Townhall Notes

Discussion in 'Philadelphia Union' started by Ruud11, Aug 9, 2017.

  1. djramone

    djramone Member+

    Jan 14, 2006
    Pennsylvania
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Actually, we don't have to sit through any more of it, and judging by the lack of sell-outs and the # of empty seats in the River End, many are choosing not to.
     
  2. thomas19064

    thomas19064 Member+

    Apr 29, 2008
    Delco
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    @Boyertown2003 should just use this thread as an outline for his next podcast
     
  3. lopezzzz

    lopezzzz Member

    Jun 28, 2011
    Philadelphia
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Agreed. Ownership is wise to protect us from the danger of DPs.
     
  4. Dills

    Dills Moderator
    Staff Member

    Philadelphia Union
    United States
    Jun 6, 2006
    Southampton|PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    [​IMG]
     
  5. mattylip

    mattylip Member+

    Philadelphia Union
    Jul 22, 2011
    Cherry Hill (127, D)
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Only one of those guys is still in MLS.
     
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  6. Starpork

    Starpork Member+

    Nov 12, 2013
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    #56 Starpork, Aug 10, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2017
    Okugo and Jack were also central to that plan.

    Actually in retrospect after that season was maybe the time I felt most confident that the team was getting on track. That's when Edu, Nogs, and Maidana showed up to fix our terrible midfield and Sak looked like he had a plan for a hot second.
     
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  7. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Then M'Bohli.........
     
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  8. mattylip

    mattylip Member+

    Philadelphia Union
    Jul 22, 2011
    Cherry Hill (127, D)
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And look where Jack and Okugo are now. Neither is a starter. The point is that "developing youth" may not be the best way to operate in MLS. It's not like these guys suddenly are going to get significantly better.
     
  9. celt1997

    celt1997 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jan 31, 2006
    Philly Burbs
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That really is the question at the end of the day. We can develop all we want, but I can't image that BSFC is developing skills at a level/tenacity to compete with players who are cutting their teeth in other lower levels around the World. And our MLS competition? Guess where they are getting their players from?

    ETA: And the Academy? I can imagine they can develop a fair amount of talent. However, IMO, kids coming through the Academy aren't doing so with the intention to go to MLS.
     
  10. LimeTree

    LimeTree Member+

    Oct 22, 2007
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Not to mention that this idea of "developing players" assumes some sort of linear progression. Except, for every Kellyn Acosta, there are plenty of Zach Pfeffers getting their MBAs.

    So what's worse: our sporting director being enough of a rube to actually believe the things he's saying, or him just talking to us as if we are?
     
  11. Handsome Pete

    Handsome Pete Member+

    May 16, 2011
    Minneapolis
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Did he beat that domestic charge? The pun wasn't intended, but I'll go with it.
     
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  12. LuckyStriker

    LuckyStriker Member+

    Favorite club? a German one..........
    Apr 14, 2010
    in exile-Statute of Limitations yet to expire
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm just excited to hear they're not necessarily looking for big or fast players either.........
     
  13. CITY&UNION

    CITY&UNION Member

    Oct 23, 2011
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    I wonder if we all should start contacting the team looking for a contract. I don't think any of us are necessarily good, big, or fast players, but I'm sure we'd be good in the locker room.
     
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  14. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with this. The Union lost out on this player due to MLS' roster restrictions.

    The whole issue of Solidarity payments that has been in the news are basically a greedy cash grab by the the already pay to play clubs who are realizing that their gravy train is running out with the growth of of the sport, MLS, and MLS' mostly free* academies.

    *DCU's academy is pay to play
     
  15. CITY&UNION

    CITY&UNION Member

    Oct 23, 2011
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    That's part of it, but he also left for free because of what @Kevin1813 is saying. It's happened before with Steffen, Barbir, Arriola at LA (I think?), and numerous other players. If the Union were in any other part of the world, they would've gotten some compensation for Steffen, Barbir, and now Dos Santos (the goalie that everyone's referring to) since they were a member of their youth academy.

    The problem is twofold:

    1. roster spots in certain instances handcuffing teams from promoting players early
    2. no formal tie to the youth club which results in a transfer fee if the player moves to Europe.

    The second issue however, isn't as black and white for US scoccer and MLS as one may imagine. It allows them to poach the best talent from area clubs for free, but they lose out when clubs abroad are able to do the same thing.
     
  16. Starpork

    Starpork Member+

    Nov 12, 2013
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    I, for one, feel like I read the game well and have a keen sense for opportunity.
     
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  17. drewuke

    drewuke Member+

    Jul 19, 2012
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Being a Union fan during that time, I understand how terrible things must have been and how far we have come since then. But saying that, those aren't valid reasons for why we didn't have a competent backup striker or CB in 2016, or a number 10 in 2017.

    The Union are building well, but are completely ignoring the now. Which is I don't expect things to change anytime soon.
     
  18. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Steffen left because of M'Bohli, MacMath, Blake, and oh that little thing of not offering him a contract......because Nick Sak felt he wouldn't sign anyways....

    Barbir didn't have enough time with the academy to be considered for a HGP contract at that time. One thing they all have in common though is that they were all 18 or older when they left. Which they are free to do at that age. FIFA rules prevent them from leaving beforehand, unless they are nationals (dual citizenship) of the country of the club they would like to move to.

    LA offered Arriola a contract, but he declined. This is why DCU had to fork over a stack of $$$ to LAG in order to sign him.

    One thing I take issue with is when Clubs such as SKC place an HGP claim on players such as Josh Sargent even when they haven't played for their academy, or pull the shenanigans they did that prevented Rosenberry from being signed to a HGP contract. The expansion teams signing "Home Grown" players to contracts when those players clearly weren't developed in their academies but play for a club that is "affiliated" with them for a hot minute. IMO it gives them an unfair advantage. And yes I realize the Union did this in the beginning with Pfeffer, Hernandez and McLaughlin. Though at that time MLS Academies were largely in their infancy and the rules were very vague then.
     
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  19. CITY&UNION

    CITY&UNION Member

    Oct 23, 2011
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Fair, so my examples were terribly inaccurate haha. Still, there are plenty of players that either left for free, or there was the threat that they would leave for free. It has the potential to get worse as the academies get better.
     
  20. stammer

    stammer Member

    Apr 10, 2011
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Hold on one sec.

    I thought for years the Union have been saying that while they haven't been spending millions on players, they WERE spending millions (https://www.si.com/planet-futbol/2017/03/03/2017-mls-ambition-rankings) on their academy.

    If that's true, on what possible basis do we think the academy will start performing any better?

    It's great that guys like Trusty are being signed, but if they can't even beat out a fourth round pick and a guy who hasn't played in two years to make the field, are they actually getting the proper coaching to make it on the field? At what point do you expect these players to actually contribute to the first team, and impacting wins, which I thought was the ROI?

    It's been seven years and not one academy player has turned into a regular started for the Union.

    Having followed since 2010, I'm starting to have less faith in the academy than I do Ernie Stewart's free agency signings.
     
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  21. CITY&UNION

    CITY&UNION Member

    Oct 23, 2011
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Not an Earnie apologist by any means, but things with the academy do take time. YSC opened in 2013, so it'd be 5 years (next year) from the opening that I'd expect to see some results...allowing a player to go through the school from 8-12. Training twice a day every day will do a lot for someone's development if they have the right coaching. It's going to be even longer before we see players that have gone through the academy from start to finish.

    I would argue initial impressions of Pfeffer, Hernandez, Mclaughlin vs. Jones, Fontana, Samuel (haven't gotten a chance to see Real or Trusty yet) are night and day, although things are a little muddied with the hindsight of seeing how the former three turned out. Jones, Fontana, and Samuel were too old to start with the Union as a U12 so the expectation is that the players coming out of the academy will get better and better since they'll have structured and professional training for longer.

    On the flip side I echo what a lot of other people are saying that it's all fine and dandy IF the academy pans out, but you can't guarantee that it will. As much as executives in MLS love to talk about their dream 11 full of academy players, only a fool will expect that to happen. The more realistic expectation is that the academy will supplement your talent acquired from outside with 2-3 starters and a few depth players. Also, I'm not sure you can expect the talent from the academies to progress as quickly as the talent of the league has progressed over the years. We're not going to all of a sudden start churning out Allesandrinis or Giovincos on a regular basis when right now you can't even expect Kelyn Acostas on a regular basis.

    Finally with all that I've just said, it's totally bush league to try to tread water with cheap sub-par talent while we twiddle our thumbs waiting for the academy to produce something amazing. And Earnie's goals of 1.produce talent for the national team and 2.in Earnie's fifth year to be a regular playoff team and OCCASIONALLY make a deep playoff run means they aren't trying to win, and this should insult any fan of the team.
     
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  22. Ruud11

    Ruud11 Member

    Dec 2, 2009
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    He actually did not say that but he talked a lot about wanting to be like Real Sociedad and Ath Bilbao if I recollect correctly (contrary to being like Real Madrid and Barcelona). Based on that I concluded what I wrote previously.
     
  23. LimeTree

    LimeTree Member+

    Oct 22, 2007
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    So, winning jack shit?
     
  24. LuckyStriker

    LuckyStriker Member+

    Favorite club? a German one..........
    Apr 14, 2010
    in exile-Statute of Limitations yet to expire
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    Not me. I'm too old and my knees are gone. As I prepare to depart y'all, the thing that intrigues is simply trying to decipher, by process of elimination, what kind of player they actually ARE looking for.......
     
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  25. Phillyspur

    Phillyspur Member+

    Tottenham Hotspur
    England
    Mar 18, 2007
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    But are you local?
     
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