Post-match: Vancouver Whitecaps FC - San Jose Earthquakes Knockout Round (Wednesday, 10/25) postgame thread [R]

yeah I really don't know about your pony fantasies, I just expect our team to be better. much better. who knows if this new crew (GM, coach, president) can change our fortunes, it's way too early to tell. and personally, this past season didn't exactly fuel my optimism and leave me brimming with confidence for the future. I'm always hopeful that the Quakes will get things turned around, but at the same time, skeptical. I don't see how anyone who's followed this team for the past 20+ year isn't.

 

Um 2001-2005 was pretty good, and had we not lost the team, would have been 2001-2007 at least. 4 championships and an SS in 7 years. That would have been the best run in MLS history.

The pony thing is about, we are clearly in a wait and see stage. So why whine incessantly about the past and how it is unlikely to get better? After a while it starts sounding like "I want a pony." How about waiting and seeing?

 

you're in a wait and see stage, I'm in a "show me the money!" stage. and losing the team and the 2 additional championships that you so astutely reference, was probably the starting point for my great skepticism. granted that has little to do with Lew Wolff and his cohorts, their legacy of failure speaks for itself and until they show me that they are in the soccer business to bring soccer glory to my beloved city, I will continue to vocalize my displeasure, as I believe it is the right and duty of all fans to do.

 

Again though I mean we get it by now. Geez! At some point it all starts to sound like "I want a pony".

 

On the other hand, as a fan of the game , I like seeing goals. At least there were 5 goals scored in our game but this 0-0-0-0 snooze fest between Seattle and Vancouver is putting me to sleep!


Danielle Slaton has a nice smile though....

Dempsey just scored so I guess that’s ok....

 

your bubbly naive optimism grates on me too sometimes, deal with it.

 

It's not "bubbly optimism", it's a balanced view, which in this generally negative forum only looks like optimism by comparison. And I'm actually providing some content, like my 6-point summary of Jesse's vision. Instead of whining how we never get a good DP I've brought up Vako production numbers so we can actually take an objective look at it, etc. Those are just a few examples. It is not the monochromatic whining I'm reading much of the time.

 

And I've said, maybe Vako ends up as a good DP signing, its too soon to know.

We're just some distance apart on where we see this team's progress, you're willing to be patient, take a wait and see approach. for me it feels like we've been practicing patience and taking a wait and see approach for ages. I'm ready for some results.

But I'm not trying to argue with you, "deal with it" was a bit harsh. you're perfectly well entitled to your bubbly optimism and I will try, out of respect for my fellow Quakes fan (you), to be a little less negative around here. no promises lol.

 

No worries. We are not yet done with our first full year since rebirth w/o Doyle. You will never execute on a vision if you don't have one to begin with. Now I think we have one so we have a chance. But as I said it's easy to say these things and much harder to actually make it happen. So if I'm optimistic it is guarded or cautious optimism. And I think Jesse is a little naive still. But we'll see if he can learn and adjust.

 

This requires a longer response then I really am up for at the moment, but I will try and make a simple response:

There is a difference between what you compete for on the field, and your decision making guidelines. You want your team to try and make the playoffs every year, and hopefully win an MLS cup, but when you make decisions you may make decisions that pay off more down the line at the expense of this year, and vice versa, based on your actual chance of winning.

So we should be looking to maximize our chance to win at 2019 and 2020 at this point, not 2018. Which doesnt mean we shouldnt try to improve our chance to win in 2018, just that we are better off aiming a bit further down the line. That doesnt mean you never make decisions intent on winning right now, you just need to understand when the right time is to do that. Teams with -21 goal differential and less then 50 points are not those teams.

 

Next season distilled - bringing in central defenders who can deal with a counter in the open field...overall quality players who can defend in a 3 or 4 man back line in an open game...massive priority if we want to play attractive ball...#$$$...need to spend some real money here.

Attitude...Attitude...Attitude.

Leitch and Jesse saw what they wanted to see during the mini run...that attitude will be the expectation for next season. I have faith they'll do what is necessary to enable that to happen.

Just those two things... prioritize D and attitude. Everything else will miraculously improve.

 

If you want a close, well contested match, you have to be careful not to have a referee assignment that will favor the already better team playing at home. With so few games being played...if the MLS wanted a chance for more entertaining game, they had options.

 

So, do you advocate that we cheat?

 

I'm advocating that we Trust the Process.

And, at risk of going down the political path this thread has taken, I'm a lifelong Democrat who did not vote for Trump and do not share his outlook on numerous issues but I've yet to see any evidence that he cheated to gain the White House or that his presidency is illegitimate in any way.

 

He may or he may not have "cheated" but it is well documented that a foreign entity influenced it or at least certainly tried. That is something about "the process" that needs to be addressed, to the extent that it can be. I would hope that we have bipartisan support / agreement on that.

 

Indeed. We experienced pain. We don't want to have that result again, so we're going to work hard to avoid it. That's really important.

Go Quakes!!
Stay Crew!!

- Mark

 

The 2016 election revealed vastly larger problems with "the process" than Russians buying a few facebook ads or engaging in comically ineffectual efforts to "hack" into election systems (for which there is no evidence a single vote was altered). An informed electorate (an oxymoron, I know) using old-fashioned ballots solves these over-stated concerns, but it's hard to have a meaningful election when there are only two choices, one of which is a buffoon and the other of which was forwarded via a rigged primary.

 

Apologies for bringing Trump into our wonderful politics-free discussion of why we need to suck less now and shaking off the disappoint of 5-0 to wrap things up. As much as I follow all the political bullshit (too much) it really nice to just talk soccer. Won't happen again.

 

We got to talk about something in the off-season.

 

I hear you compadre.

What gives me hope is this:
1. Leitch is not part of the Yallopian-Dystopian coaching tree.
2. Leitch has shown a tendency to experiment and try new things when the current thing isn't working. That's hugely different from Yallop and any of his disciples.
3. Jesse is a whole lot smarter than Doyle. Of course, we probably all have shoes that are smarter than Doyle, but Jesse is a lot smarter!
4. Jesse is willing to try things that are new to the Quakes!!
5. Scouts!! We have scouts!!

And no, I'm not taking anti-depressants or any other mind altering drugs for that matter. Same old Angry Mark. But my main anger points were firing Dom and starting with a fresh point of view. We've done that. Now it's time to see how well it works. We know that budget teams can be successful in MLS. We are a team that is more like middling in MLS spending right now, so that should give all of us some hope.

<virtual passing of joint>

Chill amigo! The sky is not falling. At least not right now. It's the off-season. Time to drink some good suds, enjoy the holidays, and dream of the coming season being successful!!

Go Quakes!!
Stay Crew!!

- Mark

 

F@#$ Dempsey!!

 

You both need to knock back some good whiskey and stop this nonsense.

It's the freaking off-season (albeit early) for us. There is nothing we can do but sit and wait.

We don't know how this will turn out. (Which is part of the addictive effect of sportsfandom.) So at the moment, we wait, we hope, and we keep our eyes peeled for news of us signing new players, re-signing old players, and ditching some dudes that aren't pulling their weight.

I recommend good bourbon or rye, perhaps in a cocktail? I like Manhattans, just sayin'.

Go Quakes!!
Stay Crew!!

- Mark

 

I decline to get into the politics right now (another shocking statement coming from me).

I do have hope, but I should also say that my patience is all but gone. We need a bang up off-season followed by real improvement on the pitch, out of the gate. Six to eight matches in we'll know what the season will look like. I do not want to see yet another season where we look like a pickup team the first eight or ten weeks. The off-season is for building a team and getting everything in shape, such that you hit the ground running. I want to see us hit the ground running. No excuses, no BS.

Go Quakes!!
Stay Crew!!

- Mark

 

I don't agree at all that the campaign of misinformation and fake news perpetuated by the Russians was ineffective. And we haven't even gotten to their role in hacked emails and their release. The ballot is simply the mechanism by which one registers one's choice. But there are many things that go into deciding who to choose. That's where the issue is.

There are other problems, sure, but I would not begin to diminish their role and the threat it imposes.