not even starting, lol. Hamburg will not help him develop. Very frustrating that he stayed out of personal attachment to a relegated club, which is admirable but won't help him much. When Lasogga is fit he blocks Arp and when he's not fit than Hwang (whos on loan) blocks him.
Hwang missed several important chances including a sitter at the end, and was given a game worst 5 rating. http://www.sportbuzzer.de/artikel/hsv-einzelkritik-union-berlin-2-liga-noten-bewertung/
so he could have won the game? Not surprising, haven't impressed by a single game I've seen of Hamburg when it comes to Hwang. Hamburg is an annoying club, they are barely giving any of their Academy players any chances. Tons of pro contract over the Summer that amounted to nothing. Instead they bring in 3 players on loan and those 3 are in the XI. So how will that help them next season if they go back to 1BL? One of the 3 on loan has already been confirmed will not be permanent either. Hwang isn't worth it either. Not only clubs reluctant to give chances in 1BL it's even the case in 2BL.
With Bernhard Peters now gone it looks like HSV's academy development and youth integration program will get only worse from now on.
Well i thought 2000ers like Jonas David, Vagnoman an Arp are starting to get minutes. They are still eligible for U19 and............just finished their abitur, why so rush n panic? HSV do give them chances but they take it slowly. U cant have all youngsters at once. I think Arp is experiencing a slump in form. When i watched the four nations tournament for U19, he didnt show too much promises. well he could play but he only scored a penalty goal n didnt create much threat. Hottmann for example showed more on the pitch when he played, even as a sub in first two games. He needs to find that instinct back
not sure how anyone is panicking for criticizing the lack of Academy players? That makes no sense whatsoever. An observation about a club's actions is not panicking. as for rushing, they aren't 15 year old kids. They are soon to be 19 years old, how is that rushing? Some with pro contracts are 20+ too. I find it very ironic that anytime someone wants a youth player to get playing time the response is why the rush? Do people forget that vast majority of the current senior NT players started as regular pros between 17-19. or what about all these foreign youth kids that are 20 and less, those are perfectly fine but don't bring up the German kids, they can't make it until 22+. David hasn't played for Hamburg since August, Vagnoman since Sept. Vagnoman makes the bench but doesn't come off and none of these guys are U19 they play in II. And their time in 1st team is between 40-60 minutes played all season. Wintzheimer unused bench player. And all the other players that got pro contracts nothing whatsoever. and this isn't 1BL it's 2BL too. Arp hadn't played for the NT in over a year, you think it'll click easily again. I have watched Hamburg play the striker barely has chances to score in most games. They tend to just draw.distract players while others score.
U dont get it Other than Amenyido and Warschewski, who did U19 get last year when Jojo, Serra and Daferner were injured? Not much Not saying Amenyido was our "star striker", everyone including himself should've known he is just there because our three star strikers were injured. Those 3 could've made a difference. But Warschewski, Amenyido, Stark, Kafferbitz or Berisha............in my opinion didnt make a difference because they are basically average talents. And one thing, Owusu Tietz were struggling, Reese was struggling, why does it make a difference? Do u seriosuly think Owusu or Tietz are better prospect than Reese? I dont rate them all. Do u think playing Tietz couldve made something happened? Looking back, i dont see DFB choosing the wrong players because the players are pretty and in 1997 n 1998 anyway. U only have 3 decent strikers in the 1998 age group and none in 1997...........thats not good enough. If u blame DFB for selecting the wrong players? the fact is u are choosing between mediocres.........blame then blame the clubs which cant develop strikers anymore and are completely lost in that regard. Too many lacked elements in our striker talents, not only scoring. Haters gonna hate (n why bother to complain about DFB EVERY post? why do u need to support Germany? too much negative energy in these posts.........and we are talking about EVERY POST) Now, we need to let our strikers to have the right mindset, before talking about scoring goals n being technical. Some strikers do not have to be prolific and skilled but extremely serviceable n tactical on the pitch : Welbeck, Giroud and Dyzuba are a few. We dont have the right mindset in our strikers, avoiding duels, afraid of body contacts, think they can dominate the game enough without using headers, neglecting set-pieces, dont press enough, being a poacher n waiting for chances inside the box .............. Thats something to do with mindset more than anything else. Being prolific or skilled .......its not the only way to judge strikers. Welbeck is a joke in terms of finsihing but when hes on the pitch he makes hell a lot of difference
19 so? the whole football industry are delaying the devleopment of youngsters. 19/20 started first pro match is normal everywhere and Germany have Abitur, they were taking the exams (which is mandatory in Germany) this summer. Some 2000ers have even not finished their academics and its tough for them to do two at once. They are in school during the day then go back to training at night then travel back home to complete their assignments in school. How can they focus on football alone when they are like that? And in fact, if u look at talents in Europe, they have their first pro debut at 19/20 and break out at 21/20.............thats the majority. Medical are getting better, older players' peak can last longer. U are talking about abandoning Lasogga, he is 26/27, not old at all ..........n has been doing all these dirty work up front. People are just focusing on scoring or not but in fact he is a key to diverse socring threat instead of focusing on one striker alone.
Everyone is thinking he is smarter than others. Some people in DFB arent stupid and i think Frank Kramer n Wuck are actually not as stupid as people suggested. They simply have some issues with the options available. Clubs arent devleoping their talents well enough, we arent producing enough top talents. As Kuntz has stated, we used to produce 7 good prospects in each age group, we now have 2. (some age groups maybe 1) DFB have nothing to do with it........... and normally if u are average talent, u dont get starting appearance before 19. The development of strikers have been a shock among clubs. DFB simply have no one to choose from in a few agr groups Blame the clubs instead of DFB.
agree to disagree. lol about the negative energy part and criticizing dfb. DFB is incompetent and German football has tons of issues, let's not pretend everything is merry. I highlighted tons of issues over the last year and half that ended up blowing up in Germany's faces, while people thought we were doing ok. this is a forum, where does it say, Only + posts allowed? and my posts aren't all negative. That's just your usual exaggeration. sure school is the issue that's why tons of the recent German Internationals made it before 19.
Like Asllani , ive been talking to Timon Burmeister, Lazar Samardzic and Tim Schrieber in the last few days, YEs Asllani has been scoring goals, but for some reasons they all said he is not a good player...............i dont know why tho Not saying he wont make it at pro, he might. But looks like he is still not rated despite scoing tons this season. They might have their reasons Always blaming dual-nationals is pointless. Germany as a country had aging issue and they relied a lot on immigrants n dual-nationals . They brought u 300 dual nationals or immigrants players who have German passport in each age group, 10-20 go for other country seems normal as its like less than 10% Without dual-national, German football couldve been worse than Dutch
Well thats not the majority right? Havertz, Arne Maier, Yeboah, Mai n co make their debut at 17/18..........but they arent the majority And academically, everyone is different. Everyone has a different development path, no need to rush n rush n rush Sometimes too much pressure for a youngster at 18 isnt good. Johannes Eggestein told me exactly the same. the press was expecting too much from him n overhyping him, gives him unneccesary pressure at that age. so club take him slowly might be a good thing, now he is playing without that massive pressure. HE finished his abitur and took a year learning n adapting pro football. sometimes its good for youngsters in long term. Even he started slightly later than expected
eh when did I ever blame dual nationals for anything? It's their choice to make who they want to play. All I ever said was there is a growing number of them and in the future our player pool will shrink as more and more countries go after them. and it's not 10-20 per age group, just recently Bosnia had like 7 German-Bosnians in 1 age group as an example. that's not blaming that's the reality of things and things to come. Imagine in the future huge majority German pros in 1BL are duals. How many will end playing for Germany? Currently vast majority of the 1BL pros are full Germans. So it's not an issue yet. maybe Asllani is like Tekin not as rated, missing elements in his game.
I'm not talking about youth NT players, I'm talking about the senior NT players, majority of them made their debut before 20.
I think the problem is clubs arent producing enough good talents, as Kuntz suggested. I actually didnt see the talents i like in 1997 n maybe 1-2 in 1998, 2001 is bad other than OBM ......... so we have to wait until they have updated the training method. The current training/youth devleopment program are based on Spain's, something we learnt from a few years ago. But now we see too many setbacks and its time for another update again talents starting around 20 is becoming normal. I think the increasing power of the press plays a big role too. Moukoko's agent said the media are focusing too much on his client on n of the pitch at such young age, also causing problems to his family n schoolmates. Eggestein told me he was so hyped in 2016, and that gave him too much pressure that he cant focus on football alone. Club was trying to protect him n until now since he is less hyped n he can really focus on football. Jojo said he thinks its the best idea if he looks back Maxi Eggestein's pro season was pretty close to 20 years old. I think he is making good progress; i know Neuhaus' pro season was like 18/19 but this is his first season in 1BL at 21, still doing GREAT. You dont needa compare everyone (majority) to Timo Werner, Havertz If i remember correctly, Hummels also had his pro debut game around 19/20
The stupid part is U are talking about NT players here, majority of them are top top stars in BL when they were young. so they started their pro debut at 18 We also have HAvertz, Maier n Yeboah doing that. If 1999 can contribute 2-3 NT calbre prospects, 2000 can contribute 2-3 as well, that will be good Of coz i m not saying Havertz, Maier n co are "sure thing".........but we can have some late bloomers too The dual-national part, i completely disagree. We have like 250-350 dual-nationals per age group. We actually hv more options because of the dual-nationals. even 30-40 opt for other countries we are still having more advantages than disadvantages
Kuntz is talking about top top talents. Who says clubs need that? Let's be honest huge amount of players in 1BL are rubbish to begin with. So the idea that clubs only need top talents doesn't make sense. Maxi Eggestein made his debut as a 17 year old. Actually Hummels made his pro debut at 18. I'm not sure why it bothers you if another poster wants to see young players breakthrough. Big deal, to each their own.
not sure I get the logic those duals are Germans to begin. Never argued against duals or what they bring. But eventually if your whole pool is dual. Even an amazing prospect will end up being left out for lack of space. You have to remember there is no age groups in senior NT. All the players are "competing" with each other for limited spots. and not sure why you even brought up the dual convo in the striker thread to begin with.
after being out yesterday's match, Lasogga is out for the next 3 weeks. Schlechte Neuigkeiten erreichten uns heute von unserer medizinischen Abteilung. @Lasogga10 hat sich einen Muskelfaserriss in der Wade zugezogen und wird rund drei Wochen ausfallen. Gute Besserung Lasso! #nurderHSV pic.twitter.com/J0TzzQK4FS— Hamburger SV (@HSV) November 27, 2018
I think Kuntz meant talents who are capable of making the 1BL And if u look at 97,98, 01. He is right, I can’t see too many talents who are capable to start REGULARLy in 1BL, n that’s my perspectives. U don’t have to be top talents but I just can’t see the talent in some of the age groups T21plus management scout Gary Gordon told me After a U17 match last year. The 2001 played and he said he couldn’t see anyone interesting Of coz things might change 3,4,5 years later... but our talents are bad in certain age groups. Hummels and Max Eggestein (last season) didn’t start regularly until 20. Eggestein’s breakout is this season. Hummels made his debut but it’s until he changed to Dortmund where he had his chance regularly Point is, no point to rush everyone to make debut at 17/18 in Germany. If u are superb talent like Havertz, Arp or Werner, it’s ok. But the game isn’t like that, only great talents have such privilege... n start becoming first team regular at 19 Others ? Debut at 19 and becoming XI regular at 21/22 . We see very often Striker is a difficult position because it really depends on the veteran striker. They are 27-31, they won’t be considered as old n need to be replaced. Strikers’ path started later nowadays n ended slightly later (34-35 are still serviceable) Most teams play 4231 or 433 or 343, with one veteran striker so it’s passive. If team start with 2-strikers in 352 or 442 that’s another story. Jojo Eggestein actually said he prefers to start now than 2 years ago. The media also play a role, giving them too much pressure Now, he’s less hyped and can focus on football a lot better. It’s not only about physique for Eggestein, he was also under so much unnecessary pressure.
When fans n media are saying “this striker talent is good enough to start every game” Maybe that’s something the player himself n the coaches doesn’t wanna hear. Not everyone is enjoying this
Lasogga could potentially miss the rest of the Hinrunde too. Injuries being something way too common in his career.
guy's a weird case, fits in perfectly in the lost talent thread yet at the same time he's never been extremely horrible. Was also very close to getting min 1 cap for Germany senior before of course injuring himself. when it comes to 2BL he's basically at 30 goals/assists in 45 games. when it comes to 1BL he's at 1 goal/assist every 3 games on average. yet dude seems somewhat fat, lazy, slow, doesn't make much effort either. The Leeds fans turned on him for not convincing enough. Tend to find present day Lasogga's greatest asset is his header but not much else.
looks like Hwang is still ahead of Arp according to reports. speaking of 2BL, it's interesting how much Klos/Voglsammer have barely done anything this season.And those 2 are the ones who are blocking Owusu.
That's a shame, especially with Lasogga out injured right now. Hopefully Arp can get some starts in the remaining matches of the Hinrunde. Seems like HSV are giving him less time than even last season.