PSG vs Liverpool FC - CL - Nov 28 [R]

Really? Neymar can do 10 death rolls with zero reaction from the refs.

Sure. If you mean the kind of contact that wouldn't affect a butterfly in mid-flight.

You are right. If your definition of clever is an unsportsmanlike asswipe.

Finally actually true. He does not have the sportsmanlike self awareness to stop him doing the ridiculous to gain the smallest advantage so nothing will ever change. However, his legacy will always be tainted.

 

That was bad, wasn’t it? It really was. I’d say we got away with a 2-1 loss. As dreadful as the refereeing was, and he was bad, Liverpool was even worse. Even worse than having a troll in the thread trilling to our poverty. Diabolical.

Well, we have a match against the bitters on Sunday but that midfield now ...

 

1-0 does it, yes? But if they score it needs to be a win by 2.

I think I have that right.

 

You have that right. Let's see what we if we can do it-- Napoli is much better and more organised than both Red Star and PSG.

 

This is an interesting strategic transition time for Klopp and the team. Last year's classic Klopp total counterpress and all out offense only took us so far in the league. So Klopp has properly re-thought things and is experimenting with a more balanced approach and new players. While we have seen positive results in the league the change had diluted our effectiveness against the top teams who come out and play - the teams total counterpressing is most effective against (top PL teams and CL opposition). Klopp's still working things out, and the players are trying to adjust to yet another change in style, others like Keita and Fab are taking time to bed in so we've understandably regressed.

I think the long term direction is positive but we're likely to be disappointed in the short term. Don't have high expectations for European success as a result.

 

Klopp had the same issues at Dortmund. His style couldn't be sustained season after season. These players are human just like the other top teams. It's not as if Liverpool's players are machines. Eventually playing that intensely will catch up to a squad which is why we don't see consistently winning teams playing in such a manner.

Plus teams figured out how to nullify Dortmund by denying them space and forcing their midfield to make plays. PSG sat deeper, closely marked the front three, and let Liverpool's CMs who lack creativity and technique handle the ball.

Luckily Liverpool's biggest improvement over last year is the defensive record. That is the team's strength at the moment. This is why they are close to City in the table while struggling in CL. Defense matters more in a long league campaign whereas attack does in a short tournament like the CL. Essentially Liverpool have flipped their performances from last year.

 

Bingo! And @scoccerr9, too.

And for all the fulminating at Neyma & co and the awful referee.-- I don't subscribe to it myself when we were so comprehensively outplayed in that opening spell-- it was the inability to do anything with the ball that really hurt us.The pressure on the defence came from both PSG's front three as much as our midfield three.

Apparently, Klopp was raging at the touchline at the inability of our middle three to see gaps in PSG's midfield which would have created openings. The coaches apparently pointed out this at half-time but by the second half, PSG having doubtlessly come to the same conclusions, had tightened and closed the gaps. I think Klopp was hoping for a repeat of the Anfield performance but the signs were already there even in that match when we conceded those two goals. And against Watford, Henderson and Wijnaldum's limitations, bless them, were exposed for all to see. Oh, I though Lovren at right centre-half and Gomez at right back backfired , although that's easy for me to say in hindsight. If Klopp has a fault, it's loyalty-- sometimes misplaced-- to his players but he does take hard decisions when required and this match may have just started nudging him in that direction.

We'll have to do it the hard way, I suppose, but if change is not made, we're not going to beat Napoli by the required scoreline.Or beat it at all.

 

But our first choice defence/GK is MUCH better now. So the classic Klopp total counterpress and all out offense may be even more effective than last year as we will concede less goals?

 

The issue I think is unfinished business - the goal has been better team defense (in addition to Alisson and VvD) as well as more midfield creativity, movement and guile to help the attackers unlock packed defenses. Total counterpressing didn't work when the other side gave us possession and parked the bus. Keita, Fab and Shaq were acquired to transform the MF into a group that could achieve our goal. For whatever reason they're not there yet. Hopefully they'll get there soon.

 

100%

When Liverpool are restarting play from goal kicks or if Allison is on the ball, PSG and Napoli pressed high. This gives Liverpool two options, trust a technically limited midfield to receive the ball and play forward quickly to exploit the space the opposing midfield leaves behind them all without turning the ball over. The 2nd option is to play long to a front three whose strength is not aerial duels. In the first half PSG were able to turn Liverpool over in midfield and break quickly past the CMs. PSG's CBs had no issue against the front three in the air.

In the 2nd PSG purposely sat deeper and allowed Liverpool to play in front of them. Again, PSG had no issues with crosses in the box. Salah, Mane, and Firmino aren't big aerial threats.

The CMs also aren't a big threat to score. So if they aren't pressing machines and turning the opposition over (Milner had countless assists last year like this), they aren't creative or technical enough to build play.

Maybe they will do enough vs Napoli because they are at home, but unless something changes it's difficult to see Liverpool going deep in Europe. If Milner, Henderson, Wijnaldum are physically unable to match their intensity from last year early in this season, imagine how they will be in March.

 

I also noticed with the players chasing the game we reverted to crossing the ball to a front three which are not the best at aerial challenges. At some point I thought Klopp would send VVD forward (the way Koeman sent him forward for the international game).

Also our corners and free-kicks as a result become the standard. There needs to be some innovative ideas rather than crossing and hoping.

There are talented players in Shaqiri, Milner and TAA who can whip in a "clever" ball but these risks are avoided. It is about managing the pressure in a losing situation and unlocking a defense that is well organised.

 

I think it's imperative that he plays against Napoli....

 

eh....??? Zidane didn't do that - El Scum-Skunk-Sergio did that.....

 

It was pretty bad - but look, if was better than the other two away performances. That's the damn key problem - none of us would have cared too much if we'd lost 4-1 in Paris if we were already likely qualified.