REAL MADRID vs REAL VALLADOLID | La Liga Day 2 | 24.08.2019 | 19:00 CET

Discussion in 'Real Madrid' started by Eddie, Aug 24, 2019.

  1. Tribunal

    Tribunal Member

    Real Madrid
    Morocco
    Jul 27, 2019
    Zidane is my legend, but as a player. Not as a manager. I want a manager like Klopp. Full energy, changes in positions. We play with all these players who screwed up. If you see how easy Carvajal leaves his position at the goal of Guardiola. SR was there, Varane was there. It all started with Kroos. It is fun to see the stats that he completed 53/53 passes, but the most important moment he played like an old lady
     
  2. janos audron

    janos audron Member+

    Apr 12, 2010

    line-up.png

    This is us. We have problems. Time for rehab.
     
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  3. janos audron

    janos audron Member+

    Apr 12, 2010
    Any constructive suggestion or you will remain in your Grinch cosplay?
     
  4. temesgen

    temesgen Member+

    Jun 27, 2004
    Exactly and in defense that hole is right where Kroos, Modric and Casemiro are in your image. We don't occupy the dangerous areas of the pitch both in attack and defense. It's a real issue.
     
  5. Bear Crotch

    Bear Crotch Member+

    Jan 2, 2008
    Ohio, United States
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Nat'l Team:
    Spain
    I thought we played very well. James and Isco did incredibly well despite Isco losing possession ten times.

    We just lacked a finisher.
     
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  6. AppleBob86

    AppleBob86 Member+

    Real Madrid
    Jan 11, 2018
    Yep. Hence why I said Jovic should have started.
     
  7. robnycus

    robnycus Member+

    Jun 28, 2010
    Club:
    New York Cosmos
    Keylor is a great friend in the top 3 of best keepers . I think he is needed and the competition is good.



    The pressure is on for Courtois
     
  8. Varnagel

    Varnagel Member+

    Nothing
    Sweden
    Jun 4, 2017
  9. YOUNGSTARS87

    YOUNGSTARS87 Yellow C@rd Bandit

    Dec 21, 2005
    We were desperate and chasing a goal. Hence why we got away from our structured press set up, switched Bale to the left and concentrated on providing service to Jovic and Benzema.

    We relied on our CBs and Casemiro to press high to get the ball by, recycle this possession in hopes we finally break through; which we did.

    Then Kroos gets dispossessed and doesn't bother to take the guy out because he wants to avoid a second yellow and our entire defense is out of place because they weren't expecting this. Our GK is indecisive and doesn't collect what should have been a hard but routine stop.
     
  10. Tribunal

    Tribunal Member

    Real Madrid
    Morocco
    Jul 27, 2019
    My first reaction, when I saw it on Twitter, was that this is a first punch to Courtois. I think it isnt fair. Okay, Navas imo is better, but its not good for the team spirit.
     
    J-Mezzy repped this.
  11. robnycus

    robnycus Member+

    Jun 28, 2010
    Club:
    New York Cosmos
    Ramos: reactivating players like James or Gareth could be a solution for the mister”

     
    J-Mezzy repped this.
  12. janos audron

    janos audron Member+

    Apr 12, 2010
    Just re-watched goal situation. Carvajal and Varane duo shows how dumb they are. Varane keeps Valladolid player on-side, while Carvajal instead of taking his position starts sprinting towards center and leaving Varane without any support. Followed by Varane positioning himself perfectly for opponent to make a pass between him and Casemiro in space, which produces 1v1 situation with Courtois.

    What are these guys doing at practice? For fck safe!
     
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  13. Iscodisco

    Iscodisco Member

    Real Madrid
    Spain
    Dec 14, 2017
    Like I said, new manager with new ideas.

    Zidane cannot construct a new team. Also he doesn't want to.

    I don't know what you guys expect?
     
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  14. YOUNGSTARS87

    YOUNGSTARS87 Yellow C@rd Bandit

    Dec 21, 2005
    We did.

    The response here is pretty pathetic. Just shows how many prisoners of the moment we have on this forum.

    As I said earlier there were many positives from this match. If Kroos releases the ball quicker or gets his second yellow disrupting the counter we win. If Courtois isn't indecisive letting yet another goal between his legs, we win.

    We can't expect to win every match 4-0. We just needed to fight more at the end. Hopefully this is a lesson learned.
     
  15. janos audron

    janos audron Member+

    Apr 12, 2010
    Coach subs in another midfielder after Benzema scores, we win.
     
  16. Oscar

    Oscar Member+

    Nov 30, 2001
    Holland
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Nat'l Team:
    Spain
    #491 Oscar, Aug 24, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2019
    Casemiro is behind Varane in that play, if you take out Varane he would still be onside.

    Carvajal goes from right to centre in the direction of the guy who passes the ball because the opponent has another player besides him and Ramos has to deal with 2 players if he doesnt because Casemiro isn't in his dm position. When you pause at 88.20 in the replay you can see it clearly.

    [​IMG]

    And if you rewind the entire attack and pause at 87.42, you can see the defense is outmanouverd this way because Ramos is covering the leftback position for Marcelo (which happened last game as well: other players taking Marcelo's defensive duties)

    [​IMG]
    edit: Ramos covering the leftback position for Marcelo at the start of the attack

    which leaves him out of his main position, which means Casemiro has to cover the cd position, which means Carvajal needs to cover the dm.

    I think it's a smart move by Zidane as this covers up one of Marcelo's main negatives, his ability to come back (in time), and it gives him more freedom up top as in the last match. And because our other leftback option is injured. But in this play it messed us up, and this "you take my place, and he'll take yours" etc. will probably mess us up in other games as well against more talented teams.
     
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  17. ChocolateCandy

    ChocolateCandy Member+

    Real Madrid
    Jul 23, 2009
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    What do you expect? Who do you want to bring in right now?
     
  18. Iscodisco

    Iscodisco Member

    Real Madrid
    Spain
    Dec 14, 2017
    We played well?!?!

    At home against ********ing Valladolid!

    Crossing into the box repeatedly apparently is good football.

    Watch when we play a half decent team. We just played two teams that almost got relegated last season.
     
    RMrules repped this.
  19. MerlinRM

    MerlinRM Member+

    May 5, 2014
    NorthEast USA
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Sergio and Keylor vacation together with their families. I'm not surprised he has come out defedning him.

    I was ok with Tibo but him coming out and proclaiming himself #1 a few weeks ago left a very bitter taste in my mouth. Who the hell does he think he is to say something like that?
     
  20. yoanaidarov

    yoanaidarov Member+

    Real Madrid
    Bulgaria
    Sep 29, 2014
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Nat'l Team:
    Bulgaria
    Valladolid didn’t deserve the point. Pretty disappointed by the result. We deserved the win, played much better than them.
     
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  21. AppleBob86

    AppleBob86 Member+

    Real Madrid
    Jan 11, 2018
    Navas this and that. Zzz

    Let’s not pretend Navas doesn’t get beat repeatedly at his near post.

    Both keepers have flaws. Find me a perfect keeper. I’ll wait.
     
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  22. janos audron

    janos audron Member+

    Apr 12, 2010
    #496 janos audron, Aug 24, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2019
    I was watching this:



    Bad angle for off-side, true. My bad.Edit

    As for Carvajal. I disagree. He is simply to far out in most cases to support midfield - which was seen in this case where he completely failed to even tackle the guy. Secondly, by failing to support Varane this prevents Varane to go more centrally and cover the box - while Carvajal should be covering the player. Failure to do that opened tons of space in dangerous position and allowed most dangerous move - through ball between Varane and Casemiro and 1v1 with goally.

    Ironically it would be better to allow that midfielder to reach the box and then shoot.

    p.s: Look at initial position of Carvajal. He had time to cover that forward. Also based on the frame, i don`t know why Ramos was the one who chased the midfielder considering Casemiro was in better position and would actually close much of the space.

    carvajal.png
     
  23. Oscar

    Oscar Member+

    Nov 30, 2001
    Holland
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Nat'l Team:
    Spain
    #497 Oscar, Aug 24, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2019
    If he tackles the guy and misses he leaves the other opponent scot's free and then leaves Varane to deal with 2 players even closer to the goal. Ramos is the one dealing with the guy on the ball, there's no point for both of them to focus on the same guy, Carvajal goes to support so the other opponent to the left of the player with the ball can't just run freely towards the goalmouth. That's the space he's closing:

    [​IMG]

    If anything (when ignoring this was caused by our defensive line-up with the tactic of others taking Marcelo's responsiblities creating holes) Varane is at fault for focusing on the player Carvajal is closing down as opposed to the one besides him.

    Essentialy doing what you are asking Carvajal to do, to team-up against 1 opponent, while leaving the other free as a bird. Which makes no sense.

    I can rewind and see all the good angles as I please, nobody is going to convince me Carvajal didn't do the right thing here when I can see with my eyes he did the only right thing.

    edit: note that I am not blaming Varane, this play wouldn't have happened if everybody was in their own position. It starts with Ramos not being in the cb because he has to cover Marcelo's spot. That's the necessity of playing with Marcelo, which should be rectified when Mendy comes back (hopefully) from injury.
     
  24. RaMaaa

    RaMaaa Member+

    Feb 3, 2013
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    it was more another silly Kroos mistake.. when he is so soft, so soft everyone pushes him and he on the ground from the softest touch,
     
  25. janos audron

    janos audron Member+

    Apr 12, 2010
    #499 janos audron, Aug 24, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2019

    In my book this is correct way to do it:

    Ramos continues movement towards the box and keeping an eye on that right forward. Casemiro continues his movement towards center and tries to block not just movement of two midfielders but also possible through ball. Carvajal naturally continues his movement toward Varane and offering support in most dangerous area of the pitch at this moment, which allows Varane to take more central position at the box and defend it against shot or through ball.

    Instead, Ramos who is further away than Casemiro decides to become brainless and start chasing the guy with the ball. This forces Casemiro who was in prime position to handle the situation to drop it, turn around and fill that massive central hole and also worry about that right forward because Mr. Marcelo is late again. Followed by Carvajal not doing his job to cover most dangerous player on the pitch and instead chasing further and less dangerous player, and being late in everything and thus failing to close the space and player. This fcked up Varane who froze and stayed to wide which opened single most dangerous thing - through ball and 1v1 with keeper in the box.

    Or in short, in nice picture:

    carvajal.png
     
  26. YOUNGSTARS87

    YOUNGSTARS87 Yellow C@rd Bandit

    Dec 21, 2005
    Marcelo isn't actually out of position.

    He's exactly where he is suppose to be. This is why Kroos giving the ball up in that position hurt us so much.

    We play with advanced FBs. See Carvajal's position as well. They are naturallly higher up the pitch and our CBs are wider, with Casemiro sitting in the middle.

    We are transitioning to attack, so Ramos is wider, Marcelo is more advanced. Kroos can't give up the ball in such a position because he should know we are heavily exposed. If he does he has to get that second yellow and just take the guy down because we don't have any other choices at that point.
     
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