The Worst Ballon D'or Winner

Funny, every time one transposes the criticisms of Ronaldo to Messi the idea suddenly becomes ridiculous.

Dude, I'm talking about the 2012 year, not the year its awarded in. Madrid won the league in 2012.

 

Damn, that is some serious deflection work!

You said none of the 92 goals meant anything. But included in those 92 were 2 against Real Madrid and numerous others within the context of the 2012-13 La Liga season which Barca ultimately won (which therefore means something by your definition).

 

You wasn't the only one. For ex. Balague (who is not tied to camp Ronaldo) thought so:
http://www.skysports.com/opinion/story/0,,12087_8304752,00.html

But whoever deserved the 2012 award, in the greater picture neither is an outrageous call. 2012 doesn't stand out against other years.

 

Neither CR nor Messi that's for sure.

Good post about Sammer. I think if voting for non-Europeans would be more established at the time Ronaldo would have won it. Litmanen's fine too.

Matthews is odd. But it's the first one, different times, likely different criteria.
Belanov won the Ballon D'or but not the Soviet player of the Year award. Quite obvious that media at home watched Belanov and Zavarov more closely than the non-Soviet voters did, who based their decision on the CWC performance.

 

That's correct: Year 2012 = season 2011-12 + Euro2012

In liga 2011-12 + UCL : Messi 64goals/48games > CR7 56goals/48games
But adding Euro2012: CR7 3goals+1as and among All STar team Euro2012 he has an extra bite to Messi

So in 2012: overall either Messi or CR7 or Inietsa (best Euro player) can win ... I think (or very close between)

 

No deflection, just truth. Remember when Ronaldo scored 11 in 4 games and they were all meaningless? Then the next season when Messi was banging in meaningless goals to score 50 after being eliminated they were somehow important again? Your camp set the rules for meaningless vs valuable. I guess that's why you guys get to conveniently choose which ones are.

Now again, 3 goals in the Euro have much more significance than friendlies vs youth squads for example. That was a year of stat padding if there ever was one. Obviously some of them had significance but on the whole? Nah, you must be one of those people that finds value in each of his 5 goals vs Leverkusen.

"Well this could have happened" and "it was only 4-1 at that point" "It was only the 30th minute and they cou".....

 

As I said, "importance is determined at the time of the goal/match, not in hindsight." Ronaldo's 11 goals in 4 games were meaningless at the time in which they occurred.

So no double-standard on my part. You OTOH need to work on your consistency.

Also not sure why you keep mentioning int'l friendles that year (more deflection, I guess). World cup qualifying was already in full swing and Messi scored many meaningful goals against good NTs.

 

I never understood this TBH. Sure they were meaningless for Real Madrid but not the teams he was playing against. IIRC, he played 2 teams that were still fighting for Europe and 2 teams fighting not to be relegated. Not sure how that can be logically discounted. It is still just as impressive.

 

Factually incorrect.

Messi didn't play any games for Argentina in 2012?

Also euro 2012 wasn't a roaring success for CR7. For someone that criticizes Messi's 2014 WC, you are also being a bit inconsistent. While both got some winning goals against medicore opposition, Ronaldo against Spain was similar to Messi v Germany (choked on a good chance to win it late). And CR7 was non-existent/poor in 3 of the 5 games overall.

 

Ronaldo plays for Madrid, thus meaningless. We can ague how impressive it is, that's fair.**. But we were specifically discussing the importance of goals for his team (edgarAllen set the context of the debate, not me).

**. And similarly we can argue how impressive it is to score a 90th minute goal against Brasil which was a pure solo effort.

 

Fair enough but most of CR7 and Messi's goals are 'meaningless' to begin with. That doesn't take away from the fact they are impressive and still should be rightfully lauded. CR7's 11 goals contributed to him breaking the Pichichi record on top of it. Not meaningless on a personal level.

For the record, I see your point but I'm just raising these points as I saw this 'meaningless' statement tossed around a lot as if to discredit Ronaldo's personal achievement which I never understood.

 

Exactly, Ronaldo's hat tricks are all 'meaningless' but Messi's 5 goals vs Leverkusen were vital. Same with his 4 goals that year vs Valencia and 3 against Switzerland. He scored tons of stat padding goals that year. Now his fans are all defensive saying you have to evaluate them at the time they are scored. So ridiculous.

I hope Ronaldo scores 74 this year and breaks Messi's record so we can dig up the archives and compare the differences.

 

Well yeah, some Messi supporters go over board with the importance of those Leverkusen goals. Only some of those five goals were truly meaningful.

Anyway, you are now fully wound-up and resorting to hyperbole so I guess this discussion is over.

 

Ronaldo hit the post 4 times at the Euro. Literally centimeters from being a 7 goal tournament more than doubling the next highest scorer which by Bigsoccer standards would have been a major success. As well, more were saved and some he was just off frame. So easy to say, he only had 3 goals, he sucked, choked...etc. A few inches in his favor and he could have possibly been remembered as having had one of the greatest Euro performances ever. On another day, he probably scores 2 or 3 of those chances against Denmark and 1 or 2 vs Spain. I don't need those 4 or more goals to tell me anything I don't already know and those shots going in rather than banging off the post would have done nothing to change his performances.

His level of play would have been the same, so quite literally, people would have propelled the tournament he had into greatness with a matter of inches working in his favor. That's why I put very little credence into International Tournaments as a whole.

 

What hyperbolic statements did I make? Read the majority of comments here and at any publications website comments section after a Ronalo hat-trick. They are always meaningless.

And Ronaldo scoring 74 is in no way hyperbolic, he's on pace for 374 isn't he?

 

On the other hand you're trying too hard

 

The bolded part perfectly defines the mind of a deluded fanboy.

Everything you said there is true for Messi at World Cup 2014 too. When Messi has near-misses he is "0-for-40" but when Ronaldo has near misses its "he came close enough that in my mind it was the greatest Euro performance evah!!!11!"

You are the most inconsistent poster I've seen in some time.

 

Eh ok...

Everyone knows who the deserved winner for 2012 is, and the exceptionally big gap between the winner the runner-up in the voting shows that, as well.

 

2012 was a year of champions and it was won by loser, someone who completely bottled both a champions league knockout tie and la liga title decider, in the same week iirc. He did not win the UEFA award for best player. But alas, I don't see why anything after 2009 is eligible for this thread anyway.

 

I don't even know what this means. Did leagues around the world re-format things to have two champions each that year?

Damn, bizarre arguments are raised when Messi-haters emerge from there den.

 

Why would my comment even imply that? I was referring to it being a major international tournament year, and in addition to that there was a standout champion in la liga and it wasn't messi.

 

Well, there's a major int'l tournament in 75% of years so 2012 is nothing special. World Cup matters a lot for Ballon d'Or votes, others not so much since its a global award. On top of that, there were no standout performers among the Euro champions. Same is true for the winners of the only global int'l competition that year - the Champions League.

 

I vote this guy. He was obviously great during the elimination rounds of the WC but nothing else to show for apparently other than being prolific during the early stages of the 1982-83 European Cup. In addition to what you said already I would add that one of those 3 goals during the first half of the 82-83 season was a pk and that if the DbsCalcio rates are any kind of indicator his level was ordinary. Plus, he played with Italy 3 more games after the WC duirng 1982, a loss and two draws all held in Italian soil (Rossi did not score goals).