Mr. Josmer Volmy Altidore

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by 50/50 Ball, Aug 22, 2016.

  1. 50/50 Ball

    50/50 Ball Member+

    Sep 6, 2006
    USA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #1801 50/50 Ball, Sep 12, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2019
    I've seen virtually every have since 2001 and my front line is

    Clint Jozy Landon Or

    Jozy
    Pulisic
    Clint Landon




    Best moment is probably the Jamaica winner or the build up to LD's goal against Algeria. The goals against Panama should have got us into the World Cup would have been up there. Nobody on Earth thought we weren't going to get a draw against Trinidad and Tobago's youth sqaud.

    The guy missed three major tournaments in a row, save 14 minutes.
     
  2. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    Jozy just keeps showing up and putting in a shift. The vitriol he attracts is nothing short of mind boggling.
     
  3. 50/50 Ball

    50/50 Ball Member+

    Sep 6, 2006
    USA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If the ball against Mexico is 8 inches over and he scored, Is he a different player? Not to me,
     
  4. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    #1804 IndividualEleven, Sep 13, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2019
    In terms of players since the turn of the century, top-15.

    The goal against Spain was his best moment, imo.
     
  5. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    He has attracted very little vitriol.

    Bradley, Zardes, and Donovan--now those guys have attracted vitriol
     
  6. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    Guess it depends on your definitions... But whatever you call it, he just keeps plugging.
     
  7. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    Personal attacks or largely baseless attacks would constitute vitriol. I do agree, Jozy has accumulated a lot of caps. Being healthy is also a skill.
     
  8. 50/50 Ball

    50/50 Ball Member+

    Sep 6, 2006
    USA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Jozy has been pretty harshly criticized, like Bradley and Landon, not as bad as Zardes.

    I don't think Zardes even has many defenders.
     
  9. 50/50 Ball

    50/50 Ball Member+

    Sep 6, 2006
    USA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    People spent an inordinate amount of time talking about his weight and perceived effort.
     
  10. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    With Donovan and Bradley--the criticism reached a ridiculous personal level. That has largely not been the case with Altidore. Zardes attracts a completely different level of pathological obsession and loathing.
     
    50/50 Ball repped this.
  11. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    Well, he did lose weight and really improve his fitness. And that was just a performance-based criticism.
     
  12. 50/50 Ball

    50/50 Ball Member+

    Sep 6, 2006
    USA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    He's never been fat or out of shape. The argument was that he was too muscled. That's not a character flaw.
     
  13. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    You didn't visit the Sunderland threads much, I'm guessing. And I don't mean just caps. He drew a PK this week. He just puts his head down and punches the clock.
     
  14. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    ok, now we see you. Cool.
     
  15. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    Yeah, I was referring to his NT career.
     
  16. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    And his weight. which is when I went back to more enlightening infomercials, like home shopping reruns.
     
  17. LouisianaViking07/09

    Aug 15, 2009
    Essentially, Jozy needs an international tournament to dominate.

    If he were to score 3 goals and get 3 assists and lead the US to the QF in 2022; that'd be it.

    Or if he somehow got a return to Europe and spent 3 years scoring a good number of goals at a decent club in a top 5 league.

    But he's barely scoring for the NT (in competitive matches) so he will get some crap. And some folks still not over 2017 qualifying. Is it really any wonder that folks wanna see Weah and Sargent? Zardes is so bad that many Jozy critics have to cry for his return. That's not a strong and positive position some wanna be in.
     
  18. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    Let's see. Sarge misses a PK, so yeah... Objectivity goes out the window with Jozy. Dunno why, but imagine Jozy missed that shot.

    (And I like Sarge, and think he needs to be integrated as he's been, but there is something about Jozy makes folks a little irrational. I think because we want him to be great and he's just good, and better than other options.)
     
  19. 50/50 Ball

    50/50 Ball Member+

    Sep 6, 2006
    USA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think Sarge looks like the first real one to one replacement for Jozy.

    I think the expectations are the problem for Jozy. We saw the youngest starter at the World Cup and had dreams of Luis Suarez.

    He's very good, a guy that we would be thrilled to get if we hadn't expected more.

    I have said it before, if Jozy were an uncapped dual national with the exact same club resume, fans would want him on the team.

    If he played for Honduras or Costa Rica, he'd be a nightmare for the USMNT.
     
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  20. VBCity72

    VBCity72 Member+

    Aug 17, 2014
    Oki, J-pan
    Club:
    Plymouth Argyle FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Here are the competitive goals for Jozy:

    2009 Confed Cup: 1 goal against Spain
    2010 WCQ: 1 goal against Cuba, 2 goals against El Salvador, 3 goals against T&T
    2011 Gold Cup: 1 goal against Canada, 1goal against Guadeloupe
    2014 WCQ: 1 goal against Panama, 1 goal against Honduras, 2 goals against Jamaica
    2017 Gold Cup: 1 goal against Jamaica, 1 goal against Costa Rica
    2018 WCQ: 3 goals against SVG, 2 goals against T&T, 2 goal against Panama, 1 goal against Guatemala
    2019 Gold Cup: 1 goal against Panama

    Other tournaments:

    No goals in our 2010 WC crash out, got hurt in the first game of the 2014 WC, no 2018 WC
    Did not play in the 2009 and 2013 Gold Cup, only played in the group stage of the 2015 Gold Cup/no goals
    Did not play in the 2016 Copa America
     
    majspike and LouisianaViking07/09 repped this.
  21. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    Cool. So if goal scoring in a meaningful game's your metric for "good" strikers...
    Here are guys with WC goals in 2014 (Jozy did not play meaningful minutes):
    Demsey
    Green
    Brooks
    Jones
    Here are guys with goals in WCQ games 2013:
    Dempsey 3
    Altidore 4
    Evans
    Zusi 3
    Johnson 2
    LD
    Johannsson

    So... what's the question again?
     
  22. LouisianaViking07/09

    Aug 15, 2009
    Wouldn't you expect your no.1 striker to score goals? He performed real well in the Hex. I'm not blaming his injury on him but I am saying he has yet been able to deliver in a tournament. He hasn't been a Golden Boot winner in a Gold Cup which he should easily have been able to or make the All Star Team of the Tournament.

    Lack of Big moments in a NT jersey will lead fans resentful.
     
  23. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    Well, I'm going to suggest that says more about fans than the player.

    Or we could start Green and Brooks up top.

    I mean, we got supposedly serious guys on here wanna talk about Jozy was "too fat" at one point? When? "Needs to do yoga?" Wtf? It's just weird and silly. Mostly it's Anglo-wannabes who are hurt they had to go to their Faux-pub to watch EPL and get ribbed for Jozy not scoring, I think. Eric Idle made fun of me at the Fox and Hound!! Waaaaahhhh....

    Here's some reality. Wondo skies it over the bar in Brazil. Sarge misses a PK v. Mexico. AronJo hurt and only moderately effective. After 2012, anyone not named Dempsey or Jozy scoring in WCQ/Finals for the US is as likely to be a defender or middie aS a striker or attacking winger (Fabio, Jones, Brooks...)

    It's not that Jozy is great. It's that no one in a US Jersey not named Clint has proven to be better. So sure, I'm mad he's not Suarez too... but I'm also mad I'm not Jeff Bezos (with hair...) So there's that.
     
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  24. LouisianaViking07/09

    Aug 15, 2009
    Our guys need competition. They need to know someone will steal their spot. even if it's a guy who can only score by accident. They need that PUSH.
     

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