The Most Underrated Players You Have Watched ??

Discussion in 'The Beautiful Game' started by leadleader, Sep 21, 2018.

  1. annoyedbyneedoflogin

    Juventus Football Clube Ajax Mineiro de Deportes
    Jun 11, 2012
    #51 annoyedbyneedoflogin, Oct 9, 2018
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2018
    It's hard to compare the technique of a striker to that of an attacking midfielder. I'd say that both Romario and MvB had a few points up in shooting techniques.

    Ball retention and evasive dribbling should be uncontested for Stojkovic.

    But besides the obvious, I don't think assist count should be detached from key passes. The argument against Piksi would be that you feel sorry for him that his teammates didn't do better with all the chances he created.
    Perhaps it is for this that I rate Piksi, Laudrup, Bergkamp, among others, fairly highly.
     
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  2. Excape Goat

    Excape Goat Member+

    Mar 18, 1999
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Paul Scholes might not be a candidate for Ballon d'or or the greatest ever midfielder in the game, but he was very underarted. At Man United, people only talked about Beckham, Giggs and Keane. For the natioal team, he got overshadowed by Lampard and Gerrard. His passing games were never rated as good as Xavi or Pirlo. He is probably lesser than all of the players I just mentioned, but he is not far behind. The only reasn why I think of him as a lesser player is bcause he was underrated by everyone else.
     
  3. lanman

    lanman BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 30, 2002
  4. Tropeiro

    Tropeiro Member+

    Jun 1, 2018
    Toni Kroos deserves a mention.
     
  5. JoCryuff98

    JoCryuff98 Member+

    Barcelona
    Netherlands
    Jan 3, 2018
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Probably Carlos Valderrama
     
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  6. JoCryuff98

    JoCryuff98 Member+

    Barcelona
    Netherlands
    Jan 3, 2018
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    David Ginola who was 6’1 had the technique and similar dribbling style like those small elite tier dribblers. Dude could just go past multiple players in tight spaces with little effort. Pretty underrated player IMO along with Matt Le Tissier during the 90s PL.
     
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  7. JoCryuff98

    JoCryuff98 Member+

    Barcelona
    Netherlands
    Jan 3, 2018
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    I’ve never really watched much of Chris Waddle, but I heard people say he’s a darn good dribbler. He’s English, 6’2 and played like a Brazilian. I found it quite intriguing that there were tons of old generation technically gifted English players.
     
  8. leadleader

    leadleader Member+

    Aug 19, 2009
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Jamie Carragher & Sami Hyypia

    Unquestionably one of the most consistent and most underrated defensive partnerships of the Champions League era. Liverpool 2004/05 conceded only 9 goals in total - 3 out of the 9 conceded goals occurred in the final itself, which means that only 6 goals were conceded in the previous 12 games before the final - but overall only 9 goals were conceded by the Liverpool side that won the 2005 Champions League.

    Not to mention that it is perhaps equally important - if not more so - the demonstrable fact that Liverpool 2004/05 had to get through one of the most difficult Champions League campaigns of all time; Liverpool was widely viewed as the inferior club to Juventus (Quarter Finals), Chelsea (Semi Finals), and AC Milan (Final).

    Diego Simeone's Atletico Madrid is arguably the only club that can compare in terms of said unique talent for consistently upsetting far richer clubs, but then again, Simeone's Atletico Madrid gets the due credit as a defensive talent first and foremost, versus Benitez's Liverpool which is primarily and at times entirely remembered as a "Steven Gerrard and Co. project."

    At any rate, the pundits of the time, the journalists of the time, be them English or Spaniards or Italian or else, the vast majority of them agreed about the Carragher-Hyypia partnership being - by some distance - the primary but somewhat inexplicable factor that served as the main driving force behind Liverpool's shrewd consistency in the Champions League. Steven Gerrard - his iconic performance in the final being the single exception - was not seen as the main driving force of that Liverpool side (the one that actually won the cup).

    Sami Hyypia was already 32 years old throughout most of the 2004/05 Champions League campaign, and I'd argue that it's probably not a pure coincidence that Liverpool's cup-tournament-defensive-shrewdness declined heavily just as Sami Hyypia suddenly found himself on the wrong side of his 30s; the telepathic understanding of Carragher-Hyypia was over, and Gerrard no longer had a legitimate platform to deliver Champions League greatness in what still was his prime.


    Not counting the Champions League Final:

    Barcelona 2005/06 conceded 4 goals in 12 games.

    Liverpool 2004/05 conceded 6 goals in 12 games.

    AC Milan 2004/05 conceded 6 goals in 12 games.

    Atletico Madrid 2013/14 conceded 6 goals in 12 games.

    Atletico Madrid 2015/16 conceded 7 goals in 12 games.

    Chelsea 2007/08 conceded 7 goals in 12 games.

    Atletico Madrid 2016/17 conceded 9 goals in 12 games.

    Liverpool 2006/07 conceded 9 goals in 12 games.

    AC Milan 2006/07 conceded 9 goals in 12 games.

    Chelsea 2006/07 conceded 9 goals in 12 games.

    AC Milan 2002/03 conceded 11 goals in 12 games

    Inter 2009/10 conceded 9 goals in 12 games.

    AC Milan 2005/06 conceded 10 goals in 12 games.

    Chelsea 2011/12 conceded 11 goals in 12 games.

    Chelsea 2004/05 conceded 12 goals in 12 games.

    FC Porto 2003/04 conceded 12 goals in 12 games.

    Liverpool 2007/08 conceded 12 goals in 12 games.


    Goals conceded in the league format:

    Chelsea 2004/05 conceded 15 goals in 38 games.

    Atletico Madrid 2015/16 conceded 18 goals in 38 games.

    Chelsea 2005/06 conceded 22 goals in 38 games.

    Chelsea 2006/07 conceded 24 goals in 38 games.

    AC Milan 2003/04 conceded 24 goals in 34 games.

    Liverpool 2005/06 conceded 25 goals in 38 games.

    Chelsea 2007/08 conceded 26 goals in 38 games.

    Atletico Madrid 2013/14 conceded 26 goals in 38 games.

    Atletico Madrid 2016/17 conceded 27 goals in 38 games.

    Liverpool 2006/07 conceded 27 goals in 38 games.

    Liverpool 2007/08 conceded 28 goals in 38 games.

    AC Milan 2004/05 conceded 28 goals in 38 games.

    AC Milan 2002/03 conceded 30 goals in 34 games.

    AC Milan 2005/06 conceded 31 goals in 38 games.

    Barcelona 2005/06 conceded 35 goals in 38 games.

    AC Milan 2006/07 conceded 36 goals in 38 games.

    Liverpool 2004/05 conceded 41 goals in 38 games.
     
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  9. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
  10. The Potter

    The Potter Member+

    Aug 26, 2004
    England
    Club:
    Stoke City FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    I've not read the thread but people often go for big name players at big name clubs who perhaps do more destructive tasks allowing their team mates to shine, which is an understandable but well worn notion. There was a period in time when the bluffer and the genuine fan would spout "Makelele is soooooo underrated" within 5 minutes, leading me to believe he actually was rated. Currently you could be shot at dawn for not thinking James Milner is underrated and N'Golo Kante the same before him. All terrific players don't get me wrong, I still remember some of the funny looks I received when saying I believed Kante was a better player than Makelele when he was still at Leicester.

    Anyone remember a guy called Roland Nillson? Dont worry neither does anyone else. He was a right back for Sheffield Wednesday and Sweden. Sweden is synonymous with sexy in every regard other than football, he played in England when international players and coverage was yet the norm and lets be honest Sheffield has never been regarded as sexy in any sphere, I guess that's why it was the setting for the Full Monty; Leeds is Saint Tropez in comparison. Plus being a right back, which is to football what the flute is to rock and roll, not too many groupies for flautists but the guy in Jethro Tull is still hella cool - and I hate most prog rock.

    Anyway Roland Nillson is my pick.
     
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  11. poetgooner

    poetgooner Member+

    Arsenal
    Nov 20, 2014
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Unless you talk to Shef. Wednesday fans ;)

    I only remember him for his time in the English Div.1 and EPL.
     
  12. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
  13. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid

    Screenshot_20210217-202654-2.jpg
    Screenshot_20210217-202704-1.jpg
     
  14. Gregoire1

    Gregoire1 Member

    Dec 4, 2020
    Dobrin, Bocchini, Sindelaar, Spencer, Enzo, Magico Gonzales, Streltzov, Sivori.
     
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  15. poetgooner

    poetgooner Member+

    Arsenal
    Nov 20, 2014
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Not sure you can claim to have "watched" those players ;)
     
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  16. Legolas10

    Legolas10 Member

    Real Madrid
    Jun 5, 2020
    I was about to say that to him. He probably forgot the part "have watched"
     
  17. Naubi

    Naubi Member

    Spain
    Mar 26, 2018
    José Mari Bakero
    Míchel González
    Samuel Eto’o
    Arjen Robben
     
  18. Naubi

    Naubi Member

    Spain
    Mar 26, 2018
    Mágico is not undertated IMO. In Spain is usually talked like all-timer. However, great technique.
     
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  19. leadleader

    leadleader Member+

    Aug 19, 2009
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    #69 leadleader, Mar 26, 2021
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2021
    [​IMG]

    I have been re-visiting the games of Michel Platini at Euro 1984 and at the UEFA Cup Winners' Cup 1983/84, and the observation and conclusion that I've drawn is the following: Why is Platini not rated in the same tier as Maradona and Cruyff?

    I mean, I do not generally like to use hyperbolic phrases of the "Player X was like Player Y and Player Z rolled into one" variety, but Platini quite literally was like Andrea Pirlo and Steven Gerrard rolled into one virtually perfect player; he actually was that great.


    1. Platini had the long-galloping high speed mobility of Steven Gerrard, which enabled Platini and Gerrard with the ability to effortlessly to cover the entire length of the pitch quickly, in fact it is deceptive just how quickly these athletes can cover the length of each half of the pitch, or for that matter, the entire length of the pitch.

    As any article ever written about Platini will attest to; Platini did not have a particularly impressive physical appearance if you judge him exclusively on the basis of his superficial physical build, but it is a fact that he was covering a lot of mileage, consistently, in all games. Not many players can do this injury-free, without injuring themselves, and the fact that Platini could consistently get away with doing the donkey work, all the while avoiding injury, while simultaneously also being the ball retention specialist in all of his teams (which meaningfully increases the probability of injury), indicates a rare mix of deceptive-yet-robust athleticism, intelligence, and ability.

    As previously noted: it is no exaggeration to think of prime Michel Platini as Andrea Pirlo and Steven Gerrard rolled into one.


    2. Platini's defensive contribution was arguably superior to that of Frank Lampard or Steven Gerrard, which is an aspect of Platini's overall ability that is always downplayed or just completely ignored altogether; Platini was a similar type of athlete when off-the-ball versus Gerrard, but the difference I think is defined by the fact that Platini had a better intuition/intelligence for the defensive game.

    For example, there is little to no doubt in my mind, that if Platini had not been born as the extraordinarily gifted player that he was throughout his career; he would've been an excellent defensive midfielder in his own right, even if you canceled a significant percentage of his creative powers.

    On the other hand, a midfielder like Steven Gerrard could offer significant quantity on the defensive end, but that surplus of quantity was more a direct result of Gerrard's super-athlete ability, than it was a result of Gerrard having remarkable positioning and intelligence for the defensive game; the same also applies to Frank Lampard; in both cases, Lampard or Gerrard offer a surplus of quantity on the defensive end, but the quality of said defensive contributions is never as consistent nor as tactically flexible as it is with Platini.


    3. Platini had the ball retention expertise of Andrea Pirlo; very few players, arguably only Maradona and Zidane as the obvious exceptions, have been clearly better at ball retention... Which is, yet again, another aspect of Platini's overall ability that gets downplayed or just completely ignored.


    4. Platini is arguably the best passer of all time.


    5. Platini is arguably the best goal scoring midfielder of all time.


    At any rate, it is clear to me, that Platini's lack of slalom dribbling mobility/ability is the main reason why Platini gets underrated so severely... Pele, Cruyff, Maradona, Zidane, and Messi (in order of oldest-to-newest era, not in order of my personal preference), all five of them have that impressive and rare slalom dribbling ability, and I think a lot of analysts and experts alike just primarily draw their conclusions from that.

    A classic case study of this unwritten rule would be Zinedine Zidane; Zidane is widely rated as the superior player versus Platini, but the reality is that Platini is almost an equal in terms of ball retention (the difference is almost negligible in this art), and then the reality also is that Platini is significantly better in terms of passing, goal scoring, and defending. In other words, it very much appears to be the case, that Zidane's unique brand of slalom dribbling and ball retention, is the eye test unwritten rule that puts him above Platini, even when Platini is quite clearly the better and more consistent player.

    Again, the conclusion to be drawn here is that Platini is instinctively and methodically discredited as a generational great, no better than Zico, even when Platini offers equal or better goals-and-assists versus Zico, at the same time that Platini does 2 or 3 times more defensive work than Zico. Simply put: Platini is very underrated... and I think he arguably deserves to be mentioned in the same tier as Maradona and Cruyff.

    My counter argument against the (slalom dribbling) purists who routinely discredit Platini, can be reduced to the following principle: good or great slalom dribblers are almost always by definition available for the traditional national teams, and almost all the goat-tier players were lucky enough to have played for traditional national teams.

    A textbook example of this principle is the injured version of Maradona at World Cup 1990, that version of Maradona could not offer slalom dribbling, but then Maradona's lack of slalom dribbling contributions could be sufficiently circumvented on the basis of exploiting Caniggia's speed-blessed slalom dribbling; and not coincidentally, it was arguably (if not obviously) Caniggia's absence in the Final vs. West Germany, that made Maradona as useless as he was in that game. In all other games where Caniggia was available, Maradona could use his ball retention and passing to great effect, but without Caniggia, Maradona was largely useless himself.

    Maradona-Caniggia at World Cup 1990 is only one out of many similar arguments as to why slalom dribbling ability should not be used as the unwritten rule that it most definitely is, in terms of excluding any and all players who do not possess said rare tier-breaker i.e. slalom dribbling ability. And when you analyze this sport as the team sport that it in fact is, then Platini is arguably not inferior to any player ever; not Pele; not Cruyff; not Maradona; not Messi.

    Argentina World Cup 2014 had prime Angel Di Maria, and prime Angel Di Maria would have been allowed far more creative freedom if Argentina 2014 had been built around a midfielder like Michel Platini 1984. In this inevitable context of 'team' sport, I think it stands to scrutiny that Michel Platini has a strong argument for being in the same tier as Pele, Maradona, Messi, and Cruyff.
     
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  20. Danko

    Danko Member+

    Barcelona
    Serbia
    Mar 15, 2018
    Most underrated?

    A guy like Batistuta who would be one of the best strikers of all time if he played today in front of a good midfield. I think he could score 40 goals in a league campaign.

    Another guy who was a great midfielder is Ryan Giggs. Man was so good with the ball and really knew how to play all facets of the game.

    A defender I have to mention that flies under the radar is Carles Puyol. A Barca legend and an absolute stud but rarely seems to come up in best CB of all time discussions.

    And I guess I should also give a shoutout to a GK. I think Joe Hart flies under the radar a little bit. He's not necessarily an all-time great but he had several seasons for England and Man City that he was terrific.
     
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  21. leadleader

    leadleader Member+

    Aug 19, 2009
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    #71 leadleader, Mar 26, 2021
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2021

    I agree, Carles Puyol is underrated.

    "Puyol had the heart of a lion." True, but not at all the only thing that should be remembered about this great defender... Puyol's extraordinary physical ability gets routinely discredited as some form of byproduct of said lion heart. As if having great heart makes a player extremely fast, extremely strong, extremely agile, and extremely injury-resistant. Not to mention Puyol's excellent positional intelligence, which doesn't get the credit it deserves.

    Gerard Pique gets more credit than Puyol, and Pique's defensive record is rather unimpressive after Xavi and Iniesta began to decline. In contrast, Puyol always was impressive, even when Barcelona was very dysfunctional in the years after Figo's departure i.e. the Gaspart Era (between 2000 and 2003).
     
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  22. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    He is
    Screenshot_20210326-190655-1.jpg
    Highly respected world soccer player of the century(1999)


    This was before the scudetto win with Roma

    Meaning batistuta was individually great enough to be consisted a top 25 all timer with
    0 champions leagues
    And
    0 league titles





    About a good midfield?
    He played behind Rui costa

    Do you even know who he is?
     
  23. Legolas10

    Legolas10 Member

    Real Madrid
    Jun 5, 2020
    Puyol was massively overrated by Barcelona fans not long ago on social medias and everywhere. He used to enter list of top 10 defenders ever in many lists even though he was nowhere near it .
    In last 2/3 years some clips of him getting humiliated by Di Maria and some other players which got viral on social medias like Twitter is what has actually altered the perspective. He isn't underrated at all

    And Barcelona fanbase is the fanbase which has this habit of overrating their players by means of propagandas and attacking other players . Recently Real Madrid fanbase and few other fanbases from premier league has also jumped into this bandwagon . Overrating everything relating to them
     
  24. Pirlo to Baggio

    Pirlo to Baggio New Member

    Valencia
    England
    Mar 19, 2020
    The first name I thought of was Valeron was such a quality player for a brief period when he was at Depor he was as good as any playermaker yet nobody talks about him now.
     
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  25. Sexy Beast

    Sexy Beast Member+

    Dinamo Zagreb
    Croatia
    Aug 11, 2016
    Zagreb
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
    I see many rate Iniesta higher than Xavi because of that slalom dribbling ability, but imo, Xavi is better because overal, he was simply better at solving problems on the pitch. Slalom dribbling ability is just one tool of many to solve problems.

    Tho, i am not sure that slalom dribbling abilities are guarantee that player will be highly rated. Someone like Verratti comes to mind. Wonderful dribbler, but from what i see, people don't take him seriously. To lesser degree Isco, and so on.
     
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