Official "Mike Burns is Really Bad at His Job" Thread

Discussion in 'New England Revolution' started by Mike Marshall, Mar 4, 2018.

  1. ToMhIlL

    ToMhIlL Member+

    Feb 18, 1999
    Boxborough, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's like when a politician gets busted in a corruption scandal when his underlings do something shady. Either he's above it and had no knowledge whatsoever, or he's lying and is part of it. Either incompetent or a crook, but neither one is a very good option.
     
  2. pwykes

    pwykes Member

    Apr 18, 1999
    Auburn, MA
    If Burns’s position is part of the turnover, that would be good enough for me!
     
    NFLPatriot, RevsLiverpool and TOAzer repped this.
  3. dncm

    dncm Member+

    Apr 22, 2003
    Boston
    Here is how I read it:
    In the not as much turnover phrase:
    • There is not much turnover since they are going to buy the loan contracts on Penilla and Caicedo
    • They are going to pick up the options on Farrell, Bunbury, Knighton, and there was one other who was expiring
    • Everyone else is still under contract - Mancienne, Zahibo, Fagundez, Caldwell, Rowe, Delemea, Turner, Anibaba, Bye
    • They may or may not try to keep Agudelo who will be on a free
    Under the active season phrase:
    • They are going to go out and find 1 to 2 super studs - that is their focus

    The only problem with this is Friedel has constantly been saying that these guys don't possess the mentality or concentration that he is looking for. He continually says they are playing for their contracts. (Again, I am not sure Friedel's motivational techniques are actually working to what he thinks they will accomplish). Are Mike and Brad saying the same things in the press?
    https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2018/10/25/friedel-looking-maximum-effort-revolution-close-out-season

    And WTF is the deal with Dielna and Somi - the fact that Brad and Mike make it a point to say they are not going to comment on their situations is just so weird.

    Friedel and the Revs are going to have to demonstrate something in the off season - I will wait, but I know RevLiverpool's avatar all too well with this organization
     
    RevsLiverpool repped this.
  4. rkupp

    rkupp Member+

    Jan 3, 2001
    It's quite strange ... and to me, the Machado situation is even stranger.

    What I do know about Somi and Dielna is that they weren't very reliable - and when you are trying to stabilize a mistake prone defense, that's a really bad place to be.

    Dielna started the season well at center-back, but then got caught up making some critical mistakes amid lazy positioning (IMO). When he later got moved to LB, he played well for a while, then inconsistency started popping up there too.

    Somi was similar - started the season well, but the league figured out his weaknesses and started targeting him. I don't think that merited totally burying him, but who knows what happened behind the scenes.

    So, yeah, it's a mystery about what happened with those guys. But, we do know that they didn't play well when they had the chances, so it wouldn't surprise me if Friedel lost faith in them.
     
  5. tsb11

    tsb11 Member+

    United States
    May 31, 2018
    Earlier in the season I was really critical of fullbacks for making errors. As the season has progressed, and we've seen different fullbacks make the same mistake, I feel like the tactics are asking the players to do more than they are capable of doing. I think that has been one of the most glaring examples of Freidel's mismanagement, that he didnt realize that his players arent premier league full backs, and that he needs to set up his tactics to account for that.

    Earlier in the season he did tinker a bit, switching between back 3 and back 4, but since July its looked more like a back 2. Its no wonder that the defense has scrambled constantly in open play (the set piece failures are separate). Maybe that really is just personnel, that the full backs just stink, but to me there was a chance to ask less of them and maybe get more
     
    RevsLiverpool repped this.
  6. rkane1226

    rkane1226 Member+

    Apr 9, 2000
    Club:
    Stade Brestois 29
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    All I think Brad achieved was shrinking the pool of defenders (by getting rid of two or the supposedly better ones). He was then left with less competition and forced to put up with the mistakes of the smaller pool.
     
  7. RevsLiverpool

    RevsLiverpool Member+

    Nov 12, 2005
    Boston
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    True but the pool was small by his choice and his stubbornness, if we're being fair. Dielna and somi pissed him Anotheroff, so he buried them. A coach who preaches development and actually means it would have rotated in Segbers once he got back from OC.
     
  8. rkupp

    rkupp Member+

    Jan 3, 2001
    I'd disagree. The mistakes the back four have made individually are very elemental mental errors: Farrell trying athletic, off-balance clearances or trying to dribble in high-risk situations, Dielna getting lazy in establishing his position, Delamea inexplicably handling a high-ball, defenders being late to recognize or close-out 2v1 matchups on the perimeter, losing marks on free/corner kicks, ...
    Here I do agree. They have been aggressively pushing up the outside backs and the wings have been caught unable to cover quite often. Pretty much our outside backs don't have good, strong 2-way ability, so you are right. Somi could get upfield, but left his wing exposed too often, Farrell can get forward, but is a turnover machine who rarely makes the high-quality pass to spur the attack, Bye seems to have the physical ability, but is just green at this stage, Dielna is slowish as an outsider and struggles to get back if he ventures forward and Rowe does well up and back *most* of the time, but has his mental lapses when he still thinks like an attacker instead of a defender.
     
  9. rkane1226

    rkane1226 Member+

    Apr 9, 2000
    Club:
    Stade Brestois 29
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    But, if I'm to believe Burns, we're going to largely hang on to that crew of defenders (less Dielna and Somi) for next year based on his low off season turnover comment.

    I still don't get why Dielna and Somi were banned (please don't say salary, I haven't heard anything that says they aren't still paying it). Farrell has shown for something like 5 years that he isn't going to improve. Rowe is NOT a fit any more than Somi was. Dielna had a dual center and wing role - I don't see where our central defenders were significantly better than him. In short, IT JUST MAKES NO SENSE TO ME.

    I keep quoting your (rkupp) posts about this but note that I don't expect you to have the answer. The situation is just too perplexing and your posts make me think about it. I wish we had some semblance of press coverage on this topic.

    On a different note, I'm curious why Burn's comment has gotten a relatively low volume of responses. This team showed essentially no progress this season. In fact, they seemed to only get worse as time went on. What logical basis is there for thinking only one or two key changes (they will fail to deliver) should suffice? If Burns were a doctor his malpractice insurance premiums would be shooting through the roof.
     
  10. tsb11

    tsb11 Member+

    United States
    May 31, 2018
    I wasn't talking about the back line as a whole though, just the full backs. And with them in mind, the mentality of every fullback deployed on the pitch has been to race to the corner flag at the first hint of possession, and have onrushing attackers blow past them while they run the wrong way. It doesnt matter whether its a lack of skill with the players or a deficiency in the tactics, but at some point you have to realize hanging underwhelming CB out to dry is a losing strategy.

    WRT your comment on wings needing to cover, that is definitely not the tactic. Modern wings dont play outside, they're responsible for making cuts inside especially in single forward formations because 1 striker is too esily defended by 2 center backs. If you're going to have your wide attackers drop to a defensive position, then there is no reason to attack with your full back in the first place. The defensive responsibility for covering for attacking full backs is actually on your CDM(s).
     
  11. NFLPatriot

    NFLPatriot Member+

    Jun 25, 2002
    Foxboro, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    As much as I hate to defend Burns, I count 11 players jettisoned since Friedel took over. If they turn over more than that this winter, that would be nearly the entire roster.

    We may think there are 11 players who should be replaced, but I don't see that happening.

    I think Dielna, Somi, Agudelo and Cropper are gone at a minimum, probably 2 to 4 others.
     
  12. tsb11

    tsb11 Member+

    United States
    May 31, 2018
    Looks like the alarm went off:
    https://www.thebentmusket.com/revol...19-officials-are-currently-on-a-scouting-trip

    I'm glad that they're out looking for players, but im sad that they had to wait until the season was over to do it
     
  13. RevsRule

    RevsRule Member+

    NE Revs, LAFC
    Jun 9, 1999
    N. Eastern, Mass
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    He should be number #1

    So I assume this means that missing the playoffs, again, is fine and we don't need to do much? Well if we don't make changes... I will not attend any games next year either. I've lost track of how many years it's been now ...maybe 4... but I will not spend money to see an amateur product like Burns is offering. Since Burns is the common thread for all stinking products. I am blaming him and not the coach. Friedel wanted to start a coaching career and New England offered him the job. Staying here will most likely end his coaching dreams if Burns also stays. He will never get the players necessary to have a good team.

    I wish the Kraft's would wake the f*&k up and get a handle on what is wrong with this team. They can't be this stupid to not see that something is broken.
     
    pwykes repped this.
  14. TOAzer

    TOAzer Member+

    The Man With No Club
    May 29, 2016
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Agreed, and it is clear at the entirety of the Kraft operations that they are not stupid But it is absolutely possible that they don't give a damn that something is broken.
     
    pwykes, rkane1226 and A Casual Fan repped this.
  15. Kenp

    Kenp BigSoccer Supporter

    Feb 17, 1999
    Massachusetts
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Others have pointed out aspects of team ownership that Kraft arguably is very good at. Lest we forget, a business owner defines success differently than his customers, so I'm not sure this particular line will resonate.

    I have no doubt that Kraft is interested in putting a competitive team on the pitch- after all, it's good for business. Up to a point, that is. In the final analysis, he makes risk/reward-based decisions on how much to invest. If he doesn't think the benefits of fielding a better team are worth the investments needed to build that team, he won't make them.

    And honestly, compared to the Patriots' revenue and fan base, how much time should Robert Kraft actually spend thinking about the Revs? Jonathan Kraft should pay a bit more attention, but remember that he is also president of the Patriots, and the Kraft Group.

    Awhile ago, I used to think Robert Kraft was a genius owner for putting together the Patriots competitive dynasty. Today, I think he's primarily lucky.

    Lucky to get Belichik as a head coach (and deserving of credit for supporting Bill the way he has.) But primarily lucky for acquiring Tom Brady, whose low salary allows Belichik to surround Tom with much better players. That salary imbalance is an incredible competitive advantage.

    Not saying Bob Kraft and family aren't good business people- much evidence suggests they are. But business interests don't always align with sporting interests.
     
  16. ToMhIlL

    ToMhIlL Member+

    Feb 18, 1999
    Boxborough, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't think anyone wants Kraft to treat us the same way he does his NFL team, but there is another team who are also owned by the same guy who has an NFL team, and he treats his soccer team not as an equal, but he does treat them more seriously than what we have here. Last I looked, they were a pretty decent team on the field and get pretty good crowds.

    But I would settle for "most favored nation" status. Where our owners have the same level of commitment (financial and non-player resources) as the average of the rest of the league. The only teams that would score worse than us would be TrustFund Tony, who badly miscalculated what it would take to move his team to a city with more per capita neck beards, and maybe Chicago and/or Colorado
     
  17. firstshirt

    firstshirt Member+

    Bayern München
    United States
    Mar 1, 2000
    Ellington, CT / NK, RI
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Somi and Deilna together take up 1.33 million in cap space. Obviously the ROI on these guys is terrible. A forward making 600k should be counted on to start more than 13 games and score more than 3 goals. Can we please call the Agudelo era over and move on from this stiff? Freeing up these 3 duds gives the team over 1.9 million. That is a decent chunk of change to play with. lets hope they spend it wisely and its spent by the replacement for Burns
     
    NFLPatriot repped this.
  18. rkane1226

    rkane1226 Member+

    Apr 9, 2000
    Club:
    Stade Brestois 29
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think that money is, at most, a tertiary concern. First, the team has to accurately identify the (IMHO huge) number of spots that need filled. Second they need to actually find (truly find - and superior to past findings) qualified players to sign for ALL those spots. Third, they need money to cover the cost of the signings.

    But all evidence says they are off (low) on item 1 and Burns can only address a small percentage of the number identified anyway. So item 3 should never be a concern.
     
  19. tsb11

    tsb11 Member+

    United States
    May 31, 2018
    Current depth chart (4-3-3)
    Turner
    Empty-Delamea-Empty-Empty
    Caicedo
    Empty-Fagundez?
    Empty-Empty-Penilla

    Bench: Knighton, Bye, Angking, Bunbury, Caldwell, Wright, Rowe, Farrel, Mancienne

    Even if you end up playing ~2 bench players in the starting 11, thats still 4 starter quality players the revs need to find this offseason, and even more if some of the bench quality players end up leaving.

    Everyone who isnt listed is chaff (and tierney, who i didnt list because i think he'll retire).
     
    rkane1226 repped this.
  20. rkane1226

    rkane1226 Member+

    Apr 9, 2000
    Club:
    Stade Brestois 29
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Are we required to protect more than 4 people in the expansion draft?
     
    tsb11 repped this.
  21. tsb11

    tsb11 Member+

    United States
    May 31, 2018
    If the same rules apply as 2017; clubs can protect up to 11 players, and any homegrowns on the supplemental or reserve roster are automatically protected and do not count toward that 11.

    Cinncinnati will get to pick 5 players total, with no more than 1 coming from an individual team.

    I cant imagine the revs opting not to use all 11 protections, but I dont think anyone is all that desireable beyond the top 6 or 7 guys
     
  22. NFLPatriot

    NFLPatriot Member+

    Jun 25, 2002
    Foxboro, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I know you are joking, but they do have to protect 3 internationals out of the seven, plus anyone with a no trade clause.

    I assume Penilla, Caicedo and Mancienne would be the 3, with Dielna, Somi, Zahibo and Hauche exposed, although maybe Mancienne gets swapped out.
     
  23. Mike Marshall

    Mike Marshall Member+

    Feb 16, 2000
    Woburn, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    pwykes repped this.
  24. firstshirt

    firstshirt Member+

    Bayern München
    United States
    Mar 1, 2000
    Ellington, CT / NK, RI
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Agudelo may be someone they would look at. I can't imagine why the Revs would want him back at that salary. He is under contract until Dec 31 so why not leave him unprotected if they can
     
  25. firstshirt

    firstshirt Member+

    Bayern München
    United States
    Mar 1, 2000
    Ellington, CT / NK, RI
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Replying to @RonWaxman @Russ_Goldman
    heard he is weak when it comes to finding, identifying and negotiating with players and that some agents avoid him. is that fair to say?

    9:18 AM - 7 Aug 2017
    • 1 Like
    • [​IMG]
    0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
     

Share This Page