Racism...Forever?

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by soccernutter, Dec 31, 2015.

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  1. Timon19

    Timon19 Member+

    Jun 2, 2007
    Akron, OH
    Unless Khan was really a Georgian/Caucasian, I'm pretty sure the "Dzj" thing is best left to pre-Soviet names of eventual Russian tyrants.
     
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  2. VFish

    VFish Member+

    Jan 7, 2001
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    Atlanta
    So 24 and Me confirms you are the product of Dzjengis Kahn? That explains a lot.
     
  3. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  4. sitruc

    sitruc Member+

    Jul 25, 2006
    Virginia
    I read it all. There's a lot in there. Ron Paul even makes a late appearance.
     
  5. JohnR

    JohnR Member+

    Jun 23, 2000
    Chicago, IL
    The line separating white supremacists and mainstream Republicans is not thick.
     
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  6. xtomx

    xtomx Member+

    Chicago Fire
    Sep 6, 2001
    Northern Wisconsin, but not far from civilization
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    It is about a white sheet thick, it seems.
     
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  7. Auriaprottu

    Auriaprottu Member+

    Atlanta Damn United
    Apr 1, 2002
    The back of the bus
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    So you're saying there's a line...
    lol
     
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  8. JohnR

    JohnR Member+

    Jun 23, 2000
    Chicago, IL
    If there was, Trump erased it.
     
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  9. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    At one time there was probably a difference, something that one could point to that more clearly differentiated "mainstream Republicans" from white supremacists with there being some overlap. But with the advent of the Tea Party, mainstream Republicans at least promote white supremacist ideas if not actually believing (one being for political gain white the other being personal belief). Somebody mentioned yesterday or the day before how their dad Rep for specific reasons not directly related to white supremacy, but could no longer.
     
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  10. Q*bert Jones III

    Q*bert Jones III The People's Poet

    Feb 12, 2005
    Woodstock, NY
    Club:
    DC United
    The Republicans used to be the party that represented lower taxes, unintrusive government, "family values," and white supremacists.

    Now they're just white supremacists.
     
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  11. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I read that earlier today, and it's worth the time.

    The writer makes a very good distinction, avoiding crude claims that Greenwald himself is a white nationalist.
     
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  12. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's just an attempt to "Latinize" the pronunciation, though, innit?
     
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  13. Auriaprottu

    Auriaprottu Member+

    Atlanta Damn United
    Apr 1, 2002
    The back of the bus
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    The bolded... it took "Intrusive government" to help begin the process of civilizing this shithole country. The states certainly weren't going to do it on their own.

    That's why centrists tend to get their panties in a wad over federal "overreach".
     
  14. Chicago76

    Chicago76 Member+

    Jun 9, 2002
    The centrist "problem" comes from their place of relative privilege. Centrists are generally white, middle class people who are economically stable who often live in areas with a strong white conservative contingent and a smaller white liberal/POC contingent.

    They underestimate the dangers of strands of white nationalism found in a lot of the conservative movement, because they "know a guy with some dumb ideas about X, but he's actually a nice guy and he's a great centerfielder for our beer league softball team." They don't need the government because they're not in that "really nice" guy's line of fire, and the entire policy platform of both parties is centered on not completely pissing off people like them.

    They've got a nice apolitical position going, so they'd rather neither party mess that up with any flag kneeling that might require them to think about something for a few minutes before diving into their nachos. Or tax raising. Or abortion restrictions. Or LGBT issues that might have a negative economic impact in a chamber of commerce/convention traffic kinda way.

    They're the way they are because nothing has really been asked of them. Don't make them think too hard damnit. They've got a soccer game to go to, a lawn to mow and some "I love us" family photos to upload on FB.
     
  15. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    I think of GG like Dershowitz. Willing to take on unpopular causes & defend unpopular people. But they both have fallen into a Fox-world orbit lately that is really hard to comprehend.
     
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  16. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't know if you read the think superdave linked to but essentially argues that Greenwald has a very glaring, inexplicable blind spot when it comes to the white nationalists whose rights he defends. And that blind sport was always there.
     
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  17. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    As bigred said, worth the read. And, to me, this is the key (bold my empasis):

    At this point, it had become manifestly clear to me that Greenwald has an immense blind spot—an inexplicable one, really—when it comes to far-right extremism and its spread into the mainstream, and the toxic effects of that spread.



    This isn’t a matter of whether Greenwald is a racist or an extremist or an anti-Semite or anything like that. I don’t believe he is, even remotely. I’m glad I defended him initially. And no doubt, Glenn will dismiss this entire piece as a lie and a smear in which I make him out to be a racist. But seriously, I don’t believe for a minute that he is.



    I just believe his sort of principled rigidity on free-speech issues blinds him to the real-world effects of fascism—particularly how it manipulates free-speech principles in order to destroy them. Fascists use people like Greenwald to leave a trail of wreckage.



    It’s not about whether or not he’s racist—which, after all, would indeed make the whole issue one of guilt by association. That’s not the point of all this. No, this is a question of judgment: If you’re so short-sighted that you can’t see how your ethical choices wind up enabling harmful behavior, then exactly how astute is your judgment in any event?
     
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  18. Chicago76

    Chicago76 Member+

    Jun 9, 2002
    #11443 Chicago76, May 21, 2019
    Last edited: May 21, 2019
    I'm grateful that there are attorneys out there willing to take on controversial defenses for strictly legal reasons. People have a right to a legal defense. I'm grateful for journalists willing to develop sources/relationships to do stories on far right movements too.

    This advocacy outside the courtroom as more of a PR exercise is the problem. So is the journalism that extends beyond explaining why racist X believes Y into at least implied rationalization.

    I'm sure it existed somewhere, but I don't remember any major media outlet 30 years ago painting a white supremacist as a sympathetic character. Or attorneys getting significant air time to spin theories about how wonderful their dirt bag client is.

    That's on Fox and far right radio.

    Yeah. That was my old man. For him there's a range of reasonable from Reagan Republicanism to small s socialism (before you get to the state owning stuff) where people can agree to disagree. Or, "let's restrict abortion to before 24 weeks with exceptions since that's when they happen anyway". He doesn't need to live with the consequences of Reagan Republicanism the way people in other classes--especially those who aren't white--have. But the overt racism, xenophobia, voting access shenanigans, Garland garbage, Boehner's complete disregard for negotiating the budget shortfall under O, hard right religious freedom stances, and on and on...that's the stuff he can't deal with. Didn't like Newt and Contract with America at all, but at that point it was easy for him to chalk that up to an anomaly rather than a step in an evolutionary process.
     
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  19. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    All boiled down that is true. White grievance in this era of more inclusivity for past marginalized groups.

    Trump could've run as a Democrat or an IC or as leader of the Pvssy Grabbers Party. But he chose Republican for a reason.
     
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  20. sitruc

    sitruc Member+

    Jul 25, 2006
    Virginia
    He also makes a cameo in that piece.
     
  21. It's an almost perfect Venn diagram.
     
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  22. stanger

    stanger BigSoccer Supporter

    Nov 29, 2008
    Columbus
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Because it was easier. Dems are a divided, splintered group but Republicans were mostly unified. It was easier to say the right things and get them to believe.
     
  23. Pønch

    Pønch Saprissista

    Aug 23, 2006
    Donde siempre
    Because the "right things" that Republicans are willing to believe (climate change is a Chinese hoax, the majority of immigrants are rapists, there are good people amongst white supremacists, etc, etc, etc) would get somebody laughed out of a Democrat convention, not to mention a casual gathering of relatively sane people...
     
  24. stanger

    stanger BigSoccer Supporter

    Nov 29, 2008
    Columbus
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I am around die-hard republicans all the time. I don't know one that believes any of the stuff you just posted. Yes, there are some that believe everything but most? Nope.
     
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  25. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Nah, Jeb was the chosen one. So I wouldn't say in 2015 when Trump rode down the escalator to spout racist tripe that he thought he'd stand any chance. He was looking to get the brand out there for Trump TV. It really is a Mel Brooks farce that his bigoted insanity struck a chord with Whitelandia and he won.
     

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