, I suppose - he has something that most in the league do not, but I'm not sure if we're using him correctly.

    Souter - keep, I suppose - hard for me to say as it's been such a long time since he was playing week-to-week.

    Espinoza and Zusi - keep, promising young talent.

    Wolff - sell. No hard feelings Wolffie, but we need changes and it simply makes sense.

    Gomez - sell. I do think he might be able to provide value somewhere, but sans a (very important) ball off his knee against San Jose at the end of 08, he just hasn't produced.

    Zoltan - keep... takes the chances he has well - something that we hadn't done very well all season otherwise.

    Kamara - keep if possible, will be interested if he does stick around. Would be happy to see him again but won't be too surprised if he's on the way out.

    Lopez - negotiate, I wouldn't mind seeing him back but only on the stipulation that we're not depending on him to start all of our games... which would then require a change in pay scale.

    Cristman - ??, in my opinion, at least give him an opportunity to prove himself next spring... I do hate getting rid of people who never had a chance to prove their worth. Granted, he might have proved he's worth a spot on the injured reserve list...

    Needs: Zavagnin clone, central midfielders, striker.
     
  15. Buzz Killington

    Buzz Killington Member+

    Oct 6, 2002
    Lee's Summit
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    I don't know about everyone else, but I think we saw this year that Harrington's best position is indeed left back and moving him up again (in my opinion) would be a waste.
     
  16. glenthas

    glenthas Member

    Apr 3, 2009
    Kansas City
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    I completely agree.

    I'd say something more along these lines:

    -----------------------Hartman

    --upgrade/Myers--Conrad--Besler----Harrington

    -----------------------Jewsbury

    -------Arnaud---------------------------Lopez

    -----------------------Hirsig

    -------------Kamara--------------Upgrade

    With Lopez and Espinoza sharing time and then Zoltan and one of the forwards. I think Lopez will be a far better performer with periodic rests.
     
  17. j_m_t

    j_m_t Member

    Aug 27, 2005
    KC
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    i'm with the opinion that we need a creative midfielder more than a defensive mid. due problems with the d-mid spot has been with the inconsistency of who will play there every week...hirsig, jack

    hirsig just doesn't seem to be a d-mid to me, wasn't he suppose to be a a-mid anyways?

    jack is adequate bac there, better than a-mid for surek
     
  18. NorthbankHighbury

    Jan 25, 2009
    Liberty, MO
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    You mean something like Grobbelaar, Hansen, Souness, Rush do ya? Seaman, Adams, Bould, Viera, Wright? Schmeical, Pallister, Keane, Cantona ......

    .... tiss all about the strength through the middle ... you can't name a successful side with a weak core.
     
  19. NorthbankHighbury

    Jan 25, 2009
    Liberty, MO
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    Nah he is pure defensive midfielder .......
     
  20. kopiteinkc

    kopiteinkc Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 1, 2000
    Shawnee
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    Replace Grobb. with Ray Clemence and my nerves stop jangling ;)
     
  21. Buzz Killington

    Buzz Killington Member+

    Oct 6, 2002
    Lee's Summit
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    Or a more KC based example, Meola, Vermes, Zavagnin, McKeon, Preki, Molnar....
     
  22. j_m_t

    j_m_t Member

    Aug 27, 2005
    KC
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    i know but before he was signed it was touted that we were bringing in an attacking mid
     
  23. Beech

    Beech Member

    Jul 26, 2001
    Kansas City
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    I actually saw his role more as a holding midfileder. Jack was more of a destroyer type. Hirsig was able to smooth out a lot of hospital balls served back in from our mid/def wide play and transition it back to a controlled thing to the next guy - and not just with back and square passes. Seldom saw him lose possession. I see it kind of like Feilhaber (Hirsig) and Bradley (Jack) with the US Nats in that Bradley is your toughian that barges in and breaks things up and Feilhaber, although not quite as specialized at that, was the better distributor and supporting mid presence to switch/outlet or reset with. This enables Bradley (or Jack in our case) to pick a few chances per game to run up deep if there is opportunity from the offensive perspective yet still maintain a very good defensive element in front of the backline on a counter. Just not as specialized as Jack is at it. Jack is very skilled at just about any position and Hirsig allows him to rove as needed to support whatever is playing out.

    I'm a Hirsig fan and I seriously hope he's with us next season. He is a calming controlling presence in situations that the American players many times get flustered with, especially under pressure in the middle.
     
  24. NorthbankHighbury

    Jan 25, 2009
    Liberty, MO
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    Grob was more fun :D
     
  25. NorthbankHighbury

    Jan 25, 2009
    Liberty, MO
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Re: 2009-2010 Offseason

    Yeah -- either way he is not running at people, but your right he isn't really breaking things down. I really think he was a quality addition regardless ... as you say he is a calm head and he has substantial quality.
     

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