The only thing that would happen with Bruin in the middle is that he would have wasted some of the chances we converted. If you really think Cubo and Bruin are interchangeable on the current team then its really hard to take you serious. How do you figure this could have started last season with Cubo? There was no supporting cast. He holds the ball up. He creates space. Who the F was he going to feed last year? I mean nobody else last season was a scoring threat so it's pretty easy to shut one guy down. Hell, our crappy D could even do that. These last 3 games you really think Bruin flicks the ball on with his head to assist on a goal? You really think Bruin traps a 40yd pass and puts himself in scoring position?? You really think Bruin would make a run to open up space for someone else and not end up getting in the way? I'm amazed anyone could watch Bruin for 5 years and think he's the same as Cubo.
Stumbledore is equal to Godwins law. if you bring him up, you lose. instantly. PS no comment necessary.
I haven't seen enough of Cabezas to even begin to have an opinion. Remick has been decent and depending on his contract, I can say that I am happy with what I see. He will see a lot of field time because Beasley is old as dirt and will get hurt. Our Honduran fireballs have been what we all, I think were hoping for when they signed them. OBG was the same way when he first signed. Just making the league look stupid with how good they where. Now that we've seen that, I want to see consistency, which will be hard.I mean that pass from Elis to Quito, no one saw coming or thought he was going to do it, much less make it to him. Then, Quito shows a def touch on the run, with the goalie at point blank range, to move it back to his right foot and slot it home. Shit gave me a boner! The defense is going to get caught out, it is just a hazard of the job. Now how many times one player keeps finding himself chasing a number is another thing. That' s who we start criticizing. I didn't have high hopes for beating Portland in Portland and I was impressed at times in the game to see us go toe to toe with them, we weren't scared.... something we haven't seen in a couple years. That is promising, but like someone has said recently our defense and midfield (i believe you) is not built to bunker in to take pressure. WC needs to see that if he hasn't already and keep this team in a place to not do that or get some players in there that can direct the guys on the field to maintain shape to not get caught flat footed.
Cubo's job is to do what? Score goals? 3 in 3.... I don't give shit how he does it.... as long as he does it and does it often. He could throw the damn ball in the net with his butthole from St. Emmanuel st. as long as it counts. This is a complete difference from the Cubo we saw from last year and goals aren't the only thing. He came in slimmer, he is taking defender with him, which gives people like Quioto and Elis space to do things like the goal Quioto had against Portland. Obviously we cannot rely on these three to score all of our goals and his hold play will need to improve if we are going to involve the midfield in chances to score. Granted, his hold up play isn't great or above average. The results is what I am concerned about and what I have seen as far a results is 3 games 3 goals. He isn't responsible for us losing the game or the 6 goals against in 3 game either. (not saying you are accusing him of it.)
All due respect but I feel like the kool aid censorship machine is getting running, where once the team starts winning we treat it as perfect even if it's not holding the trophy up. There are gradations of winning: MLS Cup, USOC champ, SS winner, and then merely in the playoffs, and then everyone else. My concern is a certain smugness descended around here about 2008, even though we haven't won anything big since, where when this team is winning it's above reproach. The team is only to be criticized when struggling. Except I wonder what the point is in years like last year because it was going nowhere. 've pointed out before how the difference in years like 2006 and 2007 was actually the ruthlessly successful churning of the last weak spots on the roster until we had an XI that hummed. This left behind players like Gray, Ale, Dalglish the following year, etc. This advanced the roles of players like Holden and Cameron even though we had decent talent those years. The problem is people who are like "don't touch it" when it wins a few, even if I can tell you it's a 4-6 seed and we just got our brains kicked in by Portland. How does that suggest "don't touch it?" With our history we should have more ambition than that. I also feel like there's a naïve belief what will fix this is the coach working the bugs out with the same people. Elis and Cabexas are either going to work their occasional problems out or not. I like both when they play well but they also cost us when playing poorly. Only a naïve kool aid drinker looks at one side of that equation or doesn't consider his options. The CMs are also generally a bit subpar. Even Alex we could do better than. So it's a good but flawed team. You want to come on here and back pat them or do you want to work on what flaws do exist and maybe it's even better. I'd rather be pushing this higher than backpatting about one round and out in October.
You're assuming the kick goals continue and you're neglecting the role of his offensive inefficiency and disappearance in how these games play out. As with Bruin, the more telling version of this is going to be when he comes off the streak. The sharper eyed people could tell you Bruin was holding back previous teams, but if you said it when he was on one of his streaks you got shouted down. People are only probably going to grasp what I am saying when the well goes dry.
We can play more than one formation and more than one set of personnel. There could be a "game killer" unit designed to go out there and close games. There could be game killer formations designed to clog more. Or we could put in fresher players in advanced positions to continue the same game plan with fresher legs. My complaint with WC is he goes None of the above and if you look at the box scores there is a big gap between when his players look tired and the 70-72' mark where without fail that first sub comes in. And we basically hold on to results for dear life. That's not much coaching. I don't have anything definitive on Cabezas or Elis either, but both have had poor runs of minutes where they bear watching, and have cost us. Part of the reason I am all grumbly on them is I'd expect better from them specifically. Alexander and Remick based on experience I think are simply what they are. Not very good. But Cabezas' awareness and Elis' effort, that's more frustrating, because they are starter quality.
Which is why I say we need some planned tactical adjustments in the can ready to go, and openness to unusually early subs. I think the "fitness" stuff inheres in the energy level required for the opening whistle tactics. So plan like it. Don't just wait til 70' to sub like you're playing some low energy 442. Don't just run the same formation with the same vulnerabilities whistle to whistle. It's like the opposite of Barrett where he never wanted to come out of his shell.
All due respect, from my perspective, what I see is a team winning two games despite glaring issues, loses third game badly from those issues, happy we're doing decent but particularly when the issues start costing results the serious fan should be buckled down asking questions, not still on some high that no longer accords with the result that week. I mean, as people are telling me to shut up, and quit killing their buzz, we did just lose a game, and badly, no???? If you were buzzed you ought to be suffering from the hangover headache now.
The questions have been asked by nearly every poster about the same concerns that you have written about. You just have ratcheted the hand wringing up to a high level just 3 games into the season.
To hint at another reason I think we tire out: 25/24/21 28/28/34 34/32/29/29 28 The frontline is young, but occasionally indifferent to second half responsibilities. The 8 players behind them would average a hair over 30.
You seem confused about whether my comments are standard fare or inappropriate handwringing then. You don't get to say "you're saying what we all are" but "yours constitutes handwringing we shouldn't have to endure." Hmmm. I said it's a 4-6 seed team with flaws. I have praised players like Quioto who consistently play well. You're the ones trying to spin the more critical aspects into claims of unrelenting negativity. It's a team that has some very good moments and also some horrible periods. Usually in the same game. We are not sitting atop the conference and the team has consistent bad stretches. I doubt many think an XI we have run out this season is literally as good as we can do, either from this roster or with an eye to the summer window. The Manotas move should be understood as clearing room for precisely such a move, an organizational acknowledgment this is not done. So why pretend like everything's perfect and I can't both praise and criticize. For that matter, while acting like everyone is being strictly critical, what I actually saw was a fair amount of people basically saying you can't criticize a 2-1 team that slid down the table and allowed 4 goals. You can try and offer some revisionist history where y'all beat me to critique which I won't acknowledge, but usually the reason I feel the need to emphasize some criticisms is I feel like the scenario depicted is too rosy, too kool aid. So don't pretend I am just one of many cause the whole point is I am usually surprised that certain things go unremarked. Ironically, when I see others criticizing Cabezas or the like, I tend to say my piece and drop it because it would be preaching to the choir. I tend to spend my energy on more debatable discussion where I think people have missed something or the wrong evaluation is becoming conventional wisdom.
Manotas 6, Bruin 4, Torres 0. In case anyone needed reminding. If Stumbledore is Godwin then Torres last year was like cutting and pasting Mein Kampf into a post. It's not that complicated, it's like Dominick Davis or Steve Slaton versus Arian Foster. You can laud people who rush for 1000 except someone actually good would rush for 1600 in the same scheme. Quioto has 3 goals, run of play, out on the wing in the same scheme. Ever considered that only knocking in one goal run of play while bracketed by the Hondurans is actually mediocre, Bruin-like?
you really harp on this 1 goal from run of play. Doesn't make a difference to me or a lot of people if he scored 20 goals all from free kicks and penalties. He is putting the ball in the back of the net, which is what we need. Despite your argument, he is creating chances for other people around and that is value. Bruin did neither and would regularly make attacks breakdown because he just ran at a defender. You've argued the same couple points on him enough and people still disagree with your opinion. I see your point in certain aspects, but I want the ball in the back of the net from him... how it gets there, I don't care. There is no guarantee that Manotas, in this scheme would do better. His hold up play isn't any better than Torres and I don't think his finishing is proven. IMHO. Certain other people on the field, I agree with your assessment, just not Torres. I think you are being nit picky about it.
When you have someone having a go at a player who's scored three in three matches because of his hold up play, you have someone who misunderstands the very basic essence of football and the objective. Those people need to be ignored. Why anyone listens to JuveChelsea and gives him a platform to air his completely misguided views is beyond my understanding. I've had him on ignore for longer than I can remember. Guess what? I haven't missed a thing. You won't either.
Thanks Rey - I did chuckle when I saw this. I wouldn't say Cubo and Bruin are interchangeable. Maybe the results are similar in the 433 cuz thats when Bruin did score most of his goals when Calen and the big tall African guy bombing up the flanks
You're acting like he's some great run of play forward. He has 1G and 0A when the ball is in play this season, and I think a grand total of 1G 2A in 3 years for his ball-in-play career here minus free kicks. You want to pile on with free kicks but converting a penalty and a FK right on the 18 are not what forwards are there for. He's there to knock in what Elis and Quioto and Alex create. In that effort, I actually think he's fairly ineffective. I don't see him "creating chances" for others with passes and he has no assists. I instead see him often holding onto the ball way too long back to goal because he's not really a target type. I think he is capable of short touch passes but ironically I don't see him unlocking Elis and Quioto the way they open the game for everyone else. I think y'all want this to work out of naive optimism and I have a sense he's going to score just enough goals to get his options taken and frustrate for future seasons. That's part of the reason I'm cranky is I think he's second rate and wasteful and when he cools off again and we're in some tough playoff contest, you won't have 3 goals in 3 games on a streak, you'll have a guy who disappears for long stretches and doesn't produce enough. And by that time we'll be stuck with two more years. One of my running theories on Bruin was that his scattershot nature cost us in the MLS Cups we made this decade. He too had his fans who'd tell you how he was good for 10+ goals and how they were scared we could do no better. Sometimes you need to back off of, did he score for me this week, and look at, is he scoring in the run of play? How does he look there? Is this as good as we can do? I mean, Atlanta has that guy with like 5G and he DEFINITELY looks like he'd do that in the playoffs. Torres looks like he'd disappear, we'd be frustrated, and maybe or maybe not he produces. It's misleading when you think about it from a big game perspective, will this guy score. I don't think he will. Y'all want wins and goals without really dissecting how it happens and whether the way we got them is actually optimal. A team that actually wins silverware is usually more perfectionist and concerned about these details. I think one side effect of this smugness and tendency to override streaky players is we don't know what the others can do. As you put it, "There is no guarantee." Yeah, well, if you don't play someone you have no clue. If you maintain that posturing through October we'll be betting heavily on this one little Torres streak in 3 years, and I'm not optimistic it will pay off. Even then you will quote to me whatever his goal total is, tell me we just had a bad day, and tell me he should start day 1 next year.
I get it's a production position but when Ching produced I didn't have to wonder whether the total was arguably padded by being the kick taker, and what it might mean if we (a) didn't get those kicks some big game but (b) had to rely on a middling striker with a tendency to disappear for actually run of play production. Act like it doesn't matter, it does. I'm getting as bored with this discussion as y'all are. It will play out over 30 more games. I either have him pegged based on what I see or have been too harsh. Time will tell.
So glad I put Juve on ignore if he is ratcheting up the Bruin over Torres debate. I can understand that Manotas v. Cubo debate. But Bruin? LOL
I think I've listed stuff and holdup play is just one issue. General disappearing act, as in the second half Saturday, would probably be even ahead of that. Lack of production in the run of play in his actual channel would be ahead of that. If you want to have an accurate discussion about it you might try reading the posts rather than running your mouth not knowing what you're even talking about.
You miss my point. My point is he was the third best forward last season and yet people want to act like he'd obviously do better this season than the two people who outscored him last season. That this doesn't cause anyone pause raises obvious questions to me about people's intellectual seriousness. Among other things, the same people would have expressed caution about Bruin breaking from the gate in the same fashion in prior years, including last season! Twentieth time, I think ANYONE IN THE MIDDLE RIGHT NOW WOULD BE SCORING. My argument is someone else might do even better. Ergo, I think Manotas would be doing as well or better. Heck, I do believe Bruin would be too. You can view that as discrediting all you want, but this team has changed not because the man in the middle magically got better -- he isn't better when the play is on -- but because of the wings and backs. Bruin did use to average 10 goals a season, outscored Torres last year even as he had a nightmare, and has as many goals in the run of play as Torres does this season. So I think people are full of it acting like it's crazy. Again, they have the same number of goals during game play this season. People are trying to make it into pro-Manotas, and I do think Manotas would be better than this, among other things because I think he has a better motor to stay up with Elis and Quioto when they sprint down the flanks. But more broadly, I am concerned a la Bruin last season that he might get his options taken, frustrate us a couple more seasons. I've said before I am not sure the dominant forward we deserve is even on this roster. At least part of what I want to save from the kool aid bunch is the ability to go try what's behind Door Number 2, to not commit to Torres right now based on one streak in three years. I think it will take Torres coming off boil for some of you to see the big picture and his limits. If you watch closely he is not doing much and often disappearing for key stretches of the second half when we need an outlet as a safety valve. This is then part of the reason Seattle or Portland can park on our end, is we can't possess and clear the zone.