So, out of curiosity, what do you guys have to hate on Pence for? (I mean, besides the obvious) Or do you think he will go down with the ship as well? We all know hate is what drives our political thought process. So is it simply his association with Trump, his limp-wrist D) appearance, religious devoutness, hatred of gays... What do we hate the most about the man that comes after the man?
Well, you noted the 'hatred of gays'. Theres one. His cancellation of a needle exchange causing an AIDS spike in Indiana is another. He subsumes common sense to his dream of Christer-Sharia. Small amounts of research for accuracy could really flesh this out but theres a start.
Two reasons to hate Pence. He claims to be a Christian but supports Donald Trump. Those two things are irredeemably irreconcilable in my eyes. Second, he is obsequious. He will do or say anything to further his own political power. He did run the presidential transition, so...yeah...
Hate isnt a word used by other than you. Dont attribute to others then argue against yourself. His person, platform and policies would be destructive to America. Besides. He isnt eligible. He was born in Kenya.
No question. It's not the name I am concerned with, it's the inability for anyone to work together. I have no issues with impeaching anyone with cause and I certainly am not going to defend Trump on anything, but there has to be a way we can have a difference of opinion without burning each other's house down. The way people attacked those that didn't even vote for Trump, accusing them of being the reason Trump was elected, shows we have a long, long way to go.
After a brief period of introspection, GOP will rev up the base in 2022 by running against President Harris.
First, I do not use the word "hate" very often, and I will not use it here. As for disliking and, more importantly, distrusting Mike Pence, two things come to mind: 1) Everything you mentioned (religious devoutness, hatred of gays, his bizarre and creepy obsession with avoiding contact with women-that makes my skin crawl, "devotion" to Trump is a better term, no his "obsequiousness" is even better). His most famous quote: "I'm a Christian, a conservative and a Republican, in that order." -That is horrifying. 2) Policy: a. Pence signed the most abortion-restrictive regulations in the nation. b. Pence helped pass one of the nation’s harshest “religious freedom” laws (which have nothing to do with religious freedom, but are legalized discrimination). c. Pence is skeptical of climate change d. Under Governor Pence, Indiana has diverted $53 million in the past two years from public school to funding vouchers for private schools, including religious schools, and to charter school programs. e. Campaign finance records from a 1990 run for Congress show that Pence used political donation to pay the mortgage on his house, his personal credit card bill, groceries, golf tournament fees and car payments for his wife.
I may not like George Will, but, unlike Trump, George Will really does "know words. [He has] the best words."
Trump corruption is like War and Peace. You have to take notes or you'll get lost. Let me remind everyone that Manafort made up a story about plane trouble to get Trump to stay an extra night in Indy, and Pence used that time to sell himself to Trump. If not for Manafort's machinations Pence wouldn't be VP. Could be a coincidence.
George Will went to an Ivy for his masters & PhD. Unlike Trump he learned while he was there instead of having his father buy a diploma.
This is it for me. And I say this as a lowercase - f fundamental Christian who has spent a lot of time praying with, and studying with, Capital F Fundamentals and Capital E Evangelical Christians who turned hours and hours of prayer time into diatribes against immoral, unchristian, unrepentant, and debauched egotists, only to find that most of them flipped like fvcking candles in the wind to vote for Trump. I share the same "irredeemably irreconcilable" views as Brummie, but I freely admit to feeling betrayed by my fellow Christians. I long ago ended my association with the Christian Right -- I frequently refer to myself as being a former fellow traveler -- but I am a strong Christian with deep, non-empirical, beliefs. I share a huge swath of my beliefs with these ********nuts on the right and I am embarrassed to have to share the Christian stage as it were with them. Pence is the ugly ********ing tip of the iceberg. Unlike xtomix, Pence's quote -- I am a Christian, a conservative and a Republican, in that order -- doesn't horrify me. I'm OK with Christian conservatives. I'm not OK with Christians who sell out the words of Jesus Christ for a man so marginal as Donald Trump.
I am 100% with you on the creepiness of the man. On the policy points, would you be willing to compromise on any of them? I'm going to bet a, b and c are no's. I would hope there would be a little room for negotiation on the school voucher program. E isn't a policy position and if true, should be prosecuted. Considering it was 28 years ago, what was the reason for not going after him for this?
Agree. I do not consider myself to be particularly religious anymore, after 12 years of Catholic school and sending my daughter to the same schools for 11 of her 12, I have seen the hypocrisy from the inside and the child abuse that seems to be rampant was the final straw.
And to add to my and Val's point - it's not the abortion rumors or the affairs. It's the practice of not paying workers for their labor, for lying to the government, and for treating those not worth a billion dollars as less worthy.
@stanger What's your view of Pence, you know as a person? I remember a series of profiles that I heard/read on the guy after he won Trumps' approval, and my general impression was that he was a bit slimy, and a lot of an opportunist, who had no experience in government. But you've seen him first hand. What's your impression of him?
At some point, they're gonna pivot to thinking about covering their asses in 2020 and beyond. One would think.
I'm in Ohio, not Indiana, so I have no first hand info, just what I see on TV. He is an odd person and, coupled with his dedication to his faith, makes me distrust him. I look at the majority of the devoutly religious people that are caught with hookers, kids or otherwise proven to by hypocrites, and you can usually tell there was something that made them a little off. Just sets off red flags. That's how I feel about Pence.
Geeze, that was a helluva brain dump on my part. I knew both parts of that equation separately, but throw in some confusion in the background here, and I conflated Ohio and Indiana. Maybe I need to get off line....
To get back to impeachment...if either Cohen or Manafort can show Trump involvement with the email hacking, that's going to be something that will disturb many, many Republican senators. I mean, Rand Paul and Mike Lee and some other clowns will be unperturbed. I suspect that if the evidence is strong enough, both NC senators would vote to impeach. That's the Sword of Domacles, or at least the main one, hanging over this presidency. He's put so much stock in the "no collusion" talking point that collusion would be a crushing blow. OK, I get it, we already "know" he colluded. But if we can remove the quotation marks, I think he'll only hold on to the deadenders.