SUM may grant MLS the FMF's 3rd slot to the Copa Libertadores

Discussion in 'Mexico: Club Cups and Competitions' started by Deleted USer, Jan 13, 2008.

  1. Panfilo

    Panfilo Member+

    May 9, 2003
    INLAND EMPIRE
    Club:
    Club América
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    Come on Mods

    FINISH HIM!!!!!!!!!!
     
  2. DGreat

    DGreat Moderator
    Staff Member

    CD Guadalajara
    Mexico
    Oct 5, 2007
    El Ombligo
    Club:
    CD Chivas de Guadalajara
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    hey i provided stats nd i never got a counter attack with full prove evidence and yet all i kept readingwas sum owns the fmf bs.....show no mercy!!!
     
  3. Deleted USer

    Deleted USer Member+

    Jan 7, 2001
    this is what the dude had to say to me via PM. This was his response to the article that disproved his theory about the viewship in Mexico not counting.

    I responded with the following

     
  4. Deleted USer

    Deleted USer Member+

    Jan 7, 2001
    Quote:
    I think that you completely underestimate the Conmebol. Let me ask you a question. How have the agreements changed since that happened?
    I do not normally answer a question with a question, but I repeat, If the US market is what CONMEBOL sought from the beginning, why would FSWE threaten to pull if the FMF was not going to be awarded direct participation?


    Quote:
    If you know I didnt say anything about ratings why did you imply that I mentioned them. This is how you twist and meld the story to conform to the party line. It's an acceptable tactic but its not working with me.
    Then how did you come to the conclusion that MLS is beginning to take control of the US soccer market? How did you determine that? Off what numbers? Whats statistics?
    Quote:
    You again make the mistake of confusing ratings and attendance with power. Power and control are different from ratings and attendance. Learn the difference because it will allow you to see where the real movers and shakers are.
    ratings IS power. Its what can get X club to go to to table and say, "NOPE, I want X amount of money because according to your very own ratings, my team draws X amount of viewers. If you dont like that, I will go to X network"


    Quote:
    Ratings where? In Mexico? In the USA? Where?
    Right here in the US. Every season, every tournament, Mexican league matches and tournaments that they participate in are breaking new records as every season goes along.

    Just within the past 2-3 years, Spanish telecast started to be measures in the regular nielsen media ratings, and not the HISPANIC nielsen media ratings.

    The highest ratings for a club match in the US happens to be between MFL clubs (this record was broken in 2007). FSWE consistantly is breaking new ratings eash season as Mexican teams are given more slots into Copa Libertadores and Copa Sudamericana.

    Quote:
    If I'm so wrong then why is FMF marketing its games via the MLS?
    FMF is not marketing their matches through MLS. MLS even hired SUM for the same reasons the FMF did. SUM is a sports entertainement group that is in the business of marketing and promoting sporting events.

    There are literally a lot of promoters, agents, and marketing companies that do what SUM does. Lone Star Entertainment and Sports, Dream Match Solutions, etc are among some of the bigger players. It just so happens that SUM has better contacts within the USSF circles.

    Quote:
    Why isn't interliga played in mexico?
    The saturating factor. When you play a small amount of games in places that are not accustomed to see LIVE action, tickets tend to go higher.

    If UNAM plays 20 matches at home every calender year, some may not attend all matches because they have them in their back yard. However, when a city like Houston, LA, Dallas, only gets to see UNAM play onces or twice a year (IF THAT), people are more likely to attend.

    Quote:
    Why does SuperLiga even exists?
    the saturation factor (FMF)
    the need for instant credibility (MLS)
    the creation of faux rivalries (MLS)
    free airfare, lodging, expenses (FMF)

    Quote:
    Good for you. You made be informed in all that you read and see. But that still doesnt mean you have the ability to see where the real move is or how the play is being worked. In that aspect let me recommend a few books.
    The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene
    The Art of War by Sun Tsu

    nice, but you still have failed to back up anything.
     
  5. Deleted USer

    Deleted USer Member+

    Jan 7, 2001
    he basically told me to read the Art of War because I have not seen the big picture and he has.

    He basically knows how all of this unfolded and is able to see 'real' mover and shakers.
     
  6. la fresa

    la fresa Member+

    Oct 31, 2005
    texas
    Club:
    Serbian White Eagles
    laugh out loud.
     
  7. DGreat

    DGreat Moderator
    Staff Member

    CD Guadalajara
    Mexico
    Oct 5, 2007
    El Ombligo
    Club:
    CD Chivas de Guadalajara
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    mmmm and what do these books bring in to the revelance of what we are talking about?? whatever this is dead mls can win out of their soil so whats the point
     
  8. Rafael Hernandez

    Rafael Hernandez Moderator
    Staff Member

    Mar 6, 2002
    The guy is a total idiot. He basically just made baseless arguments and stawmen to hide the fact that he was talking out of his ass. Notice his post about the Mexican league not getting respect in south america and when I call him out, he moved the goal posts and totally diverted the situation.
     
  9. el-choul

    el-choul Member+

    Apr 17, 2006
    DC
    Wow.

    That's all.


    Ok, I should contribute something on the actual thread topic, though it's pretty much all been said.

    SUM has no say regarding the FMF slots. And I'd guess, even if FMF gave in to greed and were willing to give their spots up to MLS in exchange for $$$$, that Conmebol would have to approve, and I'm guessing some of the lesser SA federations would rather earn SUM's money themselves by playing MLS clubs, than allow FMF do the play-in and earn the money.

    I just don't see this happening, without FMF gaining something more than $$$ or a reworking of the Libertadores itself. One scenario I could see would be having Mexico 3 eliminate itself with an MLS club instead of a Bolivian (taking this year's Atlas-La Paz as an example), but that would still mean Bolivia would be giving up 1/2 a slot unless they reworked the Libertadores allocations.

    I guess they could always work a Mexico 3 (Atlas in 08), SA/Bolivia 3 (La Paz in 08), MLS 1, MLS 2 pre-Lib group phase, with the top 2 passing to the Libertadores group phase, and SUM/MLS paying Mexico and Bolivia both for the right to maybe qualify, but that's getting a little farfetched, and would still need Conmebol approval.
     
  10. DCU1996

    DCU1996 Member

    Jun 3, 2002
    N. VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Korea Republic
    How you guys feel about giving one ticket to winner of SuperLiga.

    After all, FMF clubs participating in it, at least a MLS team has to earn it.
     
  11. sidspaceman

    sidspaceman Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 20, 2002
    AMÉRICA DE CALI
    Club:
    America de Cali
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    As long as all the games are played during the Mexican preseaon and exclusively in the USA then I would say no.
     
  12. DCU1996

    DCU1996 Member

    Jun 3, 2002
    N. VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Korea Republic
    Of course, the format should change to be fair like home and away.

    I'm sure the schedule can be adjusted little bit.
     
  13. sidspaceman

    sidspaceman Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 20, 2002
    AMÉRICA DE CALI
    Club:
    America de Cali
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    I would still say no.
     
  14. DGreat

    DGreat Moderator
    Staff Member

    CD Guadalajara
    Mexico
    Oct 5, 2007
    El Ombligo
    Club:
    CD Chivas de Guadalajara
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    same here lol
     
  15. Bolivianfuego

    Bolivianfuego Your favorite Bolivian

    Apr 12, 2004
    Fairfax, Va
    Club:
    Bolivar La Paz
    Nat'l Team:
    Bolivia
    Well i see this thread is still around, i hope they can organize a interliga between mexican and MLS sides, so the winner goes on to the CL. That would be interesting.

    Because in my mind, if there's mexican teams in there already, whats the deal with an american team? IF they actually can beat Mexican teams out for that 1 last spot then why not? They earned it.

    And if mexico' was let in in 98' was it? Thats when the sacred bond of the CL was broken, as far as i am concerned it doesnt make a difference anymore.


    And im not gonna lie, Mexican teams bring the heat now to the CL or in other words make it more interesting.
     
  16. NachoNation

    NachoNation Member+

    Jun 19, 2005
    GOAT Puzzle
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    Well if the sacred bond was broken back in 98', then why not brake it some more at the expense of a Bolivian or Peruvian team?:D
     
  17. Bolivianfuego

    Bolivianfuego Your favorite Bolivian

    Apr 12, 2004
    Fairfax, Va
    Club:
    Bolivar La Paz
    Nat'l Team:
    Bolivia
    Yes, that could happen. I agree why not. Bolivia's league is in the dumps and i dunno if i can say the same about peru(dont have enough insight on their league). But maybe taking a spot from either wouldnt be bad. Bolivia has had a bad showing in the CL since Bolivar got off their game and were having internal money laundering issues. Things are getting cleaned up and let me tell you they will go back to being one of the better teams in the CL, and in SA.
     
  18. NachoNation

    NachoNation Member+

    Jun 19, 2005
    GOAT Puzzle
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    Well, that's pretty much our only grievance.

    Why at our expense?

    As if this story really carries any weight, but regardless, it shouldn't be at the expense of our teams. We've fought tooth and nail to get what we've got. The MLS should do the same.
     
  19. Bolivianfuego

    Bolivianfuego Your favorite Bolivian

    Apr 12, 2004
    Fairfax, Va
    Club:
    Bolivar La Paz
    Nat'l Team:
    Bolivia
    They would, take one away from bolivia or peru(actually nevermind, read what else i wrote). I agree. Although it wouldnt be right IMO, but Bolivia is in the shithole right now with letting half assed broken teams to get the shit beaten outta them, but regardless they have played in the tourney since its inception. Same goes with peru. So I COULD see them taking one of the mexican spots, and throwing that in the hat for MLS/FMF to fight for, but to make you guys happy i agree taking a spot from bolivia/peru would be ideal for you guys, but i don't see conmbol letting that happen unless the league's sell out.

    And also like its been talked about before, Money talks. And with the chance of Beck's, Blanco, or Now Marcelo Gallardo coming back to South America representing American' teams will def. attract some interest, the first two names though more so than el muneco.
     
  20. NachoNation

    NachoNation Member+

    Jun 19, 2005
    GOAT Puzzle
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    On these two continents. Everyone is a sellout.

    Don't be surprised.
     
  21. Bolivianfuego

    Bolivianfuego Your favorite Bolivian

    Apr 12, 2004
    Fairfax, Va
    Club:
    Bolivar La Paz
    Nat'l Team:
    Bolivia
    I agree.

    O yea i added on some more of my post, based on how Conmbol are money hungry.
     
  22. DGreat

    DGreat Moderator
    Staff Member

    CD Guadalajara
    Mexico
    Oct 5, 2007
    El Ombligo
    Club:
    CD Chivas de Guadalajara
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    your saying that the interest of blanco or beck would interest the tournament but how can that be a gurantee what if non of the mls dont make??and why cant the conmebol grant them a ticket or let them square each other off like in the u.s open cup??
     
  23. Bolivianfuego

    Bolivianfuego Your favorite Bolivian

    Apr 12, 2004
    Fairfax, Va
    Club:
    Bolivar La Paz
    Nat'l Team:
    Bolivia
    Well right now, deep down inside the MLS wants the LA galaxy to succeed, as they have been given sort of a "cheat" you can say, having 3 players paid more than the 400grand salary cap for 1 player, it is beckham, Donovan, and Carlos Ruiz. With those 3 there, with ruiz now in as a forward they should be pretty tough next season, and with blanco who led the Fire to the Playoff's both teams have very good chances of being one of the top teams selected to play in the Interliga between MLS/FMF if it ever happened anytime soon.

    And if the conmbol really want beck's or Blanco or any MLS team there, they will give them a slot straight up. But i'd perfer if they had an interliga instead to show that an MLS team should work for that 1 spot first. Right now i dont feel our league is ready, possibly DC United with all their foreign aqusitions this season but so far you cant say that either.
     
  24. DCU1996

    DCU1996 Member

    Jun 3, 2002
    N. VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Korea Republic
    I don't know much about background info on the whole futbol business and money stuff, but I guess giving up 1 ticket to SuperLiga should be a fair 'investment' from FMF side and the Mexican clubs.

    US is huge potential in terms of soccer business. I'm sure they can easily find good business model benefining both side by having close relationship between MLS and FMF.
     
  25. DGreat

    DGreat Moderator
    Staff Member

    CD Guadalajara
    Mexico
    Oct 5, 2007
    El Ombligo
    Club:
    CD Chivas de Guadalajara
    Nat'l Team:
    Mexico
    yes the mls is growing. yes the mls should begin being allowed in the tournaments if conmebol wants but not at our expense that the point that is being made why do we have have to give up a spot when we fought and earned those spots.MLS needs to go and fight and get wat they want their own way not by making superliga their to to CL
     

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