YNT-Eligible MLS Players: 2018 In-Season Thread

Some of what I am about to say is pure speculation but here goes...
1. What happens with Adams next year is extremely important for a few reasons. Here are three that I can think of off the top of my head:
A. If Adams is immediately successful in Europe it will do a huge amount for MLS' credibility in Europe as a league that can develop and produce players.
B. If Adams is successful in Europe, it will make successful 19-22yr old MLS players more desirable in Europe which in turn will make it more likely that European teams will offer larger transfer fees (and contracts) for those players which in turn will make MLS more likely to sell those players.
C. If Adams is successful in Europe, it will make it more likely that some top players will see MLS as a legitimate path to Europe. The very top players with a passport may still go to Europe but it may be easier for a top player without a passport to sign that contract at 15 or 16.

Of course if Adams is successful in Europe it is only the beginning and more will need to follow if any real momentum is to be developed.

 

I think you're forgetting that the most notable prospect moving from MLS to Europe right now isn't Tyler Adams, and he isn't American, either.

 

I don't know what Davies rep was as a younger player but one of the reasons that I think Adams is so important is precisely because he didn't have the same rep as some of the very top players (Sargent, Weah, Carlton, etc). I may be wrong, but I believe he surprised quite a few people. It is one thing for a top prospect to turn into a top player but it says a bit more when a "second tier" player makes it big. Obviously Carlton isn't getting the minutes that many (most?) feel he deserves but assuming he does make it big people are going to say "see, that just shows you that AFC should have been playing him earlier". If a less heralded player is developed by Atlanta (or any other MLS team) and makes it big, it says more for their development system.

I believe that Adams development, ultimately, has the potential to say more about MLS' development (or at least RBNY) than if he was a more sought after talent like Sargent, Weah, Carlton et al. A guy like Carlton comes with a great deal of downside and less upside for AFC. If he turns out to be a top player everyone is going to say he would have been just as good anywhere else or they will say if he had been in Europe he would be better. If he turns out to be less than a top player they will say AFC ruined him. If Adams career had never developed or if he were earning 100 minutes this year very few might have noticed or complained.

 

Adams was really highly rated from a young age. He was always one of the first names mentioned in the '99 year. Adams played up a year with the 98's in U-17 WCQ and the U-17 WC. He was the only '99 on the team in qualifying, and was one of two 99's on the U-17 WC team (3rd keeper Lopez the other).

 

was he in the same stratosphere as a player like Carlton or Sargent? (Honest question because I don't keep up with and am not as knowledgeable on young players as you).

It is one thing to be a top player and highly rated but was he considered to be in the in the elite of the elite like the players I mentioned? My guess is that guys like Sargent, Weah (maybe partially due to genealogy/father's rep), Carlton, Davies would have all been considered to be a step above him at the youth level. Is that accurate? Even now he probably gets more criticism than a guy like Sargent. (to be fair, there are some that see him as having a "world class" ceiling").

I am not trying to say that Adams was completely unknown or that he wasn't highly rated. I was saying that he wasn't rated as highly as many others. I don't remember hearing any of the hype that surrounded some of the others. I have always followed the youth teams more superficially but I tended to be somewhat aware of many of hte more prominently hyped players. Maybe I missed him.

Even if I am wrong about Adams, I still feel that the effect of players like Sargent (I know he didn't transfer from MLS) transferring and finding success would be far less than the effect of a less known player transferring and finding success. The one caveat to that would be a transfer to a big club and finding a regular spot on that team. If Chelsea ever buys a player from MLS and plays him the first year instead of loaning him out that will be big and I have to admit that If Bayern plays Davies, that will be very big.

 

I think you have a decent point, but Adams is one of the higher rated guys in recent memory. Sargent didn’t really become a “name” until the last year of his U-17 cycle. Weah’s potential was talked about but he never really produced much. Carleton might’ve been a bigger name but there aren’t many in the last 10 years who’ve had more hype than him. Adams was a reasonably big name. Outside of a handful or so the last five years who had a lot of hype, he would fit somewhere in the next group in terms of hype as a youth player.

 

I would take a different angle. Everything is showing that the current young American prospect is very good. But most of the success stories where imported directly from academy. The question is if MLS is doing well in developing young players. So far MLS has only had consistent success with selling defensive products.

 

I'm looking forward to more teams adding second or third division teams. NYRB has done a great job of using their team to give players minutes and get them ready for the full team. I think a lot of players will advance quicker when their clubs have that same pathway.

 

If you look at the last U17 WC Squad, it is about 50/50 between signing with MLS and another league. What is interesting is that the amount going to college, especially outfield players, is maybe 2 of 20.

I would wonder if the number signing with MLS is actually higher than 5 years ago, but the number going to college has dropped significantly and the number going to Europe has increased significantly.

 

Anyone have a sense of how often players in Europe move from one academy to the next?

Is it just MLS that has this problem keeping their prospects?

 

It is a great question and I think it happens quite a bit in some places. The top clubs in England probably lose all their guys. They lost Pogba. Sancho left Man City for Dortmund. Most of the Academy players for the top 20 clubs never make it onto the first team and go elsewhere.

Pulisic is basically the only player that has come from Dortmund's academy to the starting 11 in the last three years. But if they can sell him for $60MM+, all the other guys lost or not making it are worth it.

All the guys Vancouver ever spent money on in the Academy were worth it to get one Alphonso Davies. MLS Academies pay off sooner with the fact that HG salaries are paid by the league. Even if they didn't sell him, EPB was a free back up CB for a year. Adams has been a top MF this year for free. NYRB would probably have had to sign a TAM player to duplicate that (or keep Dax, who cost 8X as much in salary).

Look at Adams. Yes, they lost Gloster, Weah. But they kept Adams and signed him. He let them sell Dax for $400K. Then he played a year on $110K in a position Dax is playing for $700K. If they sell him for $5MM this Winter, it is all worth it.

In Just three years of development, NYRB would make/save a combined $6.1MM.

 

Frankly if I were a good soccer player, which I'm not, I'd certainly take a salary from MLS over a college offer. MLS minimum salaries are $60k, I think Kortne Ford just got about 80k from the Rapids. That's worth well in advance of even the most expensive private school tuition.

 

It's pretty clear at this point that whatever is happening isn't due to Acosta's ability, but personal issues between him and Petke. It's extremely frustrating to watch the club drop points while the average Herrera plays ahead of the exceptional Acosta.

I'm not convinced this is true. RSL apparently made very little effort to sign Ledezma or Soto until they were 18. There also appears to be zero plan for the Monarchs, and zero integration of the Monarchs into the club's developmental ladder. Every homegrown signing they've made since 2016 has been from the NCAA, or Lennon who played professionally at Liverpool - zero signings directly from the academy since Acosta in 2015.

FC Dallas mostly stopped losing players after McKennie, because they started signing players at 15-17. RSL is due for the same wake up call. Maybe this will be it for them.

 

It's all a question of contracts. Youth players in England will sign for an academy, say at 10 years old to a youth contract. There's two kinds, YD10 and YD07. If you sign a YD10 then if you transfer academies the new club will need to pay compensation to the other club. The amount varies based on how much time you've spent there. Now for a big club like United, and for a player like Paul Pogba, 80,000 pounds is basically nothing. But even a few thousand pounds is too much for lower division teams. As I understand it Pogba signed a three year deal, which is not entirely uncommon for bright academy players who haven't proved themselves. Joshua Kimmich got a four year deal on his transfer to Bayern, and was only earning like 80k a year. Needless to say Bayern reupped his contract this year for a lot more and at the 5 year max because he's a stud. However Pogba got pissed off at United and refused to resign so ended up with Juventus paying compensation which I believe was only a couple hundred thousand pounds.

 

I agree, but if thats the case, trade him within the league or allow him to leave to Europe (if he has European interest). It does neither party any good to have him sitting on the bench. If "these problems" keep him from realizing his potential elsewhere, so be it. Petke should not be hurting his career though because of whatever issue there is between them.

What I don't like is when MLS teams operate on their own timelines without taking into account that they aren't the end game here for good young professional footballers. Not every kid will be able to play in Europe eventually, but for the talented ones, they could play in Europe eventually and they could really advance their footballing careers if they get a solid gig somewhere in Europe. It opens up so many more doors for them. MLS teams don't realize that, and think they have until like 23 or 24 to develop these players before some decision on their status at the club is made. I think that does a big disservice to these players. European teams stop taking up European interest in young Americans by that age. Its why you saw a player like K. Acosta traded to Colorado instead of transferred to Europe.

What would've been a good solution here is selling D. Acosta to Netherlands, Belgium, Sweden, Denmark, somewhere like that. He's good enough to play in those types of leagues and if those leagues are scouting MLS well, they'll see it as a very good buy low candidate. Instead, Acosta probably sits on the bench the rest of the season, and he's basically lost 3/4 of a season at an age he already needs to start thinking about leaving MLS.

 

That is actually what I was trying to say. Can a prospect stay in MLS without hurting his long term prospects? Will it impede his progress? Will it impede his chances of moving to Europe? Will it hurt him financially? etc. When those answers are shown to be "no", it will be huge for MLS. The best way to show that is with the second tier players. By second tier players I do not mean bad players but just not the elite of the elite. I would say a guy like Donovan, Dempsey etc would be the first tier. a guy like Beckerman, McCarty, etc would be the second tier. Acosta would be second tier and so would Wood.

Many of the players that have gone over to Europe have under performed (at least initially) in Europe. (Think Eddie Johnson). Very few have gone over and had an immediate impact. there will always be a few outliers (Donovan for instance) but they won't change the attitude toward MLS until the second level of players has that immediate impact.

 

Definitely. And it's especially frustrating as Glad and Lennon have both ranged from "OK" to "Good" but have kept their starting spots. Acosta was the one who had taken a big step forward in his game this year, and was one of the best left backs in MLS. Surely this can't go on much longer before Acosta publicly asks to leave.

 

Of course this is a situation that is entirely impossible to judge without inside knowledge. I seems pretty obvious that there is an issue between Acosta and Petke. Without knowing what is/was going on, we can only speculate. It can't be too serious because he has been on the bench...which begs the question what could be bad enough to reduce/eliminate playing time for such a long time without actually removing him from the game day squad.

 

Lewis not in NYCFC 18 again :/

Anyone else completely root for a team with US youth nationals / US players to beat the team that doesn’t?

For example I’m definitely rooting for Philly to beat NYCFC.

 

19yr old Mihailovic gets the start (surprisingly) for Chicago at 7:30.

 

He was a starter last year. Only returned last week from injury.

 

Yup I just thought he’d get time off the bench first before starting, but better for us of course.

 

A rare start for Marco Farfan vs. Kansas City.

 

Tyler Adams has been great the past few weeks

 

Mihailovic played 59 minutes in his return from a torn ACL.

Akinola hasn't played for TFC's first team in a couple of weeks. I don't understand why.

McKenzie was back in practice this week, but didn't make the 18. Might be about a week away from returning.

Lindsey has stopped playing recently. He hasn't played in three games.

Marcinkowski made the bench. Maybe he's getting close to a debut.

Toye is back from his loan and played 14 minutes. Pomykal somehow made the bench (no Colman or Akindele), and he was subbed in during stoppage time.

Didn't make the 18 today, but seems to be back. Maybe next week. He was actually getting some minutes before the injury. He ended up missing just under three months.

Victor Rodriguez and Handwalla Bwana will both be available though.

— Ari Liljenwall (@AriLiljenwall) August 16, 2018