Yeah well Soccer is working class, working class people have a way with words you could say. Anyway, it makes me laugh how they say the English FA has eradicated racism in the premiership. They only done this by increasing the prices and getting in the "prawn sandwich" brigade. Football is now attended by our version of what you would call "middle America". It's as safe as houses. We cant have a pop at European countries like Slovakia though. How hypocritical of us. These countries aren't integrated like ours. 20 years ago, when black players where starting to break through in football with more significant numbers, the same thing existed here. It took years to solve. Maybe we can suggest methods they can use, but to paint oursleves whiter than white in the process is out of order. If you rooted out all the "racists" (i invert it because I am highly suspicious of branding someone a racist for making a monkey sound racist - ignorant and easily led, foolish yes) in these countries then how many would be left to fill the stadium ? The ignorant are there to be educated not punsihed.
Are you serious? What a load of bollocks. Who do you support? The working class make up the majority in football crowds, by a mile.
UEFA make the rules and they are totally within their rights to demand that clubs eliminate racist taunts. If the clubs don't want to play within UEFA's rules then fine, don't play at all. Having said that, the pathetic fines handed out by UEFA to European clubs abusing black English players would be laughable if they weren't so disugusting.
Of note, UEFA have appealed against the paltry fine given to PSV by their own comittee as they believe it is too lenient given the amount of money PSV will gain from being in the Champions League.
But what is racism exactly? Utrecht also got fined for a banner that said ************ POLSKA. Yeah well... you can see that as racism. But then it would also be racism if I would say all rotterdammers have AIDS at a Ajax - feyenoord. This means that about 40-50% of all chants around football matches come down to racism. But it's not a football thing. It's a social thing. I agree that UEFA hands out fines, but they should make an exact description of what IS and what is NOT considdered racism.
I think there's a fine line that separates what is, and isn't racism. Club football is about civic rivalry, and when you insult the club, you insult the home town by extension, and vice versa. Plus, being a resident of a city does not say anything about your race, religion or ethnicity (for the most part). But when you start talking about nationality or race, you get into matters of individual identity and that's where the problem arises. City and club affiliation are (again, for the most part) matters of choice. Race, ethnicity and nationality are not. That's where the difference lies. Slovakian fans were clearly out of line for singling out black players, and Utrecht fans were as well, for directing their venom at Poles instead of just the club. But that is just my personal interpretation. As I've said before, while I believe clubs should do everything in their power to eliminate racism in the stands, I'm not sure whether UEFA should be governing taste.
Look, David Dimbleby, Racism is self explanatory. Ajax chanting Rotterdammers have aids isn't racism as they are the same race as you, if i came up to you and called you Dutch c**t and you can stick your clogs up your arse that might be called racism.
What a chump. Most Black players in Europe are Europeans, not Africans, and even if they are, so what. You are claiming only white people can be European, and that the football teams and the entire structure of football in Europe is only for white people, all black people are 'visitors' or 'foreigners' and all fans are 'white' Black people don't sing racist chants at white South Africans in football games or claim they are not south African, because they obviously are. I hope you get fined by UEFA for your stoneage opinions, but it'd probably only be $50.
It's been mentioned previously, but obviously needs reiterating, RACE and NATIONALITY are two completely different things.
As it is discussed in this thread, both fall into the category of bigotry, I think that's what was meant. But still, the point remains, bigotry is quite different in nature from what we see everyday in say, Ajax vs Feye or Liverpool vs ManUre - they're expressions of civic or club rivalries, not racism or nationalism.
I wouldn't mind the opportunity of kicking your front teeth around. Since there are three people disagreeing on this I'd say it's not totally self explanatory. BTW aren't you the same race as I am?
Actually, I think everyone here agrees that Amsterdam vs Rotterdam does NOT fall into the category of racism. The other distinction is nationality vs race, but both fall into the category of general bigotry.
I love this stuff. This reminds me of the program notes, translated from Italian, that accompany Wilhelm Furtwangler recordings dubbed from Austro-German radio broadcasts from the early 1950's. Available on CD labels like Music&Arts, Urania, Grammafono, etc. Are you still with me? I didn't think so.
>>imagine if in africa lots of the players were white, people would want the clubs to hire less whites and more of their own. i know racism is bad but you have to understand all sides. >> This is one of the worst quotes Ive seen on BS! Screw what the fans WANT especially when its race biased. Put on the field the best team possible. The NBA's audience is 95% WHITE meanwhile the players are 95% black...so there goes your theory.I dont hear chants for more White NBAers from the stands. Think before you spew such remarks.
I think it's a BS remark too. It doesn't justify racism. However, it is quite normal for fans to want people in their team that they can identify with. I feel we have to many foreigners in Ajax for example. I'd rather see Dutch talent. But it's no disaster.
Think you got the wrong end of the stick, i didn't mean any of those insults, i was adding them as an example. If you want to kick my front teeth around you'll have to find another excuse. Whether i'm the same race as you could discussed for ages but personally i think if you called me an English bastard i'd call that racism, thats just my opinion others might disagree but thats for them to say.
Yeah I know you were writing in 'suppose I would' mode. It was also a 'suppose you did' answer If I called you a British bastard I wouldn't say it's racism.
The fortuneteller is rambunctiously waiting for moments of impact. The scenario could be considered "RACISM" but the different legalities provably lead to infractions of others. All the defamatory meance calling, chanting, rioting, slanderous and/or threatening etc.. relates to something. It cannot be pointed at "RACISM" because it is not against the law of United States of America. Overseas I am not for sure but here definitely not. "RACISM" therefore may come and go in household of myself. Our great history alienates change for lawmakers and nations. How significantly will these changes be?
INMHO...we have 2 conflicts Racism and Tribalism. Black players suffer from the former because the ignorant are abusing him soley on the his color and features. White players suffer from the latter because the ignorant are abusing him becos of his tribal/national origins ie. germans hate dutch. There is no intelligent justification for either and both are deep rooted in patriotism.
Oi ************ For Brians. WTF is the point of having international matches if there is no partriotism. patriotism is what makes international Football. I bet your one of these Jerk offs that sit down at matches eating there prawn sandwiches and complaining about people standing up.