World Cup 2018

Discussion in 'Brazil' started by omajac, Oct 10, 2017.

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Who will win World Cup 2018

  1. Germany

    11 vote(s)
    25.6%
  2. Brazil

    21 vote(s)
    48.8%
  3. France

    4 vote(s)
    9.3%
  4. Argentina

    1 vote(s)
    2.3%
  5. Italy

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  6. Spain

    1 vote(s)
    2.3%
  7. Russia

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  8. Other Team

    5 vote(s)
    11.6%
  1. samuel_clemens

    Dec 20, 2005
    Los Angeles CA
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    There's more to nationality than what jurisdiction you're born on. Balotelli for example identifies African first, italian second . So do most African Americans and many Africans around the world.

    btw lol @ "being French and not speaking a word of Spanish". They're basically dialects of the same language, Latin. Even before Rome conquered France the languages were mutually intelligible.
     
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  2. Doc_Exec

    Doc_Exec Member

    Jul 7, 2004
    I didn't say that. It was krakdol. You misquoted me. :p;)
     
  3. samuel_clemens

    Dec 20, 2005
    Los Angeles CA
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
  4. tpmazembe

    tpmazembe Member

    Jun 13, 2002
    The Midfield (S.Fla)
    #2379 tpmazembe, Jul 18, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2018
    I won't assume your intentions, but this post, and the discussion that followed, has caused me some discomfort. It's not clear if the post is celebrating the diversity of the team or denigrating France's claim to being WC Champions. What is fact is that the French Football Federation did not have to recruit these players. They were citizens from birth or arrived in France as infants (Krakdol’s post details this). It’s not at all like Diego Costa and Spain.

    Of all the forums to seemingly beef about the African origins/genetic make-up of a WC team, it puzzling and disappointing that it would pop up in the Brazil forum. As much as players of African descent and lineage have contributed to the success, beauty, and re-known of Brasilian futebol?!

    Perhaps some feel that these players can’t trace their “Frenchness” beyond a few generations? Do we feel that their families need to have been part of the culture for a century to be truly French? Then what do we make of the previous President Sarkozy --- birth name Nicolas Paul Stéphane Sarközy de Nagy-Bocsa. His father was Hungarian and his mother half-Greek. Three of his four grandparents where not French citizens. Was he French enough to be President? If we think not, then we are being consistent. However, if we accept that he is French enough to be President, or never bothered to question his claims to being French, then we should concede that these players are French.

    Let’s be frank. This really comes down to race. Society still has a mental picture of what a French person looks like. As Celito points out, societies change over time. What did the racial make-up of Brazil look like before the arrival of Cabral? When did the children of Japanese immigrants get to consider themselves Brazilian? I suspect that if all these players had the same immigration history (ie. when they or their families arrived in France) but were from the Baltics or Northern Europe we would not be discussing this at all.

    Full disclosure, my friends and I have discussed the ethnic and racial make-up of this team relative to the larger French population. However, we’ve done so in light of the gains and assimilation issues in French society; and especially in the face of a growing (but still minority) nationalist/nativist political movement. So, I am as guilty has anyone for being aware of this team’s makeup -- but I’ve never done it to minimize the French win or to denigrate the team’s authenticity. They are French.
     
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  5. Rac93

    Rac93 Member

    Bayern Munich
    Germany
    Sep 29, 2017
    weak
     
  6. Rac93

    Rac93 Member

    Bayern Munich
    Germany
    Sep 29, 2017
    this. The vast majority of your team isn't ethnically French. Even many of your Europeans don't have French names. Greizman et Hernandez
     
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  7. samuel_clemens

    Dec 20, 2005
    Los Angeles CA
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
  8. krakdol

    krakdol New Member

    PSG
    France
    Jul 18, 2018
    Most French people have ancestors from other countries. France is a migrant country and has always been due to geographical and economical conditions. We had spanish migration wave, italian wave, polish wave, portuguese wave, algerian wave...

    "Purely ethnically French" doesn't make sense, very few people are "ethnically 100 % French" in France.

    You're 100 % French if you're born in France, that's the way it is. That's what we call "la loi du sol", nothing else matters in France.

    We don't care about genes and ancestors, otherwise few people would be French (I wouldn't be), and as it was said above, even our former president Sarkozy wouldn't be French.
     
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  9. Rac93

    Rac93 Member

    Bayern Munich
    Germany
    Sep 29, 2017
    #2384 Rac93, Jul 20, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2018
    Yes many people in France are actually French. Macron, Le Pen, Giroud and Pavard are real frenchman.The French unlike some other nations have a very weak national identity proven by both your mindset and by the national football teams players. There are many Italians, Poles, Portuguese and Spaniards in France but because of similar cultures and the disastrous immigration from Africa and the Middle East they are pretty much considered French now. However names like Hernandez, Cantona and Valbuena are not French.
     
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  10. krakdol

    krakdol New Member

    PSG
    France
    Jul 18, 2018
    You're obviously racist so there's no point debating with you other than saying you're wrong.

    There's nothing disastrous with Africa and Middle East. I worked with multiple French people who had african genes, it was never a problem.

    They're just like you and me.
     
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  11. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    And before this continues, let me just say: no more post on this subject here. Even if it were worth having this discussion, and frankly it's not, this would not be the place for it.
     
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  12. omajac

    omajac Member+

    Feb 9, 2002
    East Orange, New Jersey, USA
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Yes let's put this World Cup to rest and hopefully find a way to strip Qatar of WC'2022!!!
     
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  13. celito

    celito Member+

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Wow ... DFB is a complete mess. Talk about fall from grace. At least in the public's eyes.
     
  14. omajac

    omajac Member+

    Feb 9, 2002
    East Orange, New Jersey, USA
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Now all they need to do is get rid of Lowe!!
     
  15. MerlinRM

    MerlinRM Member+

    May 5, 2014
    NorthEast USA
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Honestly, losing Ozil isn't as big of a deal as it would have been 4 years ago. His generation is nearing the end of their cycle. Give Lowe and co another 4-5 years and Germany's current youngsters will shape up to easily take over the mantle of the 2014 champs.

    As for Ozil and his reasonings, I don't doubt there is anti Turk/Muslim feelings towards him but he shot himself in the foot taking a picture with the Turkish dictator. I don't care his excuses. He knew what he was doing with the picture and who he was supporting. I do not feel sorry for him.
     
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  16. celito

    celito Member+

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    I agree Ozil was basically done anyways. But the whole thing was a mess and pretty mishandled and they are using him as a scapegoat.

    I am not familiar with Turkish politics, but to question his dedication on the field and allegiance to the team was completely out of line.
     
  17. ripalino

    ripalino Member

    Feb 26, 2013
    Sao Paulo
    Club:
    Fluminense Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Anyone wants this guy as our gk for qatar 2022 ? It will be hard to see that fking ball go past him. LOL
     

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  18. samuel_clemens

    Dec 20, 2005
    Los Angeles CA
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    #2393 samuel_clemens, Jul 23, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2018
    Erdogan is an Islamic supremacist who's been telling Muslims in Europe to ditch birth control so they can out-breed the native population. Yeah for someone that's supposedly a "German" like Ozil it doesn't look good to take a picture with someone like that. Whether you guys like it or not professional sports and politics are intertwined , now more than it;s ever been since WW2 .
     
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  19. celito

    celito Member+

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Yep. I see some of his quotes. Definitely questionable decision by Ozil. Not gonna assume what was going through his mind.
     
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  20. Ribo_2006

    Ribo_2006 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 13, 2006
    Uk
    I didn't even have to zoom in on the thumbnail to tell who it was. Nevermind as GK get him back on the pitch as the forward, el fenomeno, Mr spectacular, the master of destroying defences!
     
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  21. celito

    celito Member+

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Uruguay trashed Mexico 4 x 1 in Mexico ... well ... Houston :ROFLMAO:

    CONCACAF looking pretty bad at the moment.
     
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