Post-match: USA-Panama, WCQ, October 2017

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by Dr. Gamera, Oct 6, 2017.

  1. soccerusa517

    soccerusa517 Member+

    Jun 23, 2009
    Ohio
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Johann Smith, wow there's an old name.
     
    HouseHead78 repped this.
  2. MPNumber9

    MPNumber9 Member+

    Oct 10, 2010
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Each of the bolded are pretty questionable. You might want to wait until Pulisic has a good performance against a team better than Panama to decide he's more intelligent, creative and a better finisher than Donovan, for instance (he sure didn't prove that versus Costa Rica). Round here people start vomiting blood if you dare play Pulisic anywhere but the middle, whereas Donovan killed on either wing and at striker / 10. It's going to be fun seeing Pulisic surpass LD in these areas, but he sure hasn't yet.
     
    TrueCrew, Mr Martin, wsmaugham and 4 others repped this.
  3. schrutebuck

    schrutebuck Member+

    Jul 26, 2007
    The point about playing Pulisic in the middle is true. In the prime of his career, Donovan would be moved around constantly to cover US weaknesses, and he was always the best US player on the field even if, for example, he was paired with a garbage fullback.
     
    wsmaugham, Marko72 and deuteronomy repped this.
  4. comoesa

    comoesa Member+

    Aug 13, 2010
    Christen Press's armpit
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Guzan and Howard are not good enough to domineer the 1 and 2 spots. Call up Horvarth and Hamid.
     
  5. comoesa

    comoesa Member+

    Aug 13, 2010
    Christen Press's armpit
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think Panama was just tactically setup the wrong way. We lucked out a bit
     
    TrueCrew repped this.
  6. matabala

    matabala Member+

    Sep 25, 2002
    These are NOT "facts". They are subjective opinions. I am sorry you don't know the difference.
     
  7. beerslinger23

    beerslinger23 Member+

    Jun 26, 2010
    Facts?

    CP in BL > LD
    CP in USMNT > LD is USMNT at age 19

    Those are facts we can start with.
     
  8. deuteronomy

    deuteronomy Member+

    Angkor Siem Reap FC
    United States
    Aug 12, 2008
    at the pitch
    Club:
    Siem Reap Angkor FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think we were all over them before they knew what hit em, much less had an opportunity to sort it out. Committing 5 attackers early was key.

    And I would offer that Arena's letter to the fans helped create an electric atmosphere that also contributed to the Panamanian's chaos. We knew exactly what we were doing and Panama couldn't deal with it.

    “In all my years with the national team, this is probably the most prepared I think the team has been, in terms of the work that the coaching staff put in,” said Jozy Altidore, who scored two goals and set up a third. “It’s a huge, huge A+ to them.

    “From Sunday, since the guys landed, they were showing video, pulling guys aside, making sure we were prepared for this game. They made us understand how important the game was to them. Kudos to Bruce and his team for preparing everybody.”
     
    Bajoro, orcrist and Pragidealist repped this.
  9. Iforgotwhat8wasfor

    Jun 28, 2007
    I guess it's a bit like watching a young Tiger Woods. You knew he was the greatest golfer you had ever seen, regardless of what the future would bring...

    This conversation would be a bit brighter if some would remember that while, like Donovan, we all hope Christian surpasses his achievements - it hasn't happened yet.
     
    WrmBrnr and tomásbernal repped this.
  10. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That's a very cautionary comparison. Tiger would have been the greatest ever but now can't stay healthy. Pulisic needs to stay healthy for a long period or me end up the best American ever for a short time. His club career seems destined to top any American ever but national team career will take a while to pass others. Health is key. Fingers crossed. Oh, and how about the other young guys turn out good to spread the hacking around some.
     
    jackiesdad and Winoman repped this.
  11. HouseHead78

    HouseHead78 Member+

    Oct 17, 2006
    Austin, TX
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Oh I know he was a liability, but he came through when it mattered the most. I just think he deserves some credit for that.

    Also, didn't he play a GC that completely destroyed his reputation? It was this match that people really got in a tizzy about.

    http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2014/03/17/14/03/us-men-fall-4-2-in-2011-gold-cup-final
     
  12. HouseHead78

    HouseHead78 Member+

    Oct 17, 2006
    Austin, TX
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's not like we scored undefended goals. Tactics aside, our attackers made great plays against their defenders, and we punished them. Pulisic burned their central defense and goalie on his first goal. Tactics would not have changed that. Then he burned their right side on the second in an isolation situation. Altidore made a great fake towards the near post and left his marker wondering what happened when he pulled far post. Those were not down to Panama's tactics. They were superior players beating inferior players and making it count when it mattered most. Wood beat like 4 defenders to earn his penalty. Don't know how Panama could claim they were tactically set up to fail there, either. They had the defenders there, they just got beat by the better, more aggressive player.

    I don't know why we can't just be happy that our attackers had a good day, we have to qualify it by claiming they got tactically lucky?
     
    50/50 Ball, adi21, deuteronomy and 3 others repped this.
  13. smokarz

    smokarz Member+

    Aug 9, 2006
    Hartford, CT
    I can't understand those claiming Panama was set up wrong, had bad tactics, they gave us the game. What a load of BS.

    Give credits where credits are due.

    Our players were much better, they were more prepared, they were hungrier, and they dominated. At least for the night.

    Yes, I have critique Arena and some players, but collectively they did their jobs really well this night and they deserved the win, handedly.
     
    MPNumber9 repped this.
  14. LouisZ

    LouisZ Member+

    Oct 14, 2010
    Southern California-USA
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    He was always a liability but he was BB's guy. Come to think of it, I don't think we had anyone besides him to play LB as a backup once Bocanegra was moved to LCB.

    The reason he came through during the 2010 WC is that when he did play he was never tested.
     
  15. LouisZ

    LouisZ Member+

    Oct 14, 2010
    Southern California-USA
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    In my opinion, they were going to defend and try their luck in the counter. That plan went out the window once Pulisic broke through so early in the game.
     
    Winoman and Bajoro repped this.
  16. CeltTexan

    CeltTexan Member+

    Sep 21, 2000
    Houston, TX USA
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Just arriving, so yeah, I got our U.S.A. U-17 World Cup games and our guys vs. Panama WCQ match mixed up! What did I miss???

    NO SHIT! THE BRUCE GOES AMERICAN 4-4-2 diamond with CP at the QB and we train wreck dem canaleros! MY MAN!

    VAMO' U.S.A.!!!
     
    WrmBrnr, MPNumber9, Geneva and 2 others repped this.
  17. Bajoro

    Bajoro Member+

    Sep 10, 2000
    The Inland Empire
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You may be right about that. But we did have a couple of decent chances even before CP's goal, even with Panama's defense pack in the penalty area. E.g., Wood would probably score that side-foot shot 2 out of 3 times.
     
  18. LouisZ

    LouisZ Member+

    Oct 14, 2010
    Southern California-USA
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    We definitely were hungry for the early score.
     
    Bajoro repped this.
  19. y-lee-coyote

    y-lee-coyote Member+

    Dec 4, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    I think Pulisic did okay against Costa Rica and even though it wasn't his day, he did play a role in most of our dangerous situations. If you want to compare the two we probably ought to have thread for that, but per numbers of caps Puli is slightly ahead of LD in G and A.

    The revisionist tendency is to forget the frustrating side of LD. It isn't like he was so transformational that he made us into a world power or anything. He did put us on the map and made us a dangerous team.

    Many of us have waited a very long time the one who shall come. The guy to take us to the next level. CP has a legitimate shot of being that guy.

    He has already demonstrated an ability to play at the highest levels to those who watch him at his club. He is not a superstar every single time on the pitch, but a poor performance from him is still a starter at a top half of the table in a top four league.

    The biggest edge I give LD is his tactical understanding of the game. His saving JK's bacon at the GC by talking him into a tactical adjustment was a thing of beauty and showed real class on the part of LD. I think Pulisic will close that gap some as he grows. I am not sure how to rate guile.

    I think if he stays healthy he could easily work his way into the BDO conversation. He basically went from our youth set-up to a top club, and within a year was so dominant he got an invite to train with the 1st team. He immediately became a part of the first team rotation and he was only played with the youth to keep him sharp. A year and a half later he is BL team of week and man of the week. He has over a dozen records to his name between BVB club, BL and CL. No American ever has done what he has done.

    We don't even know his ceiling yet. We do know that for the time being, as goes Pulisic so goes the USMNT. For a host of reasons this cycle the USMNT needs him to be at least as good as the GOAT.
     
    orcrist and Bajoro repped this.
  20. shnaggletooth

    shnaggletooth Member+

    Jun 23, 2002
    I guess, yeah, being able to do both things would be best, but that's not Pulisic, who, at least for now, is a dribbler who challenges defenders, not a player who uses empty space, i.e. Donovan.
     
    wsmaugham repped this.
  21. Amaru523

    Amaru523 Member

    Jun 22, 2016
    The Emerald City
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yes, I played soccer, I was starting GK for a nationally ranked high school team back in the day and I can tell you that our coach would've lit our asses up if we ever gave a half assed effort in an important game, something the U.S. has done a lot during this qualifying cycle and that's a big reason its been such a struggle.
     
    y-lee-coyote repped this.
  22. Bob Morocco

    Bob Morocco Member+

    Aug 11, 2003
    Billings, MT
    On second viewing Besler had a lot of great moments. His step and quick outlet to Wood started the play on Jozy's first and he made a bunch of similar plays.
     
    Suyuntuy repped this.
  23. chad

    chad Member+

    Jun 24, 1999
    Manhattan Beach
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Love it!

    We've been crappy and underprepared and unmotivated. But THIS time we worked hard. Love us!

    roar.

    Entitled babies.
     
  24. Bob Morocco

    Bob Morocco Member+

    Aug 11, 2003
    Billings, MT
    Also, any talk of Villafana or Nagbe having bad games was prewritten. At least with Nagbe there was one mishit pass to point to in the first half, no further observations needed.
     
    wsmaugham, Ironbound and chad repped this.
  25. dlokteff

    dlokteff Member+

    Jan 22, 2002
    San Francisco, CA
    I don;t know what the ********k is going on with the media. This is the biggest ********ingggg game we've had outside of the actual freaking world cup, yet it's one of the least reviewed games in my data set. WTF

    Anyway...

    Pulisic - 8.8
    Altidore - 8.3
    Wood - 7.9
    Yedlin - 7.3
    Arriola - 6.9
    McCarty - 6.5
    Bradley - 6.3
    Howard - 6.1
    Besler - 6.1
    Villafana - 5.9
    Nagbe - 5.9
    Gonazles - 5.8
    Bedoya - 5.5
    Dempsey - 5.3
     
    WrmBrnr, Mr Martin, Dr. Gamera and 7 others repped this.

Share This Page