both Ronaldo and Romario were the LAZIEST dude in football - they almost NEVER trained ... or pretend to train with the team if being forced ... (it's sad to say such, but equally it's an amazing thing to happen in Football) Look at Figo's interview in 2009 about Ronaldo and his idols ... Luis Figo: One-on-One 28 March 2009 Inter and Portugal legend Luis Figo answers FourFourTwo readers' questions back in March 2009. Q: In 1996-97, Ronaldo scored 34 goals in 37 games. What was it like to play with him when he was at his best? Figo: Ronaldo was just amazing. He was born with this special talent for football. His strength, speed and skills were unique. Some players work 14 hours a day and they just can’t reach a high level. Ronaldo almost didn’t need to practise to be a great player. I don’t think I ever had a team-mate who achieved such impressive figures in just one season. ======================================= Q: Other than Eusebio, who were your heroes growing up? Figo: To be honest, Eusebio was not among my big idols because I never saw him play. I was more a fan of the great players from the 1980s, especially after the 1982 World Cup. There was Maradona, Zico... in Portugal, Fernando Chalana and Paulo Futre, both of them wingers. I guess we all have a tendency to like guys who play in the same positions as we �do, right? Read more at http://www.fourfourtwo.com/features/luis-figo-one-one#PkdQjliZW8VseARX.99
WC94 Romario 25 dribbles WC98 Ronaldo 16 dribbles WC02 Ronaldo 11 dribbles Probably interest to some. @greatstriker11 @giles varley @JamesBH11
I do not know where you got that? By Opta, Duel won: Romario94 39 , Ronaldo98 41 and Ronaldo02 31 Foul won: Romario94 11, Ronaldo98 20, and Ronaldo02 14 Chance created: Romario94 7, Ronaldo98 8, and Ronaldo02 13 Shots: Romario94 33, Ronaldo98 20, and Ronaldo02 28 Goals: Romario94 5, Ronaldo98 4, and Ronaldo02 8 Assists: Romario94 2, Ronaldo98 3, and Ronaldo02 0
Let me move it to here then or at least trying so. To get beyond mere opinions: how many (strict criteria) assists had Ronaldo Fenomeno in all competitions in 1996-97 and 1997-98? Including penalty assists. How many rebound-assists?
I've recently completed research into Barcelona's 1996-97 season (sources: video footage available on internet + online archives of MD, La Vanguardia and ABC Madrid) and came up with the following, Ronaldo (all comps): 49 apps, 47 goals, 9 assists ("strict"); additionally 2 rebound assists, 1 deflected assist and 3 own-goal "assists". He also won 5 penalties, but took all of them himself (1 of those was saved but he scored the rebound). So I guess, depending on your criteria wrt own-goals, you could say he had 12 or 15 assists using a "wide" definition. "Strict" assists (9) 25.08.1996 | Barça 5-2 Atlético [Supercopa 1st Leg] | 4-2, De la Peña 12.10.1996 | Compostela 1-5 Barça [Liga J7] | 0-2, Giovanni 20.10.1996 | Barça 8-0 Logroñés [Liga J8] | 4-0, Giovanni 02.12.1996 | Barça 3-0 Extremadura [Liga J15] | 1-0, Giovanni 06.03.1997 | Barça 3-1 AIK Solna [UCWC QF 1st Leg] | 3-1, Pizzi 23.03.1997 | Barça 4-0 Sevilla [Liga J30] | 4-0, Luis Enrique 13.04.1997 | Atlético 2-5 Barça [Liga J33] 2-5, Figo 05.05.1997 | Extremadura 1-3 Barça [Liga J36] | 1-3, Luis Enrique 19.05.1997 | Celta 1-3 Barça [Liga J38] | 0-2, Òscar García "Wide" assists (3-6) 01.09.1996 | Real Oviedo 2-4 Barça [Liga J1] | 0-2, Stoichkov (deflected cross) [note: guess this could also fall into the rebound category despite it not being a shot] 07.09.1996 | Barça 2-1 Espanyol [Liga J2] | 2-1, Pizzi (rebound) 06.04.1997 | Barça 4-0 Sporting Gijón [Liga J32] | 1-0, Giovanni (rebound) - 12.10.1996 | Compostela 1-5 Barça [Liga J7] | 0-1, William Amaral (og., from a Ronaldo cross) 26.01.1997 | Barça 6-0 Rayo Vallecano [Liga J21] | 3-0, Contreras (og., shot attempt ricochet) [note: not even a "wide" assist per se, but direct goal involvement nonetheless] 06.02.1997 | Real Madrid 1-1 Barça [Copa del Rey R16 2nd Leg] | 0-1, Roberto Carlos (og., "... un gol en propria puerta de Roberto Carlos al intentar desviar un centro de Ronaldo..." [MD]; "...volvió el balón al brasileño, que no sabe si centró o chutó, el cuero pegó en Roberto Carlos que bajo los palos intentaba despejar, y entró." [ABC Madrid]) On a related subject, I noted that a decent number of Ronaldo's goals came from several excellent through balls or crosses from Figo. In fact, 9 of Figo's 17 "strict" assists that season were to Ronaldo + he also won 2 penalties that Ronaldo took, 1 was scored directly, the other saved but the rebound fell to Figo who squared for Ronaldo to tap it in, so that counts towards those aforementioned 9 already; the "wide" count would consequently be 10 assists from Figo to Ronaldo that season, 2nd most is Stoichkov with 4 "strict" (6 "wide") and Sergi also 4 (5).
Thank you very much. I made for myself a count for 1997-98 Serie A season a while back (strict criteria) and had a look now for Coppa Italia and UEFA Cup too. I found these: 04/01/1998 - Inter - Juventus (1:0) [Serie A], 1:0 Djorkaeff 15/02/1998 Inter - Lecce (5:0) [Serie A], 2:0 Milanese 31/03/1998 - Internazionale vs Spartak Moscow (2:1) [UEFA Cup semi final], 2:1 Zé Elias 05/04/1998 Inter - Sampdoria (3:0) [Serie A], 1:0, Cauet + 2:0 Sartor = 5 assists Strangely they counted the Cauet goal as an own goal, but the shot was clearly on target. Maybe I need to check the Serie A again though. For Coppa Italia and UEFA Cup there are no extra wide assists to count.
@Skorenzy - I assume you went through every goal in every competition, right? It's intriguing that Luís Figo had so many assists that season; I've always been interested in how many assists Figo had in his La Liga stint. His Portuguese wikipedia page has him with 10 assists in 1996-97, and 108 overall assists in La Liga alone. But obviously it is incorrect. How many wide assists did Figo have in the 1996-97 season by your calculations? Great work, by the way.
Yeah, indeed, as best as I could work out anyway (I found footage of majority of goals, used the online newspaper archives to fill in the rest or instances where the assister wasn't clearly visible or mentioned). I was also intrigued in Figo's assist numbers in Spain, hence why I started this (and also because I had already collected his stats for the 2006/07 season at Inter while I was looking into Ibrahimovic's stats and I noted how many assists Figo was still producing even at that age). Numbers I've available on Figo so far, 1996/97 (all comps) : 50 apps, 8 goals, 17 assists ("strict") / 1 rebound, 3 pen. won (1 missed), = 20 "wide" assists. - La Liga: 36-4-14 (+ 1 rebound, 2 pen. won of which 1 missed = 16 "wide") - UCWC: 8-1-1 - Copa del Rey: 5-3-1 (+ 1 pen. won = 2 "wide") - Supercopa: 1-0-1 2006/07 (all comps) : 47 apps, 3 goals, 16 assists ("strict") / 1 rebound, 3 own-goals = 20 "wide" assists. - Serie A: 32-2-9 (note: there is 1 goal where I haven't been able to verify the assister through any means so far + another where the footage is unclear whether or not another player touches on Figo's cross, but if he does there is no significant or even noticeable change in trajectory so I credited that to Figo) / 1 rebound, 3 og. "forced" = 13 "wide" assists. - CL: 7-0-0 - Coppa Italia: 7-0-6 - Supercoppa: 1-1-1 1995/96 (UEFA Cup) : 10 apps, 3 goals, 1 assist ("strict") / 1 deflected assist = 2 "wide" assists Incomplete, 1995/96 (La Liga) : only looked at Barça's first 13 league games so far and in those Figo has 10 apps, 3 goals, 8 assists (also "forcing" 1 own-goal, so 9 "wide" assists), which is a very remarkable opening streak in what is his debut season. In recent weeks I've seen that number for Figo's La Liga assist total repeated a few times in relation to Messi supposedly being close to breaking that "record". As much as I'm skeptical of anyone actually having an accurate account of the all-time La Liga assist leaders, it seems a plausible enough number for Figo anyway I thought. So far, though only based on a 1 season sample size, it seems "undercooked". I'm curious to see the end result I can come up with.
I would definitely be interested in the results of that research. Whereas Figo's assist numbers from Inter Milan can be found rather easily, it is much more difficult to acquire his assists from the 1990s at Barcelona, and even the early 2000s at Real Madrid. MARCA have the statistics of Figo since 2000-01, but I am not sure they are as accurate as possible. In 2000-01 they have Figo with 16 assists, in 2001-02 with 5 assists, in 2002-03 with 11 assists, in 2003-04 with 10 assists, and 2004-05 with 3 assists.
Interesting. That seems to be in line with his Portuguese wiki, give or take an assist, except for the final season where the discrepancy is quite substantial (3 v 8). I'll continue on with the 1995-96 season, then work my way further chronologically, and I'll post the end results in here.
If it isn't too much, would you be able to link to the source of where you got the goal from? (i.e.) the youtube video link, or the newspaper archive link? That would be fantastic. If you ever want any support on my end (with the Real Madrid stint), I can gladly help. Luís Figo was one of my favourite footballers. Just looking at 'strict' assists in the Serie A, ESPN is a good source. Soccer-Europe is a good source as well, I believe you have linked to this site more than once before. There is generally a much stronger "framework" when it comes to finding assists nowadays. For example with Figo at Barça, you would need to hope for Youtube highlights or going on newspaper archives as your first choice.
mmm that's totally different from what I had Figo with Real Madrid: 00-01: 8goals + 19ass/34games (won best Liga player) 01-02: 7goals+ 7ass /28games (with Zizou joined) 02-03: 10goals+13ass /33games (with R9 + ZZ) 03-04: 9goal+10ass /33games (with Beck) 04-05: 3goals+4ass/31games (whole Galacticos collapsed)
Interesting that MARCA has Zidane with 5, 8, 5, 4 and 6 between 2001 and 2006 (in the league only). http://www.marca.com/estadisticas/futbol/primera/2005_06/zidane_4876/
Marca got them all wrong for both Figo and otehrs For Zidane 02: 7go+6as (won Best Liga and UCL player) 03: 9go+11as (won WPOY ) 04: 6go+8ass 05: 6go+4ass giggle: whole Galaticos collapsed ) 06: 9go+9ass
I think I posted before but again .... Here is the performance of the so called GALACTICOS of Real 2000's (2liga +1UCL/6years) in LIGA only (2001-2006) Ronaldo ---83goals+18ass/123games ~0.82 pts/game (WOPY02+Ballon Dor02, 3rd in WPOY03) Figo --------37goals+53ass/165games ~0.55 pts/game (WPOY01) Raul -------87goals+32ass/235games ~0.51 pts/game (3rd WPOY01 + 3rd Ballon DOr 2001 ) Zidane ----37goals+38ass/155games ~0.48 pts/game (WPOY03 and 3rd in WPOY02 )
Ronaldo: "Romário was the most decisive player who I played with, he was a great goal scorer, finisher, skilful, opportunist. I think I learnt all of that from him".[53]
Love them both. Romario was my first football idol, I loved his technique and movement in and around the box. His finishing is also the best I've seen. Ronaldo however is the best player I've ever seen. Power, speed, balance, skill, dribbling, movement, improvisation and two footed finishing (shooting from far or dribbling the goalkeeper), Ronaldo just had everything. Watching him play at his peak was a unique experience. I feel like anyone who judges Ronaldo purely on stats has missed the whole point of Ronaldo. He is today generally regarded by both "knowledgeable" people (players, coaches, analysts) and fans as the best striker ever. I have never seen a player like Ronaldo and I doubt I ever will again. Brazilians also regard him as better than not only Romario but the best after Pele apparently. Below are two polls conducted in Brazil for the best player after Pele. UOL https://www.uol.com.br/esporte/fute...como-melhor-jogador-pos-pele-veja-ranking.htm ESPN Brasil https://tribuna.com/en/fcbarcelona/news/3311048/
Not better than this guy IMO Zico was superior at freekicks,vision,passing,long range efforts,finishing etc Was the protagonist behind more club titles Scored more league goals than the "best 9 ever" And also more international club goals(copa libertadores/CL/UEFA etc) Also had superior longevity on his side R9 In turn was a superior dribbler,athlete who scored a few more solo goals between 96-88 (zico also had many) R9 also had more world cup goals(but that's it) Zico wins in all 3 main categories Skill set Trophies Longevity It's a complete landslide R9,romario and garrincha can fight for 3rd spot because first and 2nd are imo not just ahead but also by a considerable margin
Didn't get to see Zico but if I'm not mistaken he was more a number 10 than a striker so a direct comparison to R9 is certainly more difficult. Zico is also R9's idol so even R9 himeself probably wouldn't care if you placed Zico ahead of him . Zico was a legend with Flamengo but wasn't all that great when he went to Udinese in italy. Zico's issues are he wasn't sucessful in the national team, got knocked out in 1982 by italy and missed a crucial penalty in a world cup if I remember. Not sure about his copa performances. Regarding skillset, R9 is like you said the superior dribbler but is also physically better than zico in everyway. He's faster, stronger and a generally a better finisher than zico. Zico is better than R9 in passing, freekicks and doing "no 10" stuff. Put it this way R9 is a much better striker than Zico and Zico is a much better no 10 than R9. It's really difficult to compare but I stay with R9. R9 had a better national career, while Zico had a better league career. I just feel there's a question mark about Zico's mentality on the international stage as well as his stint in Europe.
That's way off. First of all he went to Udinese at already 30 years of age and did very good. In his 1st season he scored 1 less than top scorer Platini having played 4 fewer games. In his 2nd season he had some injury problems, some tax issues (which he was found innocent if I am not mistaken), and issues with the club who lacked ambition ... so decided to return to Brazil. He is still remembered and adored in Udine. He is an NT legend even if he didn't win any titles. In 82 it was his bet chance ... but it is what it is. Not his fault Brazil conceded 3. He had a great assist and a good claim for a PK not called. In 86 he was injured and didn't even want to go but Tele convinced him. He was playing as a sub throughout the competition. He subbed in vs France in that QF and gave a great through pass for the PK that he subsequently missed. Although he converted his in the shootout. As for skillset, you're mostly correct but I wouldn't place his finishing skills below R9s. His repertoire was actually better than R9s. Better at heading the ball and volleys.
The reason I say R9's finishing is better is that R9 can finish from anywhere in the box and out of the box and from any angle. R9 shoots two footed from outside the box from either side and is very deadly. I can see Romario as a better finisher than Ronaldo but Zico, I don't know.
R9 and Garrincha could be above Zico in terms of raw talent imo (even Jairzinho maybe). Romário is close but not quite there imo. Neymar is close but quite there too. Ronaldinho the same case of Neymar.
What is raw talent(completed dribbles per match?) Zico the attacking midfielder/forward scored more career goals then any of those players(not just because of longevity either) Even his peak 1981 calendar year was more profilic as R9 1997 Is talent also vision,passing,being ambidextrous,teamplay etc If it is then those 3 mentioned aren't even remotely comparable to the "white pele" Please bear in mind he was called the white Pele because he was the one who came closest to demonstrating his all round skillset Nobody(real expert who watched both)was convinced R9 could genuinely emulate Pele He never had the football brain of a top 5 all timer Zico did but isnt considered as such due to multiple factors(perceived failure in world cup tournaments,scoring a chunk of his goals at state championship level,coming to Europe past his prime etc) Jairzinho certainly wasn't in the equation And no I dont even think he is of Neymar class Likely better then careca/kaka/bebeto but he wasnt in the league of any of the brazilian Rs or lately Neymar 15-20