By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
  1. Dan Loney

    Dan Loney BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 10, 2000
    Cincilluminati
    Club:
    Los Angeles Sol
    Nat'l Team:
    Philippines
    #1 Dan Loney, Oct 17, 2017
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2017

    Stay Home, Crew

    By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
    Serves me right for dawdling. Few things are more amusing to me than someone trying to make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear, and failing miserably. That was Sunil’s press conference. Sure, he brought a lot of it on himself, but still.

    “I don’t think Bruce’s resignation will be enough, sir. They want you to resign, too.”

    “Hm. Time to turn on the ol’ Gulati charm!”

    But we’ll have plenty of time, sadly, to discuss Sunil Gulati. There’s a bigger issue in MLS right now. Anthony Precourt is talking about moving the Columbus Crew to Austin’s city limits.

    “Despite our investments and efforts, the current course is not sustainable,” Anthony Precourt, chief executive officer of Precourt Sports Ventures and chairman of Columbus Crew SC, said. “This Club has ambition to be a standard bearer in MLS, therefore we have no choice but to expand and explore all of our options. This includes a possible move to Austin, which is the largest metropolitan area in North America without a major league sports franchise. Soccer is the world’s game, and with Austin’s growing presence as an international city, combined with its strong multicultural foundation, MLS in Austin could be an ideal fit."

    “As attendance League-wide continues to grow on a record-setting pace, and markets across the country seek to join MLS, Columbus’ situation is particularly concerning,” said MLS Commissioner Don Garber. “Despite PSV’s significant investments and improvements on and off the field, Columbus Crew SC is near the bottom of the League in all business metrics and the Club’s stadium is no longer competitive with other venues across MLS. The League is very reluctant to allow teams to relocate, but based on these factors, we support PSV’s efforts to explore options outside of Columbus, including Austin, provided they find a suitable stadium location.”

    In the words of Talleyrand, “Worse than a crime, a mistake.”

    Usually I'd want to wait until the goldfish actually dies before flushing the toilet, but just announcing this publicly has done a lot of damage. This is an ugly milestone in Major League Soccer – a viable team leaving one market for another. What tiny moral obligation there was for American soccer fans to support MLS for the sake of the sport has evaporated. If you have a favorite MLS team, have a favorite MLS team. But if the soccer gods are capricious, Mammon is even more so. Holding cities hostage for public stadium money is something only the very biggest and greediest teams and leagues can even consider. I’m happy for Garber and Precourt that they think the Crew and MLS are in that category.

    But I think Garber should be taking Mr. Precourt aside gently and telling him Aesop’s fable of the The Boy Who Wrecked Himself Because He Didn’t Check Himself. Precourt is one of Garber’s bosses, but he is only one of Garber’s bosses, and Precourt is more likely to be screwing things up than not.

    In fact, with some care, attention, resources and hard work, it’s possible that this might even do more damage to the league than the US men’s national team missing the World Cup.

    Garber and Precourt at least have the sense to cry poverty, but that doesn’t wash. Wimbledon had no stadium. Spartan Stadium was a poor (but hilarious) stadium for soccer even by 1996 standards, and as I remember San Jose State was sick of the Earthquakes messing up their turf anyway.

    Meanwhile, Columbus Crew Stadium is a soccer-specific stadium. Pretty sure I read that somewhere. Hey, here are some fun facts. It hosted an MLS Cup in 2015, and a World Cup qualifier in 2016. If Yankee Stadium is suitable for Major League Soccer indefinitely, then so is Columbus Crew Stadium.

    Another reason moving teams around is a short-sighted idea is that we’re currently in the middle of an expansion luau. Why should anyone pay an expansion fee when they can just skank an existing team? This may be good for individual owners in middling markets, but owners in more secure markets shouldn’t put up with it. Itinerant teams are less valuable than stable teams. Ask the Spanos family how much the Los Angeles Chargers are pulling in drawing less than the Galaxy.

    This should also go without saying, but just because an immediate dollar value can’t be placed on fan loyalty does not mean that there won’t be financial consequences for abusing that loyalty. There is an event horizon to how much fans will pay for private entertainment at public expense, let alone public expense that continues after the private entertainment leaves town. Again, the Los Angeles Chargers leap to mind – but so does St. Louis, proud owners of the Whatever It’s Called Now Dome.

    If Austin falls through – and these things do have a tendency to mash the undo button – then how does Precourt imagine he will sell any tickets in Ohio? Or, for that matter, in Texas? Overnight Anthony Precourt has taken fan loyalty that was way out of proportion to America’s mainstream acceptance, and tossed in the In-Sink-Erator. If this can happen to Columbus, the league’s first franchise, it can happen to anyone. Everyone’s stadium will be twenty years old someday.

    There are a couple of other fairly obvious business considerations. I don’t know if Precourt has checked the Hexagonal standings, but the quadrennial World Cup bump has been postponed on orders from Bruce Arena and Román Torres. We’re about to find out whether the league can survive without oxygen being pumped in from the US men’s national team, and here’s this freaking guy acting like he owns an NFL team.

    I’m also not sure if Precourt was clued in on the legal front, but the NASL is currently suing MLS as a conspirator to create a monopoly. Precourt moving his franchise states away based on a more attractive stadium deal is providing aid and comfort to the enemy. Even the NASL should be able to get some mileage out of this.

    Even if you buy the premise that this is desirable, there’s no reason to aggravate literally thousands of fans in the middle of a lawsuit, a week after the lowest point in the history of the sport in America. The shortsighted clumsiness of it all is baffling. Toying with the loyalty of fans presupposes the loyalties are there to be toyed with. In 2017, that’s no longer a given, let alone for Major League Soccer. MLS might not be tall enough for this ride.

    If Anthony Precourt wants a team in Austin, then let him have a team in Austin. Right after he sells the Columbus Crew and pays the expansion fee out of the proceeds.
     

Comments

Discussion in 'Articles' started by Dan Loney, Oct 17, 2017.

    1. Atomic Fury

      Atomic Fury BigSoccer Supporter

      Apr 30, 2007
      Pennsylvania
      Club:
      Manchester United FC
      Nat'l Team:
      United States

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      The Columbus to Austin move could have been planned to assuage the latter as part of some backroom deal. Sort of like "We'll make one of our franchises accessible for Austin because we really want Orlando". Weak, but possible.
       
    2. kgilbert78

      kgilbert78 Member+

      Borussia Mönchengladbach
      United States
      Dec 28, 2006
      Cowlumbus, OH
      Club:
      Borussia Mönchengladbach
      Nat'l Team:
      United States

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      While I believe the fix is in, I'm not that much of a conspiracy theorist. As I recall, the Aztex move was a couple years before the Crew were sold. And if I were MLS I might do that for, say, Atlanta. But Austin?? Also, MLS does not control USL and USL teams.
       
      The Franchise repped this.
    3. Unak78

      Unak78 BigSoccer Supporter

      Dec 17, 2007
      PSG & Enyimba FC
      Club:
      Chelsea FC
      Nat'l Team:
      Nigeria

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      Well here's something everyone in the US soccer supportership can agree on...
       
    4. barroldinho

      barroldinho Member+

      Man Utd and LA Galaxy
      England
      Aug 13, 2007
      US/UK dual citizen in HB, CA
      Club:
      Manchester United FC
      Nat'l Team:
      England
      #54 barroldinho, Oct 23, 2017
      Last edited: Oct 23, 2017

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      The sooner sports fans evolve into the consumer equivalent of what our clubs have become, we can cut out this bullshit and force owners to become accountable.

      If you don't like teams being relocated, don't support relocated teams. No disrespect to the commenter who is disappointed at losing the St Louis Rams, but their status as a relocated team apparently didn't matter to you when they were in your city.

      Then again, given the loyalties of many "pro/rel advocates" and MLS detractors, it might be a better idea for Precourt to move the Crew to Catalonia or the Ceremonial County of Lancashire. US soccer fans don't seem to be concerned about supporting soccer teams in those far-removed locations.

      Oh and this doesn't just go for US soccer. The global game has long since tapped into fan loyalty and "support through thick and thin" to keep punters turning up, even though the vast majority of clubs are just annual cannon-fodder for the elite.

      Most weeks, the top European leagues look like an episode of the WWF's Superstars of Wrestling, with the slight difference that a Razor Ramon/1-2-3 Kid angle might occur a bit more often. Though ultimately it typically won't result in a serious push for soccer's equivalents of Sean Waltman.

      Of course, that analogy is probably lost on anyone who isn't a 30+ year old wrestling fan...
       
      Dan Loney, russ and RafaLarios repped this.
    5. don Lamb

      don Lamb Member+

      mine
      United States
      Aug 31, 2017

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      Are we pretending that the Crew have a huge fan base? The reason this is an issue is because nobody is showing up to the games. This for a team that wins consistently and a team that plays with style. If I were the owner, I'd be looking to get out of dodge and find a place that has a real appetite for the game, too.
       
    6. American Brummie

      Jun 19, 2009
      There Be Dragons Here
      Club:
      Birmingham City FC
      Nat'l Team:
      United States

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      Like Austin? Where maybe a dozen people assembled last night for their first gathering?
       
      DAFCrew and The Franchise repped this.
    7. kgilbert78

      kgilbert78 Member+

      Borussia Mönchengladbach
      United States
      Dec 28, 2006
      Cowlumbus, OH
      Club:
      Borussia Mönchengladbach
      Nat'l Team:
      United States

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      Are you a Precourt shill??
       
      DAFCrew repped this.
    8. The Franchise

      The Franchise Member+

      Nov 13, 2014
      Bakersfield, CA
      Club:
      Real Salt Lake
      Nat'l Team:
      United States

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      Possibly. But I lean towards "no" in this case because he has two other posts in August about a different subject, which would indicate a greater degree of foresight in a puppet account than I would attribute to Precourt. So likely a real person taking a position each of us disagrees with.

      But the lack of support in Austin, both among city leaders and the public, should be alarming; it makes Columbus look like Atlanta.
       
    9. RafaLarios

      RafaLarios Member+

      Oct 2, 2009
      Medellín
      Club:
      Atletico Nacional
      Nat'l Team:
      Colombia

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      1-2-3 Kid was the shit... My favourite from that era was Bam Bam Bigelow!.. and of course, Bret "The Hitman" Hart
       
      barroldinho repped this.
    10. Dan Loney

      Dan Loney BigSoccer Supporter

      Mar 10, 2000
      Cincilluminati
      Club:
      Los Angeles Sol
      Nat'l Team:
      Philippines

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      My only take on the "What about Orlando" is that I almost think the MLS promotion justified the move in retrospect. I can't tell a guy not to move if he's going to make that much more money. It's why I have trouble looking back and seeing the Dodgers leaving Brooklyn as a huge huge huge crime.

      Or, for that matter, and I expect to take some heat for this, San Jose to Houston. In 2006 San Jose had no owner AND no stadium. I hope Quakes fans are now okay with how it shook out, and I can understand if they're still mad - but it was more like St. Louis Browns-to-Baltimore than Cleveland Browns-to-Baltimore.

      I just think there are a lot of perfectly sensible reasons why Columbus-to-Austin is a bad idea. There would have to be decisive advantages to justify this amount of anger - unprecedented in MLS for an unprecedented move. I don't see it.
       
      The Franchise repped this.
    11. don Lamb

      don Lamb Member+

      mine
      United States
      Aug 31, 2017

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      Whether or not Austin has much support has little to do with the fact that Columbus is poorly supported. I have yet to hear a good argument for why a very good team with lots of tradition playing the best brand of soccer in the league in their own stadium which is in a decently placed location is struggling so badly at the gate. Can you help me understand why the Columbus market is not supporting this team better?
       
    12. kgilbert78

      kgilbert78 Member+

      Borussia Mönchengladbach
      United States
      Dec 28, 2006
      Cowlumbus, OH
      Club:
      Borussia Mönchengladbach
      Nat'l Team:
      United States

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      If you believe that this team "is struggling so badly at the gate", you are either mistaken or are reading Precourt's propaganda.

      Yes, they are not drawing the crowds Seattle and Atlanta are. We'll see what Atlanta draws after the newness wears off. Seriously. They've managed to lose not one but two NHL teams as no one would come even when the whole upper bowl was $10 a ticket. The Braves used to be unable to sell out first round playoff games.

      Until this season, Crew attendance had been rising--and at that, the average was about 15.5K. That's over 75% of capacity. In 2016, attendance was 17K. 85% of capacity. There's some indication that Precourt's staff did not promote the team in 2017 (no Buck-a-Brat Night for one) like 2016 (until it came time for an early season ticket push for 2018) and there was one thing that really hurt--bad handing of multiple weather delayed games in 2016. In 2015 the team was essentially at capacity for the last two playoff games. Even this season, the Crew were not last in attendance--that goes to FC Dallas--almost in the same market they want to move a team to. Finally, there are some issues with the current location that hurts attendance--the State Fair and Quarter Horse Congress, which essentially prevents use during those events, forcing some home games into early March rather than prime summer and early fall dates. Let's look at markets. The two largest markets in the country are LA and NYC. NYCFC averages 22K, NYRB 21K, and LA 22K. In markets 10 times as large as Columbus.
       
    13. American Brummie

      Jun 19, 2009
      There Be Dragons Here
      Club:
      Birmingham City FC
      Nat'l Team:
      United States

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      I cannot. There are two whole threads (one in the Columbus forum, one in MLS N&A) that provide you with all the information you'll need. @kgilbert78 gave you a sample of that information.

      This horse has got to drink now. The entire world of information is at your fingertips, you need only scroll through it.
       
    14. kgilbert78

      kgilbert78 Member+

      Borussia Mönchengladbach
      United States
      Dec 28, 2006
      Cowlumbus, OH
      Club:
      Borussia Mönchengladbach
      Nat'l Team:
      United States

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      Mr Lamb appears to be a Precourt shill as witness his many, many posts on the Soccer Amercia website--I quote from one:
      1. don Lamb, October 18, 2017 at 9:25 a.m.
        Get this team out of Columbus. If they won't support a very successful team that plays the most attractive style in the league, move to one of the many locations that will.
       
      DAFCrew repped this.
    15. American Brummie

      Jun 19, 2009
      There Be Dragons Here
      Club:
      Birmingham City FC
      Nat'l Team:
      United States

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      This is the most half-assed propaganda operation since...I dunno, the marketing for that stupid JJ Abrams TV show about all the power going out.
       
    16. Mateofelipe

      Mateofelipe Member+

      Mar 10, 2001
      Spokane, WA
      Club:
      Seattle Sounders
      Nat'l Team:
      United States

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      Drifting a bit off topic - sorry Dan - but, Stan, why is San Diego dead for spots 27, 28? 25, 26, sure. But I don't get why everybody is sticking the fork already for the later spots.
       
    17. don Lamb

      don Lamb Member+

      mine
      United States
      Aug 31, 2017

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      I have posted on SBI and SA under this name on many subjects for a while... You can pretend I'm a "Precourt shill" if you want, though. You continue to bring up data about other markets that has nothing to do with Columbus' issue. The info that there was no Buck-a-Brat night this year and that the Fair are hurting attendance might be telling. The market simply might not be there.

      When I watch on tv, the stands are mostly empty (the corner stands where the supporters' section is notwithstanding). I take it most Columbus supporters posting here are the ones in that section -- kudos to you. It would sincerely suck for you to lose your team, but it just seems like there is an attititude of indifference about the club outside of the hardcore supporters.

      As for spending even more of my day scrolling through pages of this stuff, I'm good... I do appreciate you sharing your perspective, however.
       
    18. kgilbert78

      kgilbert78 Member+

      Borussia Mönchengladbach
      United States
      Dec 28, 2006
      Cowlumbus, OH
      Club:
      Borussia Mönchengladbach
      Nat'l Team:
      United States

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      If you haven't been here then you have no idea of what you are talking about. I've seen your comments elsewhere. Nothing but insults to this city. Are you from Michigan or something?

      Remember one thing. Where are the TV cameras? They look east. More fans sit on the west side due to the sun. You won't see them on TV. And I do not sit/stand in the supporters section. Never have (well maybe once). An average attendance--this season--of 15K is hardly indifference. Even if you are correct, why Texas? The team with the last place in attendance is Dallas. Houston is close. So they want to move a team into the middle of that? Insanity.
       
      don Lamb repped this.
    19. (They call him) RMc

      Jun 1, 2013
      Club:
      Celtic FC

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      MLS' anti-marketing is sometimes awesome to behold. What other league can't even get all of their flippin' playoff games on a national, English-language TV channel? (No, UniMas + SAP doesn't count. How many casual fans want to wrestle with their TVs just to hear the game en Inglés?)
       
    20. American Brummie

      Jun 19, 2009
      There Be Dragons Here
      Club:
      Birmingham City FC
      Nat'l Team:
      United States

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      Or you could learn Spanish.
       
    21. The Franchise

      The Franchise Member+

      Nov 13, 2014
      Bakersfield, CA
      Club:
      Real Salt Lake
      Nat'l Team:
      United States

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      Seems like a lot to get done in a few hours.
       
    22. kgilbert78

      kgilbert78 Member+

      Borussia Mönchengladbach
      United States
      Dec 28, 2006
      Cowlumbus, OH
      Club:
      Borussia Mönchengladbach
      Nat'l Team:
      United States

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      Nah, all you need to know is

      Goooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooollllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
       
    23. American Brummie

      Jun 19, 2009
      There Be Dragons Here
      Club:
      Birmingham City FC
      Nat'l Team:
      United States

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      Pretty much.
       
    24. don Lamb

      don Lamb Member+

      mine
      United States
      Aug 31, 2017

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      Because you have to speak Spanish in order to watch a game presented in Spanish?

      I was just beginning to gain some respect for you Coumbus fans, but now you sound like weenies.
       
    25. American Brummie

      Jun 19, 2009
      There Be Dragons Here
      Club:
      Birmingham City FC
      Nat'l Team:
      United States

      Stay Home, Crew

      By Dan Loney on Oct 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM
      You're demanding that the 40 million Americans who speak Spanish as their primary language only watch MLS games in English. But heaven forbid you learn a thousand words of Spanish to follow along on Univision.
       

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