The Trump Presidency Nein: Leistung, Korruption und Lugen

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by Cascarino's Pizzeria, Jun 26, 2019.

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  1. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I oppose it for policy and political reasons.

    As to the first, they're getting paid in cash and not paying federal taxes. Also, you're going to have some medical tourism if that's our policy.

    As to the second, I don't want Democratic candidates up and down the ballot having to defend single payer for undocumented residents.
     
    M repped this.
  2. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I was asking him why he's opposed to undocumented residents qualifying.
     
  3. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The spirit of the question was whether or not undocumented residents should qualify for health care. I realize that's a politically risky stance and easy to leverage against us, but it's the right thing to do.

    Are you sure that those people are all getting paid in cash?
     
    luftmensch, M and taosjohn repped this.
  4. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    "Awkward and clunky?"

    And if people think "it means no other options," they aren't smart enough to come in out of the hail, let alone rain...
     
  5. Hayaka

    Hayaka Member+

    Jun 21, 2009
    San Francisco North Bay, Bel Marin Keys
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Denmark
    The question in the survey doesn't spell out that your private insurance would no longer exist. I think the poll result would be quite a bit different if that was made clear. In fact, the survey admits that is the case.

    "KFF polling also shows many people falsely assume they would be able to keep their current health insurance under a single-payer plan (Figure 13), suggesting another potential area for decreased support especially since most supporters (67 percent) of such a proposal think they would be able to keep their currenthealth insurance coverage (Figure 14)."
     
    M repped this.
  6. Dr. Wankler

    Dr. Wankler Member+

    May 2, 2001
    The Electric City
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    I also think it's the right thing to do, but as a people, we're just not that generous, which is why I think it would benefit Trump more than it would a Democratic candidate.
     
  7. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    All? No.

    I never like to give out too much personal info on the internet, but given the particular circumstance of my family, I second-hand know a pretty good number of undocumented people, and they get paid in cash (or checks.)

    You can either trust me on that or not, but that's my base of knowledge.
     
  8. chaski

    chaski Moderator
    Staff Member

    Mar 20, 2000
    redacted
    Club:
    Lisburn Distillery FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Turks and Caicos Islands
    WRONG!

    [​IMG]
     
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  9. song219

    song219 BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 5, 2004
    La Norte
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Vanuatu
    I've know a good number of American citizens who have worked a decade plus off the books and have never paid taxes. My grandfather now dead for roughly 25 years I'd guess never paid taxes.
     
    xtomx repped this.
  10. Dr. Wankler

    Dr. Wankler Member+

    May 2, 2001
    The Electric City
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    "to" and "the" need to be crossed out to really nail the reference.
     
    sitruc repped this.
  11. JohnR

    JohnR Member+

    Jun 23, 2000
    Chicago, IL
    Sure, there's more to be said on the subject. Including by Democrats, who as yet haven't had the opportunity to argue why people shouldn't be worried that private insurance would cease to exist, because the discussion hasn't yet reached that stage.

    I mean, you might ultimately be correct, it could be that eliminating private insurance proves to be a nonstarter, and that Democrats need to modify their proposal. But I don't know if that will be so, not until the discussion develops further.
     
    Hayaka repped this.
  12. JohnR

    JohnR Member+

    Jun 23, 2000
    Chicago, IL
    My brother did for 20 years. He wouldn't be eligible for the government health plan, not if the Dems structure it correctly, because that plan would be for people who are on the grid, not off it.
     
  13. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So?
     
  14. song219

    song219 BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 5, 2004
    La Norte
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Vanuatu
    It means that limmigration status shouldn't be a qualifier, payroll taxes paid should.
     
  15. Kazuma

    Kazuma Member+

    Chelsea
    Jul 30, 2007
    Detroit
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Remember, this is a country that elected our current President. One of the reasons being was the perception of him being a good businessman. Thanks to a book from the 80s and a TV show. There are also people who think the ACA and Obamacare are two different things.
     
  16. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    We're talking over 11 million people. I've known quite a few people who are/were undocumented at some point, and many of them had regular jobs.

    Most undocumented residents have been here for years.
     
    Sounders78 and luftmensch repped this.
  17. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    The real key is not to leave them as undocumented - its the creation of an illegal, undocumented, uninsured, exploited workforce that causes the problems in the first place.
     
  18. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    This is why I think Merkel was correct during the refugee crisis. Better to get everyone in and documented. Then decide what to do with different groups of people.

    What is bad is allowing 1m undocumented people to exist in a grey market.
     
  19. Hayaka

    Hayaka Member+

    Jun 21, 2009
    San Francisco North Bay, Bel Marin Keys
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Denmark
    Mmm, Bernie is already there, and Warren may be as well. Harris has been somewhat ambiguous about it.

    https://thehill.com/policy/healthca...alth-insurance-companies-should-be-eliminated
     
  20. JohnR

    JohnR Member+

    Jun 23, 2000
    Chicago, IL
    Hmmm. What I meant was that we are at the early stages of discussion on the topic. People initially are positive about the Dem proposal Medicare for all, then are less positive when they are informed by the Republican rebuttal that they can't have their private insurance any more. We know that much. What we don't know is how they will feel when the Democrats respond to the Republican rebuttal. We're not there yet ... very few people would know that third item. I certainly do not.
     
  21. Hayaka

    Hayaka Member+

    Jun 21, 2009
    San Francisco North Bay, Bel Marin Keys
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Denmark
    Okay, fair enough.
     
  22. song219

    song219 BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 5, 2004
    La Norte
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Vanuatu
    I'm surprised I've not seen health insurance pushback against this. I don't remember a single commercial against Medicare for all.
     
  23. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    There is quite an air of unreality to the media coverage when the GOP has no plan other than to steal coverage for millions of people
     
  24. JohnR

    JohnR Member+

    Jun 23, 2000
    Chicago, IL
    Good point. You'd think the insurers would want to get ahead of the curve on this, since the idea is being taken seriously enough to receive support from major Presidential contenders.
     
  25. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    Such early days - i guess they will save their money until a clearer threat emerges, and it is clear who they want voters to prefer
     

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