Racism...Forever?

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by soccernutter, Dec 31, 2015.

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  1. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 22, 2001
    Don't drink beer but like cheese
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Starting out the new year with a change..so to speak.

    How Black Lives Matter saved higher education

    http://america.aljazeera.com/opinions/2015/12/how-black-lives-matter-saved-higher-education.html

    Okay, so the title is a quite hyperbolic, but...

    I too began to despair, wondering if the socially conscious students I was surrounded by in college and dreamed of teaching as I worked toward my Ph.D. simply did not exist any more? Had the university become too conservative, prioritizing college-ranking lists over teaching real critical engagement? Had students, understandably concerned about the rise of college tuition and mounting debt, become wary of rocking an already leaky boat?

    And what did the retreat of the university from taking on social issues, as it did in the 1960s in the midst of Vietnam and the Civil Rights movement, mean for the role of the university in American society itself? Had the dream of the liberal arts education, to turn students into informed citizens capable of participating fully in a democratic society, finally lost out to the cynical view that the degree is merely an overpriced piece of paper, a one-way ticket to a cubicle and a 401(k)?

    Just when the answer to all these questions looked as if it would be in the affirmative, a massive sea change occurred. What made this year different? Black Lives Matter.
    I will say it is as much the fear of finding a job as it is colleges/universities prioritizing. The activism occurs when life is threatened - that is why the Vietnam protests were so strong. And we know that POC, and Blacks in particular, are at a higher risk of having lives end via violence (police or otherwise), and that there is still racism in the workplace. Thus, it matters more to the Black population to be active, to point out that Black Lives, do indeed, Matter.
     
  2. argentine soccer fan

    Staff Member

    Jan 18, 2001
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
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  3. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Not sure if intentional or not. But the writer of the article leaves out how the Mizzou football team threatened not to play if the president didn't resign.
     
  4. argentine soccer fan

    Staff Member

    Jan 18, 2001
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    That was a courageous move by the players, as well as the coach. Of course, I don't mean to minimize the valiant efforts of the other students at the school, but that incident illustrated how much power athletes have, and with power comes responsibility.
     
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  5. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    And the coach was 100% behind them. Jeez, this president must've been a real asshole.
     
  6. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 22, 2001
    Don't drink beer but like cheese
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    While I am glad they took a stand, they had the opportunity that the writer of the article did not. They got a second (third, fourth, etc.) chance via some dipshit action the president made (or didn't make, as in the case of the protest by the football team). I wonder if they would have done the same thing has they been on a professional team, married, with 4 children.

    This is big, that the coach backed them up. But the writer of the article was unclear if he would retain the backing of his employer. For the kids on the team, they are still in a position in which they don't have as much concern, and their (financial) responsibilities are much less. It makes it easier to challenge the system when you are not yet trying to make a living from something that you have worked hard to achieve.
     
  7. argentine soccer fan

    Staff Member

    Jan 18, 2001
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Its true that they are different situations, but don't underestimate what these guys were willing to give up.

    Back when I was a student-athlete in college I lived for the games. As a competitor, the games and meets were my life. And knowing that I had no future as a pro, I treasured each game and each meet knowing full well how few of them I had, and that I'd never get that same experience again after finishing school.

    I tell you, for me to have even considered giving up a game or a meet to make a stand for something would have been very difficult. And I imagine it must be even harder for these guys who participate in a major college program and in a sport that is much more hyped and enables them to be on TV and have visibility and all the other perks that obviously didn't come for a B level athlete at a small school playing soccer and running track. And of course, there are some players at that program who actually have hope to make it as pros, and for them every game counts in terms of experience and exposure.

    I'm sure at this stage in their life these guys were willing to give up one hell of a lot. I wouldn't minimize it.

    As far as the sportwriter's column, I was impressed by the author's candor and what seems to be a genuine feeling of regret that led him to tell his story. I think stories like his can inspire others to take a stand.
     
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  8. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 22, 2001
    Don't drink beer but like cheese
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't disagree with what you are saying. But even with all that, and even as much as the writer knew he was being wronged, and even he knew he had the support of a good lawyer and his boss, it still came down to his unwillingness to financially risk his wife and children. It was not about his own financial risk, but that of his family. To me, that is the major difference that these football players don't (assuming) have, is a current risk to their family earnings.

    I appreciate the candor of the author, but we all have the "if only" moments in life.
     
  9. Dr. Wankler

    Dr. Wankler Member+

    May 2, 2001
    The Electric City
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Poet Claudine Rankin, whose book Citizen was being read in the background at a Donald Trump speech, much to the chagrin of a few Trump supporters, is interviewed by The Guardian

    http://www.theguardian.com/books/20...tizen-american-lyric-feature?CMP=share_btn_tw

    Your book, Citizen: An American Lyric, has won the National Book Critics’ Circle poetry award in the US, the Forward in the UK and is shortlisted for the TS Eliot prize. It exposes racism in the US at its most violent and at its most nuanced. Why the title?
    I called it Citizen because I wanted to ask: who gets to hold that status – despite everyone technically having it? How is it embodied and honoured? The title contains a question.

    What the book does most powerfully is to make it clear that racism is everyone’s problem.
    Racism is complicated. White people feel personally responsible for racism when they should understand the problem as systemic. It is interfering as much with their lives as with the lives of people of colour. And racism can lodge in them. It isn’t them yet it can become them if they are not taking notice.

    ...

    “Because white men can’t/ police their imagination/ black men are dying.” What was in your mind when you wrote that line?
    When white men are shooting black people, some of it is malice and some an out-of-control image of blackness in their minds. Darren Wilson told the jury that he shot Michael Brown because he looked “like a demon”. And I don’t disbelieve it. Blackness in the white imagination has nothing to do with black people.

    Why is it so hard to call out racism?
    Because making other people uncomfortable is thought worse than racism. It has taken me a while to train myself to speak out.

     
  10. HerthaBerwyn

    HerthaBerwyn Member+

    May 24, 2003
    Chicago
    A foolish man once proudly proclaimed "Segregation forever"! He was wrong then. I hope this is wrong now.
     
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  11. Auriaprottu

    Auriaprottu Member+

    Atlanta Damn United FC (f***ing CHAMPIONS)
    Apr 1, 2002
    The back of the bus
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    No. Children force you to invest in the system because they need to be fed, clothed and sheltered. Certain jobs can insulate you a bit from White backlash (my folks were profs at Alabama A&M and at Howard), but in general, the first baby pops out, your freedom to speak out and make yourself heard is kaput. They sap your money and your time. Better to work at a lower-paying job and have the freedom to spend what little money you have on the things you enjoy.

    Gary Pinkel (the coach in question) retired at the end of the season. He was probably going to do that all along (he's 63), but that probably made the decision to support the players much easier.
     
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  12. Auriaprottu

    Auriaprottu Member+

    Atlanta Damn United FC (f***ing CHAMPIONS)
    Apr 1, 2002
    The back of the bus
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    I'm the one who put in the request for the title :D
    I don't see and end to racism. Do you?
     
  13. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    A 35 year old coach getting started in the biz may have told his players "support the cause on your own time, but don't say you won't play." And the Mizzou administration might've said "who gives an F about Pinkel? He's gone anyway." But having the most highly paid (I assume because it's almost always the case) public employee of your state say "I support these players and do not support the president" is still huge. Whether he was leaving or not.
     
  14. Auriaprottu

    Auriaprottu Member+

    Atlanta Damn United FC (f***ing CHAMPIONS)
    Apr 1, 2002
    The back of the bus
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    Mizzou's president certainly gives a F about what he did.

    It's probably almost never the case. That's a misleading stat perpetuated by folks who got picked last on the playground and are still bitter about it.

    The portion of Pinkel's income as paid by the taxpayers likely doesn't make him the highest-paid state employee. Nick Saban earns about $7M/season, but only about $250K is paid by the taxpayers, which puts him third, IIRC. And much as I don't care for Bama, I'd rather pay Saban than any of the governors we've had in my lifetime. He's the most public figure who isn't embarrassing the state atm.
     
  15. VincitOmniaVeritas

    Jul 18, 2015
    Northern Virginia
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Its hard to imagine that 85+ males ages 18-22 would all share one opinion on something. I wonder if mizzou was having a decent year and had something to play for if the same threats would have been made.

    If they had gone through with the threat of refusing to play the NCAA would simply give them the loss, and I don't think a team with something on the line would do that.
     
  16. Auriaprottu

    Auriaprottu Member+

    Atlanta Damn United FC (f***ing CHAMPIONS)
    Apr 1, 2002
    The back of the bus
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    Not hard at all to imagine if 50 or 60 of them are from the demographic that endures daily racial mistreatment.

    Mizzou went to the SEC and they've now found out that they hadn't had very many decent years in their history, not by the standards of schools the football program can be proud of. My guess is, the players were able to address the situation ( the "threats" you refer to) as they did because they had the backing of a coach who was about to hang it up.

    These days, a team that more often than not has something on the line usually comes from an area where self-awareness and self-empowerment isn't the norm. It's not so much whether something's on the line, but who the players are and where they're from (what sorts of racist actions they're willing to endure). You'll never see a 2-9 Alabama team, but at the same time, no 2-9 Alabama team would have stood up to the administration the way the Mizzou bunch did.
     
  17. crazypete13

    crazypete13 Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 7, 2007
    A walk from BMO
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    I see the possibility of an end to racism - at least in the privileged institutional systemic sense - though a timeframe is unclear, and vigilance against racism needs to be permanent.

    I gather not everyone can share my optimism though.
     
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  18. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    This.
     
  19. usscouse

    usscouse BigSoccer Supporter

    May 3, 2002
    Orygun coast
    Birds of a feather flock together.

    That's nature. Bloody shame that humans can't get over that.
     
  20. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    #20 Cascarino's Pizzeria, Jan 3, 2016
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2016
    Then you have a leading prez candidate slandering Mexicans & Muslims and for years kept asking to see the birth certificate of a president born in Hawaii. Every time I heard that smear my ears basically heard "Hey N-word! You ain't one of us and millions like me say you never will be." Gun and ammo sales through the roof since Obama took office. Can picture the old Fox watching grandpa at the gun shop buying yet another gun "well you know Obama's gonna let the N-words run wild when he takes office doncha? And he's gonna take all our guns away. Gotta be prepared. "

    Then you realize some segments of the population are still stuck in 1950s Alabama. And might always be.
     
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  21. Auriaprottu

    Auriaprottu Member+

    Atlanta Damn United FC (f***ing CHAMPIONS)
    Apr 1, 2002
    The back of the bus
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    fyp
     
  22. Auriaprottu

    Auriaprottu Member+

    Atlanta Damn United FC (f***ing CHAMPIONS)
    Apr 1, 2002
    The back of the bus
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
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  23. russ

    russ Member+

    Feb 26, 1999
    Canton,NY
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #PropertyMattersMost
     
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  24. stanger

    stanger BigSoccer Supporter

    Nov 29, 2008
    Columbus
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    I love stereotypes.
     

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