P/I/P TFC @ Revs, 4/9

Discussion in 'New England Revolution' started by RevsLiverpool, Apr 6, 2016.

  1. RevsLiverpool

    RevsLiverpool Member+

    Nov 12, 2005
    Boston
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is true but the frustrating part was the lack of urgency until the end. If the revs were more clinical earlier in the game, they wouldn't have to live and die by reffing error at the end. A draw is probably a fair result on balance.
     
  2. patfan1

    patfan1 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 19, 1999
    Nashua, NH
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I want to thank Heaps for being consistent. Every time I see Bunbury starting up top alone, I know he's not going to score so that makes my viewing a bit easier. Looking forward to Heaps continuing this failed experiment.
     
  3. patfan1

    patfan1 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 19, 1999
    Nashua, NH
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  4. Feldspar

    Feldspar Member+

    Nov 19, 1998
    Boston, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Interesting argument, but the margin of error on that sort of estimate is so large that there's really no way the "math" is certain. Regardless, it's one of those calls that either way, someone would be howling about it at the end of the match. It happened to be us instead of Toronto this time.
     
  5. RevsLiverpool

    RevsLiverpool Member+

    Nov 12, 2005
    Boston
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Agudelo didn't make the 18 or Heaps probably would have subbed him in for Bunbury - one failed experiment for another.
     
  6. goussoccer

    goussoccer Member+

    May 23, 2001
    Avon, CT
    Andy_B - I've always thought that Lee was a tad slow in thought and hung onto the ball for at least a second too long. PLUS it was interesting that where we sit we can here what the opposition coach is saying to his team and when Lee had the ball, they were all yelling, 'watch his right, watch his right'. Everyone knows he only goes right --IMHO he got totally bossed by Bradley anytime they were near the ball together and that includes when Lee had possession of the ball and Bradley came to challenge him.

    Either Lee doesn't see the field well enough or his teammates aren't showing for him when and where he wants them to, either way he's getting dispossessed of the ball FAR too often.

    We don't have a center forward who can score on his own up top, we don't have wingers that can change the game on their own, we don't have a creative presence in the middle of the field to launch people into dangerous positions or break down an opponent. Other than that we are doing great. I DID like Koffie in my first viewing of him, had some real poise and touch with the ball in tight situations a number of times. He's not Jermaine Jones, but he does fine.

    Still not as big of a fan of Farrell in the CB spot as out on the wing. He has some flair, but it doesn't always result in as a good a play as you might want; e.g. his bicycle kick 'clear' to the 22 yard line, he needs to do better. He also hits the deck a lot --- wins the vast majority of those, but not all of them, at the wing we have a chance to recover, in the center we don't.
     
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  7. fundip

    fundip Member

    Jul 7, 2010
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    It's true! The leagues figured him out. Watch him anytime hes supporting play out on the right flank. Everything has to be a pass back out to the flank because he can't turn central and use his left. If he's at the top of the box it's some stupid chip that doesn't work. So frustrating.

    Who on the Revs can go 1 on 1 and break someone down off the dribble? Agudelo maybe?
     
  8. A Casual Fan

    A Casual Fan Member+

    Mar 22, 2000
    Agudelo. Untapped potential. But definitely trapped in an un-Swag-like funk.

    ------------------------------

    Meanwhile, Revs coach doesn't realize offense is broken, or has no good ideas on how to fix it - so continues to trot out more of the same each game, with (what looks like) no adjustments. More & better is needed from a coach in this situation.

    Also need to have a coach or mentor who can unlock whatever box the player former known as Swags is currently trapped in. Being unable to crack open and extract talent from a player like that is a sin, a massive failing, for a coach. It is further amplified on a bargain basement average-Joe roster like this, where exceptional talents are few and far between, and where one of those talents is not being leveraged. Just not right.

    Heaps is earnest, energetic, photogenic, local, unlikely to push or challenge the front office, and cheap - an ideal coach for how the Krafts see things. But he's not the coach to succeed at either of the items above.
     
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  9. a517dogg

    a517dogg Member+

    Oct 30, 2005
    Rochester, NY
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nguyen is currently in the same funk that Fagundez was in last year, where he's missing confidence so he retreats to a smaller sub-set of bread & butter moves. For Diego it was cut right. Nguyen has a bigger repertoire of 'safe' moves but it still makes him much more predictable. It also really seems like Nguyen is not confident enough to play the quick pass. Players were making runs and Nguyen just held the ball and they had to recycle, letting defenders get back in position.

    That said I think Nguyen had a great game defensively, especially the first 70 minutes. Bradley was basically a non-factor offensively.
     
  10. a517dogg

    a517dogg Member+

    Oct 30, 2005
    Rochester, NY
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Toronto agree we got jobbed http://www.torontosun.com/2016/04/10/irwin-has-come-up-huge-for-tfc-this-season

     
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  11. RevsLiverpool

    RevsLiverpool Member+

    Nov 12, 2005
    Boston
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If we believe the Toronto Sun writers and those botched calls are correctly awarded, assuming everyone makes their pk's, the revs would win 4-2 and Morrow would have gotten a red then been suspended for their next match.
     
  12. cpwilson80

    cpwilson80 Member+

    Mar 20, 2001
    Boston
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I was in section 105 with my Dad and my son (his first game!) A few comments on the play and atmosphere:

    - Koffie-Caldwell worked really well as the "2" base in the 4-2-3-1. The two continually shift with the play defensively. Toronto built very little in the center of the field, to the point where Bradley had to receive the ball 5 yards from his central defenders just to possess.

    - Great finish from Rowe, and an excellent build-up on the goal.

    - Irwin made a very nice save on Nguyen's early shot...it was one of the more dangerous chances in the game.

    - Toronto's left side was really poor in attack.

    - The Fort looks and sounds better than ever...the rest of the crowd is still the same. 10 years ago, this would have been 11,000 fans instead of nearly 17,000, but it doesn't make much of a difference in the stadium.
     
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  13. metoo

    metoo Member+

    Jun 17, 2002
    Massachusetts
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    You can put me down in "the ref screwed us" camp for that game (only that game, not for the season). I think there were 2 clear PKs that were not called, as I believe the replay of the first shout, when Bunbury fell while turning with the ball, showed that the defender clearly kicked Teal's right foot as he was turning. On top of that, I said I'm willing to accept the red card Koffie got, and the one that NYRB got, for seeming to catch players with there studs, even if the contact didn't seem that great, if that's just how things are going to be called this year, but as I recall, the replay cleared showed that Bradley put the whole sole of his foot squarely into the front of Bunbury's ankle, and he didn't even get yellow for it, and I thought he let a lot of pretty hard TFC fouls go without a card in the first half. The ref to me seemed like he was just afraid to make a controversial call, which is about as big a "no no" as you can get for a top level referee.

    Moving on to things that are totally within the team's control though, regarding Heaps, there are many personnel decisions I've questioned in the past, but starting Bunbury as a forward could well be the one that mystifies me the most. I get it if you like how he can use his speed to get behind defenses, but have we not noticed that he seems to be able to do that more when he's out on the wing. I watched on TV, forgot to record it, and turned it on about a minute before we scored, so I don't know if Teal did anything before that, but in terms of using his speed to his advantage, I only remember it happening once, when he was at forward but ended up wide right, starting from well in front of the TFC defense. And when he is in front of goal, it seems his only options are shoot well wide of the goal, shoot at the keeper, or hold onto the ball and look for someone else who isn't afraid to score. As I said before, starting him seems more based on his abilities on paper - has speed to get in behind - as opposed to having watched him play in that position. I had other questions about the subs Heaps made in the game, but at least that could be based on things we don't know, like fatigue or slight injury tweak they wouldn't talk about, but I simply don't understand persisting with putting a guy forward who isn't fit for that position. Do we know why Agudelo was not in the squad? He wasn't in the injury report.

    One thing about Rowe, he doesn't have the greatest touch, but I feel like he does seem to be able to produce the goods in when the ball comes to him front of goal. He obviously doesn't score a ton of goals, but I just have this impression that people are down on him for how much he gives the ball away and such, rightly so, but that he does seem able to score when he gets the ball in front of goal. If only we could combine this good quality with some qualities of another unnamed player on the roster...

    Minor, possibly pedantic point about this, and I could be wrong, having obviously never coached or played at close to this level, but from my experience, I'd think saying 'watch his right' is more likely to mean a player only uses his right foot, rather than he can only turn to the right. That said, I agree that Lee has not been having as much of a positive effect as he's had in previous years. Whether he's just in a funk, or if his support isn't seeing and moving like he wants them to, or more likely a combination of the 2, he's not creating as much individually as it seems he should be able to.
     
  14. VTSoccerFan

    VTSoccerFan Member+

    New England Revolution, Vermont Catamounts, NCFC
    United States
    Jun 28, 2002
    Cary, NC
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This was posted to twitter before the TFC game, but I have not seen further details.

     
  15. ToMhIlL

    ToMhIlL Member+

    Feb 18, 1999
    Boxborough, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well, all of that may be true, but did you see the Nigel DeJong tackle? That blows every theory out of the water about the refs cracking down and calling it tight.
    Yeah, funny how that works. he didn't want to be "controversial" but by disallowing the game winner, he did just that. I know it pertains to offside, but the rule of thumb always has been that if it is too close to be sure about, give the benefit to the offense. In this case, the linesman was not in a good position to see, beyond doubt, if the ball was over the line or not, so the goal should stand. Now if the guy was right on the line with a clear view, then fair enough, but the only thing worse than a ref making a "controversial" call is him guessing about a call when he is not in a good enough position to see it.
     
  16. BERich

    BERich Member+

    Feb 3, 2012
    New England
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That's been FIFA's stance for years, when in doubt give the benefit to the offense. But please, I've watched numerous games over the years, where if there was any doubt, it went against the offense. That is one point where the refs simply chicken out and go for the safe call.
     
  17. Revs in 2010

    Revs in 2010 Member+

    Feb 29, 2000
    Roanoke, VA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    To reinforce your point, I quote a local guy (much older than me, and even Doc), "a foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of small minds."
     
  18. rkupp

    rkupp Member+

    Jan 3, 2001
    My problem with Bunbury up top isn't so much about his scoring ability, but the fact that he was being asked to play as a holdup player, and he is pretty clueless when it comes to that. I don't know if Davies is still banged up, but I don't see as how he's not a better starting choice than Bunbury or Agudelo.

    On the disallowed goal, CSN SportsnetCentral had two additional replay angles that weren't shown during the game broadcast. While neither gives a definitive view, they both suggest that the ball may have been in (or above the end line) when Femi played it back. It's also clear the AR wasn't at the end line and was running to get there when he made the call. I guess I'm just inflicted with Revs-itis - it just seems like for everyone else, the home team gets that call (or non-call).

    I find it hard to discuss this game. The Revs played quite well over all and clearly deserved a win IMO. It took 3 or 4 dubious non-calls to allow Toronto to survive. I thought Koffee had an amazing game - he is the among the only ones (Watson too, though, and Goncalves) who can sense opponents over-playing them and just reverse field into open space rather than play into pressure or play back.

    IMO Watson was the MOTM (by a slight margin over Koffee). His ability to go forward and find seams in the pressure set up the Revs goal, as well as many of their other chances. I can certainly see why Heaps wanted him back out there after missing two games - and Watson vindicated Heaps quite well. I think it might be time to give Woodbury a look on the left - and see if we can get consistent attacking and crossing from both wings.
     
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  19. IRguy

    IRguy Member

    Sep 28, 2004
    Vermont
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    FYI- On the broadcast they said Juan pick up a late injury in ranting and Davis is still not fully fit (coming off an injury and has twins in the ICU).
     
  20. A Casual Fan

    A Casual Fan Member+

    Mar 22, 2000
    When I see Woodberry play with composure, get up and down the with ease, and at the same time contain David Silva, it makes me wonder why Heaps isn't figuring out a way to keep him on the field.

    I think he's a real player, with more upside than Tierney. I am not a Tierney basher, but the quality of Chris's crosses just has not been there this year, and to me that is the main reason he is on the field at all. He is hitting far too many wormburners that are failing to get past/over the first wall of defense.

    And this is not only about possibly taking minutes from Tierney. Maybe the minutes can come from other slots in the back line as well. After all, knowing that Watson plays centrally for Jamaica opens up some other possibilities if someone wants to take a really hard look at who the Revs true best 4 at the back might really be.
     
  21. SamSam

    SamSam Member

    Feb 26, 2009
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm sure Farrell and Jose can't go an entire season without missing any games, and since the Revs have no real backup for that spot, maybe Watson will end up playing there at some point
     
  22. metoo

    metoo Member+

    Jun 17, 2002
    Massachusetts
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Ironically, that call bothered me less than the ignored PK and red card calls. I didn't look where the AR was when he made the call, but even if he was a bit off the line, I can't really say that the replays I saw truly showed it was wrong, from the angle behind the goal, showing where the player jumped from, and how far his leg was sticking out, it looked like the ball could have been out of bounds. I thought the replays were far more conclusive for the calls I mentioned, so those bother me more. On the thought of avoiding controversy, it's much easier for a ref to hide behind "it's the AR's call, I have to go with that, it's out of my hands", than have to justify overruling the AR.

    Didn't see the deJong tackle, but heard about it and will look for it, along with trying to find the Bradley tackle.
     
  23. Soccer Doc

    Soccer Doc Member+

    Nov 30, 2001
    Keene, NH
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    or Barnes
     
  24. Andy_B

    Andy_B Member+

    Feb 2, 1999
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
     
  25. rkane1226

    rkane1226 Member+

    Apr 9, 2000
    Club:
    Stade Brestois 29
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm sorry but the mental picture of Juan going off on a rant that is so long and so animated that he injures himself just made me laugh out loud.

    You meant training?
     

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