US vs Canada May 8 in Winnipeg: Pre, during, post-game discussion

Ive seen her play a few times and I have yet to see her have a bad game. Anson Dorrance raved about her when UNC played West Virginia.

 

She has the all the goods. Speedy, fast, and strong. The scary thing is she is just a baby too, Wow!!

I am no Canadian, eh, but a strong defense gives any side a punchers chance against better competition. Players like her make Abby's old age shortcomings too big a hill for our offense to climb. Base formations are not nearly as important as tactics. If we want to possess thorugh the midfield we have to have the threat of beating you over the top to put the CB's on their backheels.

Abby is no threat for that, she is more of a slow moving post to bounce the ball off while our mids try and beat them to the second ball. I am not sure why we set up by formation to play fast boat tactics and then tactically put an aircraft carrier on the field?

I love Dunn. WE need that young lady on the pitch. I like her just fine as a RB, but if she can't take that spot, for whatever reasons, we need to find a spot on the ptich for her. Her crosses into the box were a bit off, but they were mostly put in a dangerous area.

After Abby, I mostly worry about us because of Pinoe. I think she is a Jekkyl /Hyde player. When she is up for it she is a phenomenal player, but she can be wretched at times. We really need her skillset, but we also need consistency. Maybe she will get dialed in for the WC and put together a run of top form for the WC, but if she doesn't who do we turn to for that role?

 

Well Kling helped Dunn out by passing really bad against Canada. Dunn like Kling are not really outside backs. Some one other than Krieger has step up to the position.

 

Morgan Brian is not a defensive midfielder, yet they keep playing her there.

 

Canada has taken 17 and 18 year olds and made them ready...and it's working. This has happened on numerous nat teams around the world at various degrees. Certain players may be ready, but with out a shot we will never know.

 

Many players played different positions than they are playing now on NT. Holiday and O'Hara were forwards. Krieger played outside midfield as a freshman in college, attacking center mid as a sophomore and junior, and center back as a senior, then played defensive midfielder for the U-21s. Player can make successful transition from one position to another even during their career on NT. Probably the greatest example is Fischer from Swedish NT who was converted to centre back after playing almost 100 caps as a defensive mid. By many she is now considered one of the best CBs in the world.

 

The problem with the Brian situation is if u lined Holiday, Lloyd and Brian up and asked someone to pick out the DM, Brian would be the last choice. U might find Brian playing holding mid paired with a destroyer type but she hardly looks like one to leave back there alone.

 

Posters on this forum. Go back and read through this thread. Every single player I mentioned at least one person if not more has said the player should be benched (and btw I'm not saying I'm innocent of this). I do find it amusing you try to disagree with me, but in the end agree with half the list. And you're just one of the posters on here.

 

Maybe... Sometimes she plays good, sometimes not. She only played at DM since January so I don't know if it's lack of abilities or lack of experience. Either way as I said before IMO they should play her at AM.

 

I dunno, Holiday looks like the last choice to me, and Brian the first.

I mean I get what you are saying, but Holiday does not have the defensive skill, and Lloyd does not have the discipline. Brian's looked pretty good there to me, for all that it isn't natural to her yet.

 

I'd rate her above Holiday too and amongst those three she is the one who's willing to sit back the most.

 

Well that's because here in this country we don't value the position like they do in Europe so we just plugin players who have been playing a different position for 20 years.

 

what?

dunn is an outside back.
she played outside back at the u17 wc.
she played outside back when we won the u20 wc in 2012
she has consistently played great outside back for the uswnt.
she may be a better outside back than krieger given time at the position.

kling is an outside back
she played outside back when we won the u20 wc in 2008
she is the outside back for the euro champions league finalists tyreso.

 

because they have to.

they don't have an older outstanding player on the starting team so they are replacing them with those 17 and 18 year olds who are better.

not true.

apart from the fact that player dev. is always a crapshoot, good players are being scouted all the time in college and club teams, and are being called in to the u14, u15, u17, u18, u20, & u23 teams all the time.

more importantly, in some respects, they are succeeding or failing as pros in the nwsl. if a player is ready, and is better than the wnt incumbent, they'll be seen and called in to prove themselves in a wnt camp.

we do value the positions. we just think that the player we move to that position has a higher upside than any of those currently playing the position.

just like they do in europe.

 

Maybe this belongs in another thread but I was wondering what the NWSL - and the play of Americans in overseas leagues -- have told us about how the national team should should be trying to play. What should our plan be, at least in the absence of Alex Morgan or allowing for the possibility she doesn't come back full strength for a long time?

The most obvious thing to me, focusing on forwards and mids and less on GKs and Ds is that the two most promising styles in the league right now are Seattle and Portland.

With Seattle, of course, much of the credit goes to internationals -- Little, Fishlock and Kawasumi -- but Winters has been very good as the DM in that system, Rapinoe showed she can run rampant in her one game, Leroux is OK and gets lots of dangerous chances in her role but maybe needs some time to adapt. No one claims Goebel is the answer for the national team but she plays effectively for Seattle.

KC features of course Holiday (Cheney) and Tymrak as their creative mids, A-Rod is fitting in rather well in the system and again you have one or two DMs doing a good job: Buczkowski most notably (though Richmond the rookie is adapting well even if no one puts her on the level of Desiree Scott before her).

Now I'm no expert but what I take from this is that a 5-mid system (perhaps specifically a 4-2-3-1) works well in NWSL and several American players work well within it -- although again with Seattle we have to keep in mind the key contributions of non-Americans like Little and Fishlock.

The US has to have a plan A without Baby Horse. We just don't know if she'll be back at full strength anytime soon and even then we won't know if her strike partnership with Wambach will be what it was two years ago.

The obvious thing to me is to look at what Vlatko and Laura Harvey are doing at KC and Seattle. The only obvious counter-arguments to consider are: we'd be too dependent on Holiday in the central attacking role (she isn't completely consistent or comfortable there) or that the level of NWSL play is misleading -- that there's reason to think that the players playing these systems well in the NWSL can't be expected to do it at the highest international level -- eg the DMs Buczkowski and Winters; Holiday in the middle of the attack. Or someone who can fill the lone striker role that Goebel and A-Rod perform for their clubs.

But without Morgan it seems increasingly clear that we can't build the game around Wambach anymore. Alex Morgan and her spectacular run of form masked the otherwise stagnant development of the national team, it seems to me.

Pia of course was pushing the team towards 4-23-1 until it became clear tht Morgan and Wambach had an incredible chemistry going.

We seem to have other players that fit some parts of the type of system being used at KC and Seattle: notably O'Reilly on the wing and Heath. There isn't anyone as effective as Little and Fishlock in their roles; Tymrak being the closest one to come to mind. Can Lloyd or Long fit the role well enough if Tymrak is too inconsistent? Or,as I said earlier, are we just too dependent on Holiday in the middle of that system?

 

We don't think... we know! And the reason why we KNOW is because we are not putting enough effort into developing these types of players so they KNOW that they are better off changing someones position. This has to change and it has to start at the youth level. There is a reason why we have so many world class strikers and it isnt because of the water here.

 

The whole point brought up by Koalabear, is that the NT shouldnt have to go back
to the Morgan "once again making Abby relevant" style of play. This will get them nowhere this next WC.
Ask Anson Dorrance how it worked out when he moved the older players out, and younger
players in, before the M&M world cup. Mia Hamm was 16, and I believe she turned out pretty
good.

 

Play Lloyd at DM and move Brian forward and let her play make or play Holiday at DM and do the same. Either way gives u a better presense at DM and gives Brian to at least do something she is familiar with.

 

The system was broken before Morgan appeared and she was the bandaid. If they hand an offensive system the could plug players in and out it would still work like a clock. Instead they create offense by creating mistakes and hoping their players can make great shots. The truth is most players on the US team don fit soccer culture wise. They r great at creating for themselves but less so for their team mates and because of that their team mates dont work as hard getting open.

 

lets leave outside mid position to VERY creative players, not just players who are able to pass a ball or keep possession. Also it seems to me like creative players are those who are not very big or tall, just look at heath rapinoe tymrak, all are in 5 "7 area and not built like brooks. they just seem more creative. Outside mid has to be a playmaker, someone that does something that is not predictable and throws the defence off. those people are Kim Little, fishlock, rapinoe, heath, tymrak, sophie shmidt. to me oreilly does not seem to be creative enough so i feel like she will be better as an outside back, she is almost like krieger, run the ball down and then make a cross into box

 

i think you quoted the wrong person, i did not write that

 

i think you quoted the wrong person, i did not write that