The Official John Doyle thread

HOLY! TEAR ! My hopes and prayers were answered. Dude, John D is going to be wonderful. I'm in dyer need of a mullet..... Was there any other canadites (sp?)?

He was my first pick (as well as a lot of other peoples)

~eMTi~

 

Welcome John.
But what does this mean for Agoos? There was speculation he would become a player coach, thereby eliminating some of his salary from the cap. Will our captain be back?

 

Ok, now that it's official, can we PLEASE get Jeff Agoos signed? I kept thinking that the reason Jeff didn't already sign the contract was the possiblity that he could become an assistant (and the Quakes could afford more money for him because some of it wouldn't apply to the cap). We now know he's NOT going to be an assistant, so finish the deal SJ.....

 

*sigh*
I have to admit....Im not much of a JD fan. Never have been, really.
Howeve,r I am very happy that Dom got an assistant that he is friends with, and somebody from around here that knows about Quakes soccer. I hope he does an awesome job. Maybe my mind will change about him...who knows.

Until then, I'll just not say anything negative.......*lips are sealed*

 

I am of the opinion that Goose won't be signed, but that this will open sufficient headroom in under the cap to retain Ekelund. I think there is no way that Goose is gonna take a cut from MLS max, and there's no way that we're gonna pay that for him at this point.

 

"In addition, Doyle serves on the Board of Directors for U.S. Soccer and is the Technical Director of the Super Y-League ODP programs. He holds an “A” coaching license from the U.S. Soccer Federation."

So, he's licensed, connected, and involved in youth soccer. If, as Kinnear said, the asst. position is going to be a scouting position, Doyle seems well suited for the job.

Tony

 

Does that mean that Doyle gets to keep his $120,000-a-year job as head of coaching at Mustang Soccer in Danville?

 

So who made more, Steve Sampson when he was technical director of that Southern Cal youth soccer program or Doyle?


Tony

 

Just some random FYI...John Doyle is my brother in-laws cousin. Cool, huh?

Well...I think it is even if some of you don't!

 

The season's almost over, so I want to know what Doyle has brought to the table as assistant coach. The biggest reason he was advocated to become the assistant was scouting. Has he helped us in that department? Has anyone seen him at the local college games checking out the talent?


I was very nervous about his selection to the Quakes. I still feel that it was the wrong move. He's too close to Kinnear for my book. Besides Lindsey, I've also read at least 2 other posters who felt he was a terrible youth team coach. I really wanted Kinnear to succeed Yallop, but I feel he screwed up big time by not chosing Agoos as player/coach.

This is what living dead boy said about Doyle when he was hired:

You still feel that way? What improvement do you see? What players has John mentored?

 

I think we have to be careful to not be like that guy who wrote in on a Yallop thread a while back blaming DCU's 2000 season on Yallop because Yallop was Rongen's assistant. Having written that, I think Jeff is raising some pertinent questions.

I don't know the answer to any of the questions, but I fail to see how the equation [(poster's opinion) poor youth coach = poor pro coach] really makes sense.

Also, what young players have been available for Doyle to mentor? Starting with Roner, what young defender hasn't been hurt?

Doyle isn't the one doing the substitions; he's not the one setting the starting lineup or the philosophy of play.

I don't believe abandoning a successful philosophy is the way to go, but some of the players may need to move on. Ajax didn't dump their youth system or playing philosophy just because they got dumped out of the Champs League early last seaon.


One has to hope that, after next year's situation has been resolved, Amanpour/Lalas, whoever will sit down and evaluate all areas of the team. In sports management logic, its better to trade/get rid of a player one year too early rather than one year too late.

Tony

 

I don't have the sources some of you guys have, but I had an interesting talk to someone in position to have a good perspective on this. And he thinks Doyle is a problem.

He said that DK under Yallop was active--running drills, talking to players, getting involved, while Yallop stood back, took everything in and made the over arching decisions. This is essentially the normal, standard Head Coach/Assisitant Coach division of labor.

However, DK is still running practices and drills like he was an assistant and Doyle basically hangs back and does very little. In other words, Doyle is not acting like an assistant coach and is not taking tasks off DK's hands. This does not free up DK to acutually be the head coach. The result is a leaderless, undisciplined team. This source thinks DK can be a good headcoach, but he will ahve to dump his buddy Doyle who considers the Quakes a part time job.

 

Tony,

I don't know squat, because I'm living in Quakes exile.

What I can see is that the team doesn't come out fired up every match. Clearly, there is something amiss. Also, we aren't changing our lineup when we have a problem and the problem doesn't get corrected after a match or two. I'm not sure what JD's role would be in that area, but certainly I would expect him to watch film with DK and say: "Hey, x isn't working very well. We need to do something about that."

So perhaps your sources are right.

LONG LIVE THE QUAKES!!

- Mark

 

Tony in Q-land: very interesting report, thanks.

Makes me rethink some of what I wrote.

Tony

 

The only thing we had to go on before this season was JD's resume. Former player (and a good one, team captain, ect). An "A" license (shows us he has "head knowledge" of the game). Youth team coach (here's the telling one to me. Does he truly have teaching skills? It's one thing to know what your team is suppose to do, it's another to train them to do it.)


If Doyle can't "connect" with youth players, are you sure he can connect with professionals?

My understanding of the way Yallop and Kinnear worked was Frank worked on tactics and preparation for opponents while Dominic was busy helping guys like Walker and Alvarez make the adjustment to the pros. He got lots of props for Walker's development last year from Frank.

So, who exactly is benefitting from Doyle's tuteluge? Is he teaching Cochrane how to grab jerseys when he's beaten?

Young defenders - Dunivant, Cochrane, Dombrowski, Hart (to an extent)

Do you see improvement?

 

I just never understood why you would bring in the one guy who personified the pre-Yallop era.

He was a tall defender who was good in the air. But I don't think you can teach young defenders to be tall.

There are so many other players from that era who played a much more modern or sophisticated game. I still wish they had made Goose the assistant.

That said: I have no insider knowledge of whether he's done his job well. Maybe he has. But I bet you won't find any MLS clubs clamoring to sign him away from the Quakes next year.

 

Well, if Cochrane is a metric for Doyle, John hasn't done a good job. For someone who has the tools, Cochrane had not developed at all this year. His timing and decision making has been poor. Hmmm....Wasn't that Doyle's problem? Maybe he has learned something from John...

Frankly, I didn't like John's style of play when he was with the Clash. So, I had reservations about him coaching. Also, as someone mentioned, it's one thing to play the game, another to coach it. There have been many train wrecks of former star players trying to coach, and very few real successes.

If John's focus has been on the defense, I would say that things haven't been good. Dunivant has taken a step back. Hard to tell with Robinson, Dayak, and Agoos because of injuries and age (except for Robinson). Waibel is the only one appears to have improved, and he has been playing out of position.

 

This won't happen. I highly doubt that Kinnear will blow his friendship with Doyle by dumping him. This is sad, but Kinnear my end up out of a job because of a poor choice of assistant.

Many people had serious reservations about Doyle's hiring. This could turn out to be the biggest mistake of Kinnear's coaching career.....


God help us if they've "switched roles". If Doyle is making the key decisions for us, then that would explain many things....


I don't think Alexi has the balls to replace Doyle. If Johnnie were still in charge, maybe. Does Lalas attend many practices?

 

Maybe I'm one of the few, but I liked Doyle when he was with the Clash and met him a few times and thought he was pretty cool.

That being said, I believe part of the assistant coach's job is to push the players in practice, to be an "enforcer" (think High School vice principal) when they aren't pulling their load, to teach and to be a motivator.

I have always said that Agoos would have been perfect in this spot! When they announced Doyle was stepping in, I said "Huh?" and scratched my head on that one. I think he may be too laid back for this spot.

 

If this is true, and Doyle does consider his coaching for the Quakes as a part-time job (He still works with Mustang Soccer?), then this is a major negative.

The level of play may be different, but not the level of interaction; it's still a people-to-people deal, something which both Frank and Dom are very good at. You have to know how to motivate.

 

Jeff:

Your point about connecting with players is a good one.

I think its difficult to say that Dunivant has or hasn't improved, as he's been hurt. Cochrane's a rookie and also has been hurt; I would dare say for a rookie Cochrane's done well, altho his positioning does need to be better, which I trust will come with experience and proper coaching.

Robinson's been hurt also, I would pin his lack of improvement on not getting any playing time. Roner's been hurt.

I think a lot of the Quakes' problems lie elsewhere. This is the same coaching staff that helped the team destroy KC a few (very long) weeks ago. To me its more finding effective players to fit the successful system Yallop established and then having a coach make effective line up and in-game adjustments.

I hope that Kinnear is that guy.

Tony

 

I hope Kinnear is too, Tony.

My problem is I don't see Doyle as the right man to support him. Injuries are just something that every player has to live with. Robinson has been hurt EVERY year he's played here, yet I saw improvement under Yallop/Kinnear.

All I'm asking for is someone to show me where hiring Doyle has improved the Quakes. The hiring of Kinnear was going to keep the status quo. That's cool, but what is Doyle suppose to do? Chaparone on road trips? Pick up cones?

Kinnear is a rookie head coach. Every one needs a strong assistant (see how ofter Yallop gave Kinnear credit for the Quake's success). We look like a team coached by an assistant and his buddy, not a head coach/assistant coach relationship. If Kinnear is trying to do both roles, then he is going to fail.....

 

I think Doyle is fine in that position, the problem is Kinnear has been a friend to all of these players, an equal, if you will. There lies the problem.....it's very hard to coach friends like Yallop coaches......Yallop was not afraid to hurt feelings but he also didn't have the friends on the team that Dom does. Yallop came from outside, Dom was promoted from within.......Dom would probably make a better coach on a different team. It's got to be weird for Dom to be the boss over several of his friends, old and new. You have Agoos, Ekelund and Dayak who are his age and all have been friends for the last 3 years.......then you have the younger guys who don't have the age issue like Donovan, Robinson, Mulrooney, Russell, Corrales, and DeRosario, but still have three years of history with him as "one of the guys". That's got to be very difficult to coach.....playing Chris Brown over DeRosario or Mullan over Russell or Cochrane over Robinson has got to cause issues, it's human nature.....on both parts.