State of the Revs

Discussion in 'New England Revolution' started by NFLPatriot, Jun 26, 2017.

  1. Soccer Doc

    Soccer Doc Member+

    Nov 30, 2001
    Keene, NH
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Which one gets fired first-- Jay Heaps or Ben Olson?
     
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  2. TOAzer

    TOAzer Member+

    The Man With No Club
    May 29, 2016
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Ben Olsen.
     
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  3. rkane1226

    rkane1226 Member+

    Apr 9, 2000
    Club:
    Stade Brestois 29
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Since the non signing of Jones and the signing of Kouassi the former has played approximately 17 MLS games while the latter has played 12 (at least according to Wikipedia)

    I'd say neither would count as good signings in retrospect but it seams that the Revs are excellent at defying conventional wisdom. Wasn't the younger replacement, who additionally would focus on club play, supposedly going to be more dependable and make more appearances?

    Any word on Kouassi's return? I didn't think he was much of an impact player but at least he'd be a warm body during Gold Cup.
     
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  4. a517dogg

    a517dogg Member+

    Oct 30, 2005
    Rochester, NY
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    I think Kouassi was a very good signing. His injury was not really foreseeable, other than the fact that the Revs cheaped out and didn't buy him in the winter transfer window, instead letting his contract run out to pick him up on a free. On the other hand, it was very foreseeable that Jones would both miss games (his 6 game ban, USMNT duty, and inevitable injuries and age) and that his level of play would decline with age.

    Bengston was a good signing that didn't pan out for unknown reasons. Kouassi is a good signing that I still expect to work out. Just because the eventual results don't materialize doesn't mean the signing was a bad idea. The main problem is that we get one or two signings like this per season, rather than multiple.

    I believe Kouassi was expected to miss 4 weeks after his peg-leg goal performance.
     
  5. goussoccer

    goussoccer Member+

    May 23, 2001
    Avon, CT
    As Bill Parcells is often quoted as saying: "You are what your record says you are."

    The Revs have played over half the season and their record says they stink:
    1. Fifth worst record in all of MLS
    2. We are 8 points from a playoff spot
    3. Three of the four teams between us and a playoff spot all have at least a game in hand on us. The team we have 2 games in hand on is 8 points ahead of us.
    4. We are entering the hot part of the season and are missing players due to USMNT call ups (which you hope your players get) and injuries (which you know will happen) and we have very limited depth.
     
  6. NFLPatriot

    NFLPatriot Member+

    Jun 25, 2002
    Foxboro, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #31 NFLPatriot, Jul 5, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2017
    Revs opponents in Sept and Oct (final 9 games), current place in Conf (PPG):
    Code:
    ORL  - 5th
    MON  - 8th
    @ATL - 4th
    @SKC - 2nd West
    TOR  - 2nd
    @ORL - 5th
    ATL  - 4th
    NYC  - 3rd
    @MON - 8th
    
    7 playoff teams, plus 2 with MON who could be a playoff team by then.

    Counting on that late season run might not be such a good plan this year...
     
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  7. firstshirt

    firstshirt Member+

    Bayern München
    United States
    Mar 1, 2000
    Ellington, CT / NK, RI
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I heard that....Also heard Brian Ching was Hawaiian
     
  8. dncm

    dncm Member+

    Apr 22, 2003
    Boston
  9. Revs in 2010

    Revs in 2010 Member+

    Feb 29, 2000
    Roanoke, VA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    dncm repped this.
  10. Argyle

    Argyle Member

    Jan 31, 2002
    Plymouth, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Scouts?
     
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  11. rkane1226

    rkane1226 Member+

    Apr 9, 2000
    Club:
    Stade Brestois 29
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Gosh, I wish I could remember what I meant when I said, "...neither would count as good signings in retrospect..." I do agree with the "cheaped out" comment.

    I can't agree with "or two." The REVs don't make as many as 1 signing on the Jones or Kouassi scale per year (and, like it or not, @890K the Kouassi signing is several steps down from the Jones signing). For a team that claims to be in to analytics, they should really analyze their success in signing (for them) high dollar players. If you only get 1/4 or 1/5 of your big signings right, you might either need to change the person or persons doing the picking and/or sign more players per year.

    Thank you
     
  12. a517dogg

    a517dogg Member+

    Oct 30, 2005
    Rochester, NY
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    So Jones is the biggest signing of our history, and Kouassi is the 2nd biggest history. So obviously we don't make one or two signings like that per year. But this past offseason, we made two big signings (needed 4 - LB and LW). 2015-2016 offseason, we signed Kouassi. 2014-2015, we (re-)signed Agudelo, so 1. The offseason before that, Jones. The offseason before that, we signed Goncalves. Then the offseason before that, Bengston, Nguyen, Moreno, Lozano, Imbongo, Lechner, Toja, & other players in our big overhaul.

    Oof that's fewer than I thought. Past 5 years, 6 overseas signings including the return of Agudelo. However basically all of them have been successful players here except for Kouassi due to injury who gets an incomplete.
     
  13. Doublecard

    Doublecard Guest

    Was Jogo really successful, though? He was on loan in 2013, and was spectacular. Then we signed him with a large pay cut he didn't expect, and his performance on the field dropped considerably.
     
  14. Cannons

    Cannons Member+

    May 16, 2005
    Maybe he should coach the Celtics then?
     
  15. patfan1

    patfan1 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 19, 1999
    Nashua, NH
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Just to correct the terminology, Jones and Kouassi weren't offseason signings. Not speaking to the others since I don't remember most of them.
     
  16. rkane1226

    rkane1226 Member+

    Apr 9, 2000
    Club:
    Stade Brestois 29
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm lost. I think you concluded about 1 signing per year but I'm not sure. Can we agree they aren't making enough good signings?

    Can you clarify, "But this past offseason, we made two big signings (needed 4 - LB and LW)." I think you mean Delemea and Angoua? Can you also clarify, "basically all of them have been successful players here?"

    So, I'm guessing your 6 are Jones, Kouassi, Aguedelo, Delemea, Angoua and Goncalves? Successful is somewhat subjective, obviously, but I think Angoua and Agudelo (the second coming) are still In-completes, with Kouassi making 3 In completes. Further exemplifying subjectivity, Jones, while a success in my book, was a half season flash in the pan for many.

    Finally, being successful here may be a poor standard. Making a team that is generally struggling to fill roster spots and getting playing time on that short handed team is a pretty low bar. In the post Steve Nicol era, the results are pretty much speaking volumes.
     
  17. NFLPatriot

    NFLPatriot Member+

    Jun 25, 2002
    Foxboro, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Armchair Analyst: Contenders, the Hunt & all 22 MLS teams by tier revisited
    July 6, 2017, 5:51PM EDT
    Matthew Doyle
    Senior Writer

    Revs are at the bottom of Tier 3: "Will they figure it out?", with only 4 teams below them in Tier 4: "Overhaul"

    New England Revolution:
     
  18. a517dogg

    a517dogg Member+

    Oct 30, 2005
    Rochester, NY
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Sort of. They signed the pre-contract with him in the off season and he was supposed to arrive after his season was done, in the middle of ours.

    I'd say he was successful. He wasn't the monster in 2014 that he was in 2013, but he was still good.

    Right, the two big signings were Delamea and Angoua. I'd say Delamea has been 100% a success, and Angoua is looking likely to be successful. I also would say Agudelo has been successful here in his 2nd stint (21 goals, averaging a goal every 196 minutes). And Jones dragged us to the cup final by the scruff of the neck, so obv a success, even if the FO didn't do anything to get him.

    So yes, I had originally overestimated the number of offseason signings they've made - really they've made one a year (less if we consider that Jones was more of a gift than a signing). So while, in my opinion, the signings they have made have been successful, it's also really sad that they can only manage to make one per year except this past offseason when they made two.
     
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  19. NFLPatriot

    NFLPatriot Member+

    Jun 25, 2002
    Foxboro, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Armchair Analyst: As the window opens, a look at roster needs
    July 10, 2017, 2:29PM EDT
    Matthew Doyle

     
  20. NFLPatriot

    NFLPatriot Member+

    Jun 25, 2002
    Foxboro, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Making my point:

    Strength of Schedule Rankings: How hard is your team's remaining schedule?
    July 13, 2017, 9:07AM EDT
    Benjamin Baer

    Only PHI has a more difficult schedule than the Revs for the rest of the season.
     
  21. RevsLiverpool

    RevsLiverpool Member+

    Nov 12, 2005
    Boston
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    We also have to consider matchups. The revs have struggled against the likes of DC and Philly - and everyone else - away. The old NYRB guaranteed point in Foxboro has vanished so we can't count on that. Oddly, they gave Chicago a fight at home and beat TFC at home, but looked like a USL side away to both clubs, so go figure. Hard to imagine the revs picking up more than a fluke win on the road this season. I doubt they will run the table at home but they may surprise us and beat a couple good teams at home then wilt on the road like usual.

    It all adds up to why this revs team is such an inconsistent enigma, halfway through the season.
     
  22. a517dogg

    a517dogg Member+

    Oct 30, 2005
    Rochester, NY
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    This whole thread could have been one post.

    State of the Revs: bad.
     
  23. dncm

    dncm Member+

    Apr 22, 2003
    Boston
    Finally, Doyle sees the light regarding the Revs:

    https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2017/07/12/armchair-analyst-midseason-grades-all-22-mls-teams

    New England Revolution: D
    The Revs allowed themselves to get to the point where they needed to sign an entirely new crop of central defenders. Only one of those guys (Antonio Delamea) has been up to the job. They also dragged their feet on some potentially useful offseason trades, and may have bet too soon on a young-ish goalkeeper who looks quite like he could use another year of seasoning. Plus defensive midfield continues to be a sore spot – Xavier Kouassi has once again been mostly injured, and on-loan Gershon Koffie has not been as influential as he was last year (in between his own injuries).

    The occasionally breathtaking attack and very good underlying numbers, in terms of chance creation and expected goals, has not been enough to make up for all of the above. New England are now eight points below the red line, are winless on the road, and have just eight home games left.

    It's tough math.
     
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  24. patfan1

    patfan1 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 19, 1999
    Nashua, NH
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    When even Doyle has given up on you, you know it's bad.

    I miss the days of arguing with people here about how the team was actually better than it's record, how Heaps was a great coach and how Burns was doing a great job. Man, those were fun times.
     
  25. Feldspar

    Feldspar Member+

    Nov 19, 1998
    Boston, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm still not convinced that the Revs aren't actually better than their record, at least in terms of their players and how they could be used. But Heaps will never be able to develop the schemes to make them produce. And Burns will never do more than is necessary to patch the most gaping holes - proactive moves that improve the team appear to be beyond his capacity. (And having one smart field general would go a long way too, considering our dearth of footballing brains on and off the field.)
     
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