Stu Holden Says Go to Single Elimination Playoffs

Discussion in 'MLS: General' started by ECUNCHATER, Nov 2, 2018.

  1. ECUNCHATER

    ECUNCHATER Member

    Sep 30, 1999
    These are probably 2 reasons why there is talk of yet another playoff format change.
     
  2. SoccerRevolutionary

    SoccerRevolutionary New Member

    May 11, 2007
     
  3. SoccerRevolutionary

    SoccerRevolutionary New Member

    May 11, 2007
    Hey Encunchater...you might want to go to www.nasl.com
    Something tells me it does exist!!!
     
  4. newtex

    newtex Member+

    May 25, 2005
    Houston
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Your link goes to "unknown host" so that is not good for your point.

    This link does go to the NASL website: http://www.nasl.com/

    Interesting thing on that website. See any current teams listed? See any information about the 2018 season? The latest "news" is from June. And that is nothing to do with a functioning league.

    The surviving remnants of the NASL played in the NPSL this year. And two of those three teams have already announced intentions to join the new NPSL "Pro" League/Division starting in 2020.
     
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  5. SoccerRevolutionary

    SoccerRevolutionary New Member

    May 11, 2007
    Actually, just read the announcement that this past season was cancelled...my bad...If they do jump start the league in 2019...I think MLS should talk about using the NASL as a D2 League for MLS, that is if they play in 2019...
     
  6. newtex

    newtex Member+

    May 25, 2005
    Houston
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Why? Because of the name? The NASL, even if it does come back, wants nothing to do with MLS.

    And what makes you think that the NASL is a good enough operation to build teams up to be able to make the jump to MLS? The NASL stayed in D2 in 2017 on waivers after the plug came with days of being pulled in late 2016. The USSF saw no evidence that they had fixed their problems in 2017 and denied their D2 application for 2018. What has changed for the NASL to make you think that MLS should do anything with the NASL?

    The USL, on the other hand, has actually built up their league and teams over the last few years. Yes, they have gotten some waivers at various points, but they have actually expanded and improved their league. They are now sanctioned as a D2 league. The USL-Championship (D2 league) has 7 new teams joining in 2019 to get them up to 36 teams and they are starting a new D3 league. Some of the NASL teams jumped over the USL from the crumbling NASL. Cincinnati and Nashville are moving up from the USL to MLS.

    And MLS has a relationship with the USL. If MLS is going to use any league, and I'm not saying they should, as an associated D2 league why wouldn't it be the USL?
     
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  7. NashSC

    NashSC Member+

    Nashville SC
    United States
    Jan 3, 2018
    you are really behind the times. You are 2 years behind. NASL is dead and USL is D2.
    USL is already the D2 league MLS has chosen. This is where the MLS B teams play and MLS team affiliates. MLS helped them achieve D2 status.
     
  8. NaBUru38

    NaBUru38 Member+

    Mar 8, 2016
    Las Canteras, Uruguay
    Club:
    Club Nacional de Football
    Adding more teams to the playoffs is a bad idea.
     
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  9. ECUNCHATER

    ECUNCHATER Member

    Sep 30, 1999
    I don't think anyone is asking for more teams to be added, just a quicker and more meaningful playoff. As it stands, each team after the first play in game gets the same amount of home games which gives no advantage to either team. To make the regular season count more, they need to do like other college and pro sports and do single elimination, or best of 3/5/7.
     
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  10. IvanIV

    IvanIV King of all He purveys

    Apr 8, 2006
    TN
    Club:
    Sheffield Wednesday FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Why have a play off at all?

    I'd be happy with just a straight table and the top team be crowned champion.
     
  11. the cup

    the cup Member

    Jul 10, 2002
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Because this is MLS, where we kind of don't know what we want.

    We know we want the regular season to count and be compelling, but we sure as hell don't want promotion / relegation.

    We have to have "playoffs" or the American fan won't understand what we are playing for even if others around the world look at us and scratch their heads.

    We toy with the idea of playing against teams from Mexico more, but every time we do we usually end up getting beat.

    So we just keep expanding and waiting to see what happens next basically.
     
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  12. IvanIV

    IvanIV King of all He purveys

    Apr 8, 2006
    TN
    Club:
    Sheffield Wednesday FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That's really astute.
     
  13. the cup

    the cup Member

    Jul 10, 2002
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Oh, I left out the part about wanting a 2nd team in New York City so badly that we will let one play in a baseball stadium with no clear plans for a future soccer stadium.

    Sorry, I don't mean to derail a tread that is supposed to be about the playoffs.

    I will shut up now.
     
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  14. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Liga MX's playoffs (as well of most of Central and South America) say hi. So does Australia, the Netherlands, promotion playoffs everywhere, etc.
     
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  15. ECUNCHATER

    ECUNCHATER Member

    Sep 30, 1999
    A lot of other nations have playoffs too. We kind of need them in America because there is nothing exciting outside of domestic competition in CONCACAF. No one really cares about the CONCACAF Champions League and a lot of soccer fans don't even know it exists. Therefore it is important to keep the regular season as interesting as possible for all MLS teams and fans. A battle for the last playoff spot is sort of like a relegation battle. Someday when the CONCACAF Champions League gets better TV rating than the UEFA Champions League, we can start talking about using the champion by regular season format. In Europe it isn't that big of a deal if you have no mathematical chance at a league title half way through the season because you can still sneak into the CL with a 4th place finish in nations like Spain and England. That keeps it interesting for the fans. They also have playoffs in the lower divisions in England for the last promotion spot to keep it interesting for the fans since 3rd place doesn't get you anything special like in the EPL.
     
  16. NashSC

    NashSC Member+

    Nashville SC
    United States
    Jan 3, 2018
    #41 NashSC, Dec 9, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2018
    It will be real fun playing a 54 game season when the league is at 28 teams to accommodate your straight table champion. Each season will actually take 2 years cause I am sure you want to accommodate all FIFA breaks too.
     
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  17. Ferdinand Cesarano

    NYCFC
    Sep 21, 2005
    New York City
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Then every team would have to play the same schedule, presumably two games against every other team. That's fine for a league of 23 teams, for which such a format produces a 44-game schedule. But this schedule balloons rapidly; in a 30-team league each team would be playing a season consisting of an unrealistic total of 58 league matches.
     
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  18. NashSC

    NashSC Member+

    Nashville SC
    United States
    Jan 3, 2018
    Even at 44 games it is pretty unrealistic. MLS plays 34 currently and it is hard to fit in any other competitions and can't honor all FIFA breaks.
     
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  19. Ferdinand Cesarano

    NYCFC
    Sep 21, 2005
    New York City
    Club:
    Chelsea FC

    Good point. This is why MLS should eventually split the conferences into divisions.

    Imagine an MLS with 40 teams: 20 teams per conference, each conference consisting of two 10-team divisions. A team would play two games a piece against each divisional opponent, and one game against each team from the other division in its conference. It would then play games against ten teams from the other conference, scheduled on a rotating basis, making a total of 38 games in a season. So you'd face any given team from the other conference every other year.

    For a playoff format, ideally the two first-place teams in a conference's divisions should play each other in one match at the home of the team with more points to determine the conference champ. But MLS could never keep it that simple. So a reasonable playoff format would be to have no. 3 in each division visit no. 2, with the winners visiting the first-place finishers. And then those survivors play a single match for the conference championship.

    This sets up the MLS Cup final, which could be either a single match or, better, a best-of-three series.
     
  20. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The Netherlands have it for Champions league spots, not for League champion.

    Is like the Supporters shield winner not having to play in the playoffs.

    Or maybe it changed.

    But you point stands, lots of leagues have playoffs, and even if they did not, all American leagues have playoffs (even College football now in days), so it makes sense to follow what other American sports leagues do.
     
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  21. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You do know that this is soccer where the score can continue after 1 game, so no need for a best out of what ever.

    1 or 2 game final would do just fine.
     
  22. canammj

    canammj Member+

    Aug 25, 2004
    CHINO, CA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    ==============
    So basically we really don't know what we really want...and we are attempting all of it . Too bad.
    Shield and USOC should be all that matters and winners go to CCL.
    We should to master that first.
     
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  23. NaBUru38

    NaBUru38 Member+

    Mar 8, 2016
    Las Canteras, Uruguay
    Club:
    Club Nacional de Football
    The Brasileirão had playoffs until 2002.

    The Uruguayan championship has playoffs since 1994.
     
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  24. CeltTexan

    CeltTexan Member+

    Sep 21, 2000
    Houston, TX USA
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I do like the one game, win and go home concept that Stuart speaks of. Gives the viewer, where were you when? type of memories and talking points while at the bar with friends or the like. On THAT DAY, the team that shoulda won didn't!
    If MLS HQ wants to find a way to align more with Liga MX, as Garber has stated recently, and yet at the same time stay close to where our league has grown from, yet borrow from the Euro scene then we could witness MLS one day having more than one major trophy to play for in the long regular season.
    I would not go the route of twin Opening and Closing Champions via end of season playoffs like Liga MX with the common Latino Apertura and Clasura culture. Perhaps have one stretch of the MLS season close with a League Cup, with Stuart's suggestion of a one and done format. Then close the regular long MLS season with MLS Cup playoffs as we know it for years now. Thus, each MLS team is playing for the opportunity to win three major trophies and the Shield season after season. The USOC as our national domestic cup, a League Cup solely between MLS clubs half way through the season, then eventually the points race Supporters Shield winner and of course MLS Cup the post season Champion.
    Also, in a world where many clamor for pro/reg and speak of bottom table teams having nothing to play for, then having several trophies to go after eliminates this issue in some manner as the club struggling in the table still as the USOC and a League Cup to make a run in. So even in a terrible MLS league standing run of things, the fan base can look towards some silverware to be earned.
     
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  25. NaBUru38

    NaBUru38 Member+

    Mar 8, 2016
    Las Canteras, Uruguay
    Club:
    Club Nacional de Football
    MLS teams play for the MLS Cup, US Open Cup and Concacaf Champions League. That's enough.
     
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