The All-Encompassing Pro/Rel Thread on Soccer in the USA

Discussion in 'Soccer in the USA' started by bigredfutbol, Mar 12, 2016.

  1. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I do believe there are parallels between soccer and the NCAA, but probably not in the same ways M does.
     
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  2. Isnot the NCAA the ultimate closed shop?
     
  3. CrazyJ628

    CrazyJ628 Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    The center of the Earth
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Not in the slightest
     
    HailtotheKing repped this.
  4. So athletes/soccer players have the freedom to do their thing outside of the university without threats from the ncaa.
    Easy win in the challenge in court of the CA rulings for them then.
     
  5. CrazyJ628

    CrazyJ628 Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    The center of the Earth
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Any athlete is free to pursue their professional sports career outside of the NCAA. It's not the NCAA's fault that the NFL and NBA didn't build a farm system for themselves but even then a NBA level player can go to Europe for a year if they want to. The whole 1-and-done thing is solely on the NBA. For the NFL, most players choose to go to play in college because it gives them time to mature physically and honestly the percentage of student-athletes who go pro is so minuscule that it's better to go and get a college degree for free. It's a much safer bet.

    Athletes go pro in tennis and golf all the time without going into the NCAA ranks.

    Great! A poorly researched opinon piece where the writer comes out and says that he doesn't actually give a shit about the dozens of sports being played at three divisions of NCAA athletics

    "In The Times Magazine this weekend, I lay out a proposal to pay the players in the two big revenue sports, college football and men’s basketball, something the N.C.A.A. won’t countenance. In the course of my reporting, I gained a new appreciation for the cartel characteristics of sports leagues"

    Again, like many in the media he shows that he's only biased toward just two "revenue" sports played by men

    "What it has, instead, is a work force full of young adults dreaming of becoming pros and willing to sign any document, no matter how onerous, if it will help them reach that goal. The document the N.C.A.A. forces them to sign completely stacks the deck against them."

    Less than 1% of student athletes in these sports go pro, and that's not counting the literally 10s of thousands of men and women playing NCAA athletics, some of whom (Ivy League, Military, D3, Pioneer Football League) who aren't getting scholarships. Besides, the NCAA isn't forcing a student-athlete to do anything and the vast majority of student athletes actually understand that after their senior year of college, their competitive careers are over.

    "In fact, the N.C.A.A.’s real role is to oversee the collusion of university athletic departments, whose goal is to maximize revenue"

    If that's their goal then 90% of D1 teams alone are doing a piss poor job of maximizing revenue as you can count on your hands and toes the number of NCAA progams that operate in the black. For every Ohio State there are dozens of Southeast Missouri State type schools in D1 alone. This guy is completely ignoring the reality of what college sports is.

    Is the NCAA perfect? Far from it. Is it the NCAA's fault that Ohio State and Alabama aren't paying their football and men's basketball teams? Nope. The B1G, SEC, etc could (and probably will) break off to form their own thing.

    You. Don't. Know. What. You're. Talking. About.
     
  6. M

    M Member+

    Feb 18, 2000
    Via Ventisette
    You. Are. In. Denial.
     
  7. KCbus

    KCbus Moderator
    Staff Member

    United States
    Nov 26, 2000
    Reynoldsburg, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    He’s doing all his greatest hits!!
     
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  8. M

    M Member+

    Feb 18, 2000
    Via Ventisette
    Poor "Staff Member" KCBus, so bereft of ability to discuss that he has to do his "greatest hit" by accusing someone else of doing said thing.

    Nice projection though.
     
  9. CrazyJ628

    CrazyJ628 Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    The center of the Earth
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Pot meet kettle. You’re playing a troll character and I’d tip my cap at your commitment except that you don’t try to innovate the character.
     
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  10. M

    M Member+

    Feb 18, 2000
    Via Ventisette
  11. KCbus

    KCbus Moderator
    Staff Member

    United States
    Nov 26, 2000
    Reynoldsburg, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Ok, wiseass.

    You never responded to any of this, so here we go again.
    Discuss that.
     
  12. This NCAA would have been demolished decades ago by the EU if it existed here. It's not a cartel, unless it's used as a label in the Columbian way. It's a criminal extortion gang.

    Edit: I actually can't believe they donot violate federal laws as they operate the system in 50 states.
     
  13. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #23763 jaykoz3, Oct 1, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2019
    Still one of the best T-Shirts out there!

    [​IMG]
    This sums up the hypocrisy of the NCAA:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/13/sports/unc-north-carolina-ncaa.html

    UNC's athletic programs were NOT punished for their athletes benefiting from Academic Fraud.....Why? Because not just athletes benefitted from the fraudulent classes....it's ok in the NCAA's eyes. Which is exactly what the NCAA was established for in the first place, to protect the Blue Blood Schools...

    Anyone take a bet on if this had happened at say, oh...I don't know...Syracuse*, St. John's, UCONN, Iowa State...those schools athletics programs would have been SEVERELY punished.

    *As a life long Syracuse fan (born and raised in Central New York) I may or may not be bitter towards the NCAA and their arbitrary punishments....I am totally still bitter....
     
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  14. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    41% of NCAA athletes get nothing in scholarships and the majority of the rest aren't getting a full-ride scholarship. The idea that athletes are getting a free education as their "pay" is a poorly researched talking point designed to make people feel better about the money the NCAA makes on the backs of unpaid adults.
     
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  15. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Wonderful rebuttal to the multiple well laid out points in his post. And you wonder why people call you a troll.
     
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  16. M

    M Member+

    Feb 18, 2000
    Via Ventisette
    Except it wasn't a "wonderful rebuttal". It was just more of the same old shite that that poster has doled up multiple times on this thread whenever the subject is college sports.

    Not sure why you think I wonder why the normal culprits call me a troll, I don't; it's a useful form of deflection for them.
     
  17. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  18. KCbus

    KCbus Moderator
    Staff Member

    United States
    Nov 26, 2000
    Reynoldsburg, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And you still haven't replied to my post, which I re-posted.
     
  19. CrazyJ628

    CrazyJ628 Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    The center of the Earth
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Just curious if you’re including all divisions in that because D3 will heavily influence those numbers. I think people need to take issue with the athletics departments themselves since the NCAA has little to no power. If the B1G etc want to start paying student athletes then they could easily do so. Butler on the other hand not so much. Also I know this will get dismissed as a talking point but it’s a true one. There are lots of kids who probably wouldn’t be going to college without an athletics scholarship.
     
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  20. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    Directly, probably not, but I don't think it's unreasonable to make the argument that collegiate sports are probably the main reason we don't have independent minor leagues in this country, which, if they weren't the big money businesses they are, would probably have gone somewhere to fill that void.
     
  21. ThreeApples

    ThreeApples Member+

    Jul 28, 1999
    Smurf Village
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #23771 ThreeApples, Oct 1, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2019
    Step 1: Abolish and/or reform and/or do whatever to fix the NCAA
    Step 2: ???????
    Step 3: Pro/rel in American soccer
     
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  22. KCbus

    KCbus Moderator
    Staff Member

    United States
    Nov 26, 2000
    Reynoldsburg, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Step 2: Magic Underwear.
     
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  23. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The number comes straight from the NCAA website, I assume they're counting all athletes under their schools.

    This legislation doesn't allow schools to pay athletes. It allows athletes to make money on their own likenesses (endorsements, appearance fees, autograph signings, etc.).
     
  24. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You're right it wasn't. Since I used that term to describe your rebuttal, not his.
     
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  25. Crawleybus

    Crawleybus Member+

    Oct 18, 2013
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Go to site - European football statistics it gives you the history of English football then try and claim that it's the 'same teams always finishing top' you won't and you can't because your claim was, is, and always will be bollox. I ask you again why are Nottingham Forest, Blackburn, Notts County (to name but a few) not 'nailed on top 6'? If your ridiculous claim was true then Preston who won SIX titles in a row should be European Champions no? You also havent td me why the 'no hopers' Leicester City are likely to be playing European football again next year when they are supposed to be 'destined' for nothing but relegation? Perhaps you could answer these questions because they completely contradict your daft claim? I have plenty more I could ask too.
     

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