I never said anything about "visions of grandeur". It's all about putting the cart before the horse. He was trying to be overly generous when, realistically, he couldn't afford to. You don't use revenue for charity when you're not yet making a profit.
They were making a profit. The Scorpions were very good financially. That is why some that think losing the Scorpions is really a positive for NASL. Since that profit was never turned back into the team. Like it could have. Look your losing the battle when it comes to Mr. Hartman. He was a great owner initially, and if he started out in USL, and that was as high as the team would go. The problem is that the success and the market was to much for his goals. He would be a great owner (outside of Cornfield) he was very cool to talk to and interact with the fans. To me if he was the owner of Rio Grande. As an example it would be a perfect fit. IMO That is what to me will be the hard part of switching from Mr. Hartman to SSE is that basically your going from a mom and pops store to Corporate stores. And each have their good and bad.
Scorpions were profitable ... it wasn't a matter of being overly generous, as it was the point of the venture.
Why are you acting as if I'm slighting Hartman? I haven't thrown one personal slight at him; I certainly haven't intended to. It's clear he's made bad decisions in his businesses. That doesn't, by default, make him a bad person. The Scorpions were doing great. So why are they are on the verge of folding? Why did Hartman have to sell the stadium?
The direction of the NASL changed ... The high water mark came sooner than he thought it would ... He (without bigger investors) cannot take the club to the MLS (which he knew) ... They're on the verge of folding because SS&E is the entity that swooped in and they have no regard or interest for anything that isn't "theirs" ... (see Iguanas VS Rampage hockey)
That doesn't happen magically overnight. And it ignores the state of the Scorpions. SS&E is powerful enough, and has enough resources, that they could've done things with no regard to the Scorpions. You know, things like building their own stadium. "The direction of the NASL changed"? That's something I'd expect if it were the Strikers, RailHawks, or FC Edmonton we were talking about. One of the weaker teams in the NASL in terms of attendance. The Scorpions were one of the stronger teams. That excuse simply doesn't fly in this case. I don't buy that Hartman had to sell to the City and County in a vacuum. I don't buy making SS&E villains or bullies in this situation. It simply doesn't add up.
Except for the part where the city has to agree to things ... which they didn't (see Alamo Stadium plan). See, SS&E demands and wants certain things ... which is how they were beaten to the punch. What state is being ignored exactly? The club turns a profit ... so the only dire straights playing around here is on the radio. How does the fact that the NASL's stance and approach has changed only apply to select teams in the league? THAT doesn't fly. ... which only illustrates that the only thing you know about the situation, is what you read or observe second hand. Hartman had been trying to find either bigger investment and/or an outright buyer BEFORE now. It didn't pan out (despite more than one group having plenty of interest). Is that something you didn't know, or are just omitting because why not? ... but yes, go on thinking that SS&E and their agreements/presence with the city has zero to do with the fact that it just so happens to be them that it all falls to ... ... yes, it is merely nothing more than coincidence or them benefiting from circumstance. Sure. Also ignore the fact that while they were spinning their feet and weren't getting the Alamo Stadium thing done, Hartman stepped forward with words AND action AND money, and held talks with them to be involved ... BUT SS&E wanted to be in the driver's seat despite not buying the car.
sure is quite in San Antonio.. wonder when the next news breaks from either SSE or the Scorpions/Hartman
I have a lot of respect for what Gordon Hartman has done. We are all soccer fans but his Morgan's Wonderland is a more special cause and something pretty unique he's done. It's clear that has always been his priority. He can now fund the park with his proceeds. Mission accomplished as well as making soccer established in SA. It's sad to see the Scorpions go from NASL. I know you guys want MLS and not the NASL model so maybe that doesn't seem sad to you. Whether the Spurs can close the deal on MLS or whether they move soccer in SA backwards is not on Gordon Hartman. He did his part. I have lots of respect for what he is doing for those children and that's bigger than a sport.
So what would be the latest that you think the Spurs can delay this announcement? At some point, USL needs to set its schedule and to toss a team together in what 2-3 months is that really possible? They have the frame work of the Scorpions, even if the team is not sold I guess they could use. But starting to get wonder if its going to be a soccerless San Antonio this year. I think the announcement has to come this week .. right?
Several USL teams started late last year. Charlotte and Colorado Springs started late last year I believe. While not ideal it can happen.
the big USL league meeting is this week. Typically this is the week where teams work on schedules, shared practices etc. if its going to happen I would think this week they would need to know for scheduling
Only the MLS owned teams were announced late in 2014 for the 2015 season. Colorado Springs announced their 2015 start late in 2013. Tulsa announced in December of 2013. Charlotte Independence announced that they would be taking over the Charlotte Eagles USL slot for the 2015 season in January of 2014. St. Louis was announced in May of 2014. Louisville City announced in June of 2014. Austin announced that they were moving up from the PDL in June of 2014. Most of the MLS-owned teams new for 2015 were announced in September and October of 2014. The latest 2015 announcement overall was by the Red Bulls in January of 2015 but they had went back and forth before that. If the Spurs are acquiring the Scorpions and using existing staff, contracts, etc, then they could probably still get going for 2016. In that regard they would be sort of like the Red Bulls. And they do have an existing organization. So it could happen. But it is late.
Well its this week or bust for SSE to announce if they are going to play this year? I think they have to get the announcement done before Wednesday. Then the question comes how fast and how much quality can they get on the pitch and the stadium re-branded in the next three months.
To follow up on newtex's point: 07/02/2013 - Oklahoma City announced as USL Pro franchise for 2014. 12/05/2013 - Colorado Springs announced as USL Pro franchise for 2015. 12/18/2013 - Tulsa announced as USL Pro franchise for 2015. 01/15/2014 - Reports of new Charlotte group buying Charlotte Eagles' USL Pro franchise for 2015. 01/29/2014 - Los Angeles Galaxy II announced as USL Pro franchise for 2014. 03/13/2014 - Arizona United replaces Phoenix FC in USL Pro for 2014. 05/01/2014 - St. Louis announced as USL Pro franchise for 2015. 06/04/2014 - Orlando's USL Pro franchise announces move to Louisville for 2015. 06/10/2014 - Austin announces move up to USL Pro for 2015. 09/17/2014 - Charlotte Independence announced as USL Pro franchise for 2015, replacing Charlotte Eagles (who drop to the PDL). 10/14/2014 - Portland Timbers 2 and Seattle Sounders FC 2 announced as USL Pro franchises for 2015. 11/03/2014 - Real Monarchs SLC announced as USL Pro franchise for 2015. 11/17/2014 - FC Montreal announced as USL Pro franchise for 2015. 11/21/2014 - Vancouver Whitecaps 2 announced as USL Pro franchise for 2015. 07/15/2015 - Rio Grande Valley FC announced as USL franchise for 2016. 08/12/2015 - FC Cincinnati announced as USL franchise for 2016. 08/19/2015 - Lehigh Valley announced as USL franchise for 2016. 09/16/2015 - Reno announced as USL franchise for 2017. 10/15/2015 - Orlando City B announced as USL franchise for 2016. 10/22/2015 - Swope Park Rangers KC announced as USL franchise for 2016.
Announcement tomorrow- Please join us at 10 a.m. tomorrow at Toyota Field for an announcement on the future of soccer in SA. Commemorative shirts to the first 500!— San Antonio FC (@SanAntonioFC) December 21, 2015
Looks like Black/Silver colors, Red as an accent color (helps with the stadium seating) and they'll start in 2016?!
Since SSE already essentially has staff enough to market and sell tickets for not only their NBA team but AHL, NBA-DL, WNBA teams ... getting that stuff off the ground for 2016 shouldn't be a HUGE undertaking. The technical staff is another thing. Will be interested to watch how it goes. The Stadium "rebranding" can be done over time.
I saw Tim Hankinson at the press conference today. Is he going to be the coach? The whole organization is gearing us to make it into MLS. They sounded very optumistic that we will be in MLS in the not too distant future.
Yep, Tim Hankinson was hired earlier this month to be the new Indy Eleven head coach. He might not have moved yet.