The Global Warming Thread

And they're calling for government action to fix it:

Mr Steffensen called on the State and Federal Governments to establish a new workforce dedicated to managing land and fuel loads through the use of traditional ecological knowledge.

"We need a whole other division of people out there looking after the land," he said.

"A fire practitioner of the future is going to be full time."

Mr Steffensen said the new sector could employ Indigenous and non-Indigenous people and exist in conjunction with emergency fire services.

"We need our firefighters, we praise our firefighters that help those communities and they're needed into the future," he said.

"But we also need the land managers, we can't just throw it all on the weight of one department"

University of Tasmania professor of fire science David Bowman said Indigenous fire practices could play an important role in land management systems of the future, but they would need to be adapted to suit the current times.

"So many changes have occurred since 1975 … but we can take that knowledge and we can adapt it to suit our times," he said.

"The key message is that we can take the idea of humans using fire skilfully — we can manipulate vegetation, we can reduce fuel loads, we can sharpen fire boundaries."​

​

 

Late.

Is California doing the same?

 

Not really, problem is people have already built in areas that could use controlled burning, and once that's happened they can't really do it because of the risk involved. And they're stupidly allowing people to rebuild in these fire prone areas in the hills because, you know, the land belongs to them and all.

And the fact that there's already a housing shortage here plays into it all, because it's very difficult politically to tell people they can't build in certain areas (not to mention that it's generally people with money and clout who live in the fire prone hills in the first place).

 

This is an issue that fascinates me as a brit who, as it happens, is also a minor politico who gets to make decisions about where people can build and what they can build. This is relevant, particularly the point about 'the land belongs to them'. In a UK context that's irrelevant.

Of course, we don't have fire considerations but we do have flood issues and planning departments, (and people like me), have been heavily criticised over here for allowing building in former flood plains... and rightly so.

 

I was watching the coverage of that issue and it seemed to me that a lot of problems relate to the amount, (and the type), of vegetation.

If you only allowed maintained grass within a certain distance, (say, 100-200 metres), of buildings you'd likely probably remove a lot of the problems that have been created.

So, for instance, if someone owns property and doesn't keep the vegetation in a proper order it should be done for them by the state and a bill sent to them. If they don't pay it then eventually, if that situation continues, the property should be confiscated and sold to cover the costs of the matter.

IOW you'd have to play hardball with people.

As you say, there's an issue with properties that have already been built but, what's the alternative? Just to let people die?

 

Well I was thinking specifically about the Santa Rosa fires a couple years back because those were the ones that we personally felt the most effects from. And in that case the entire development in the hills was controversial when it was first put in 50 years ago because it was known to be a fire prone area but they did it anyway, subdivided and developed it, basically a case where environmental concerns didn't win out.

And now that people DO own those tracts of land it's very difficult to tell them they can't rebuild on them, so eventually we'll be facing the same thing again.

Another example is the fire that destroyed pretty much the entire town of Paradise, that was a community that was ill-conceived in the first place, in a fire prone area with very few roads going in and out of town making it difficult to evacuate. And since that one was so decimated it's not even certain that most people would want to come back, there's not much "there" there anymore.

 

You're right. In mid Dec '70 we had a big snow storm and it was colder than a witch's tit. At 2am wifey's water broke and the nearest hospital was 25 mi away in both directions. Bundling up the twins I got everyone to the car after shoveling a path. I made it to the hospital with plenty of time to spare and only knocking down 3 road signs and a couple of mailboxes. I guess I needn't have rushed as I got there 1/2 hr early.

You don't know cold like I do. You never met my mother-in law!

 

... that you know of!

 

Ha...it's not bad enough that we both got a S.W.M.B.O. but I also got this.

This is a photo my m-i-l in one of her more pleasant moods!

 

*shiver*

 

HIIII-YOOOOO!

 

I know you were born in the Depression. How old is she then?

 

I always liked the way you posed answers to Carnac the Magnificent.

 

It's difficult to see the point in building in some places now where the location is susceptible to long term problems such as fire or flood.

But, tbh, I can't help thinking that fire is probably less of a risk than flood because, as I understand it, land management, (essentially, only allowing maintained grassland with a few hundred metres), should be able to protect a property from fire.

The only way of stopping a flood would be to build a 50ft wall around an area of housing and then, how would you get in and out of the area?

This is the issue regarding coastal flooding with rising seas. Unless people grow gills it's not practical to maintain ALL of those areas at reasonable cost.

 

Do I need to ask what it was you'd just done or shall we just take it as read that you'd committed some appalling transgression?

 

Let me count just a few of the ways....
1. I was the older man [6 yrs]
2. I was not Evangelical
3. I was Italian
4. I had a black leather jacket

Ps...I think I mentioned before....wedding day went back to wifey's house to change out of tux and was informed I was no longer welcome in their home. Sooo...I changed out on the front lawn. It was the talk of the neighborhood.

 

She checked out much like Hansel and Gretel. Baked in the oven.

 

Y'knowwww, nobody needs to be complaining about children being exposed to horrific stuff these days... the older literature probably kept kids awake for hours!

 

I read something about that but it occurred to me that maybe that includes a lot of them being insects and shit? Or is that just the non-insect variants?

Pretty shocking whatever it is