They never lead and were down TWICE, tying in the 91' minute. But this group of players is mentally weak? No mames. If anything this group is the strongest mentally we've ever had when you consider their club situations, with some players being benched, without a team, futures uncertain. Also consider how mentally strong you have to be to deal with osorio rotaciones and his constant lineup changes. With all due respect, your arguments are whack. A mentally weak team is not capable of winning a Confeds Cup in Russia of all places. Also getting bounced early could happen to anybody and if we did get bounced Osorio's tinkering would at least have to share blame if not full responsibility. Again with all due respect, you look and sound like this guy,
I think a lot could be because of the improvement by everybody. Mexico has improved a lot but so have other teams. I said in Copa America 2016. Mexico has sent a lot of players to Europe and has a talented team but Chile and Colombia did the same or even more. In 98 Chile had Salas and Zamorano (and Salas was still in River Plate) and a bunch of guys in Chile or lesser leagues than Europe. Colombia's great generation only had Asprilla with some success in Europe. In other things it's even clearer like CONCACAF. Not only Mexico wasn't affected by the altitude in Azteca but also teams were a lot worse. The US was the only team that was good enough to tactically pull out the bunker in Azteca (which they did), the rest of the teams would try to do it and either do it terribly from the start or for a while until they unravel. Now teams are physically trained enough to be able to do it for a lot more time. I also think they are certain things that happen. In 2001 Meza was so terrible very fast that the FMF was able to fire him just in time (and even then they took a while). In 2013, Chepo had a lot of success before and thus was given a lot more time and chances to the point that it was almost too late. I also think cohesion was part in that Mexico's strategy for 98 that paid off was having that long camp and being more in tune. Because of the less difference in talent, they were able to do well while something like that wouldn't work now .
in terms of mentality this team is doing much better in 2017 compared to 2016 to me those opinions are valid
I don't agree with him yet I don't get your argument at all. The point is who is stronger, not that who is less means they are a weak team. Also it's just 1 game. The tournament just started. People should slow down.
The guy has class and he can clearly elaborate his plans and strategies in English and Spanish. AND his plans and strategies actually make sense on paper. Both of Portugal's goals were the results of defensive mistakes. We played much better while defending corner kicks, and set plays. Memo is always going to be shaky in the air but he's clutch when we need him. Moreno was a G all game, we applied pressure as a team, Jonathan showed why he should never be left off the starting 9. Herrera was a workhorse on both ends of the field. He screws up little passes here and there but he's tough as hell. We definitely need to translate the time on the ball into chances and shots on goal. But we missed some clear chances, and we got lucky that Portugal missed some too. The game was back and forth. Mexico was in clear control for large stretches of the game, and Portugal came close a few times right before their second goal in the second half. It was a good game and the result was fair.
So you're saying these players haven't grown mentality and talent wise in 4 years? Que están estancados? Sure the 7-0 happened but it also happened to Bra7i1. It was just the perfect storm. My point is not that these guys have suddenly gotten miles better but they're definitely handling the situation better than they were 4 years ago. I feel like mentally they're getting tougher and seem more prepared to fight back than they would have even a year ago. Let's not under sell these players just because they're not playing how we would like them to play.
where is the luv for reyes. Dude was shutting down CR7, hustling back and forth. Never realized but guy is actually fast for being so tall
It agree with just about everything, but Moreno left Quaresma wide open on the first goal. CR7 is a fantastic player but 3 players focusing on him is how you get tapped on the ass. Thankfully he redeemed himself with the goal at the end.
Estas mal informado, y lo preocupante es que esto que dices tu lo dicen y piensan la mayoría de aficionados mexicanos y los de la media. Empecemos: -Herrera jugo solo 200 minutos en las eliminatorias para el 2014. -Ochoa de los 16 partidos de esa eliminatoria, solo jugo 360 minutos, es decir, 4 juegos completos. -Layun jugo 180 minutos en esa eliminatoria. -Jimenez jugo menos de 100 minutos. De ahi ya partes muuuuuuuuuuuuuy mal... ahora: Los peores resultados de esa clasificación y su alineación. Aztecazo ante Honduras: Corona, Meza, Reyes, Moreno, Salcido, Reyna, Torrado, Gimenez, Arce, Dos Santos, Peralta. Derrota 2-1 de visitante ante Honduras: Corona, Meza, Reyes, Moreno, Salcido, Reyna, Torrado, Gimenez, Arce, Gio, Peralta. Derrota 2-0 en Columbus: Corona, Reyes, Salcido, Mier, Moreno, Guardado, Gimenez, Zavala, Arce, Hernandez, Gio. 0-0 contra U.S.A en el Azteca: Ochoa; Salcido; Dos Santos; Aquino; Meza; Hernández; Moreno; Reyes; Zavala; Guardado y Torres. Mexico 2-1 Panama: Ochoa, Ayala, Torres Nilo, Layun, Marquez, Peña, Zavala, Aquino, Peralta, Hernandez, Gio. Luego mencionas a Peralta cuando el fue de los pocos que jugaron bien en esa eliminatoria. Otros como Gio, Hernandez, Guardado y Moreno si fueron constantes y tuvieron culpa pero al mismo tiempo son jugadores que han tenido muy buena carrera en selección, Gio es de los que mas titulos ha ganado, Hernandez el goleador historico, Moreno de los tres mejores centrales que hemos tenido y tuvo una muy buena copa del mundo en el 2014, Guardado muy constante y regular. Por 4 o 5 jugadores quieres englobar a todos, y no, no fueron lo mismos que casi se quedaban sin mundial.
Esto lo repiten tanto los periodistas y los aficionados. La respuesta es porque así es el futbol... Croacia con Modric, Rakitic, Mandzukic, etc, no paso de la fase de grupos en el 2014. Portugal con Cristiano Ronaldo no paso de fase de grupos en el 2014. Argentina con Messi y todos sus cracks no ha ganado nada en 24 años. No es fácil, pero en el 2014 se quedo lo mas cerca posible de lograrlo. Sumale la medalla de oro y que tenemos dominados a los gringos desde hace como 7 años(quitando los partidos de las eliminatorias pasadas), y dudo que otra generacion haya hecho mas que estos. A muchos de ellos les dio culo irse a Europa, como decimos acá. Campos, Arellano y Boy, por mencionar algunos, tuvieron ofertas reales para jugar en Europa y decidieron quedarse en su zona de confort. Eso dice mucho de la pobre mentalidad que tenían. El boom de mexicanos comienza gracias al titulo sub-17 del 2005 y al trabajo de Ricardo La Volpe que culmino en la CC y WC del 2005 y 2006 respectivamente, donde por el buen juego de varios jugadores mexicanos llamaron el interes de Europa. Eso no es debatible, Chile y Colombia tienen los mejores equipos de su historia, lo dicen ellos mismos.
planning doesn't account for individual mistakes. however, i will critize osorio for his tactics when it comes to creating chances. tactically he has not solved the bunker problem. one thing i don't like is his teams don't seem to like to take shots from distance. my guess is he doesn't want rebound into counter attack with the team wide open but for me you can't play scared and you need to take your chances. habla bien como un argentino
I thought that at first too, but then I saw that Moreno was positioned to pick up the player on top of the box (#15). It was a great run by Quaresma and great vision by CR7, but really the only player at fault was Salcedo.
1) Go back and read. This discussion started when Kaney said that this team is stronger mentally than past generations. I refuted this by saying that a lot of these guys are the same that struggled to even qualify and who gave up against Chile. Which was more of a criticism to the hyperbole I thought Kaney was using. Thats why I used the phrase "Calm Down." This whole discussion was about comparing the mentalities of different eras. Some of you guys need reading comprehension classes, you guys read what you want to read. Panfilo called them weak mentally, down with him, arrgghh!!!! 2) Going to Europe has polished their tactical and technical skills. They had the guts to go to Europe I'll give them that, but to be fair its a lot easier to go to Europe nowadays. Before the Bosman ruling it was tougher to get bought by Atletico Madrid (Luis Garcia) then to get bought by Manchester United nowadays (Chicharito). Plus the TV money has made a huge effect on how much midtable Euro teams pay compared to twenty years ago. Its a lot easier for Memo to sit out and wait for his chance at Malaga while making a million plus euros a season, than if he had been at the same club in the 90s making a third of that. There is a reason why Luis Garcia preferred to go back and play for America than to fight for a spot at Real Sociedad. Of course they can grow mentally. In fact, JCO brought in Imanol Ibarrondo to work with the team in mental aspects last October. So their might be improvements, time will tell. But this also shows that JCO thought the team needed to work on their mentality. He wasn't the first to think this. Still doesn't mean they are better than past generations when it comes to mentality.
Hyperbole? We're talking about something that cannot be objectively measured like goals or assists or saves. This is some of us making the observation and like a blowhard, you come in with a "calm down" as if to suggest anyone who doesn't agree with you must be a noob. C'mon guy. Don't pull a VS. You're better than that.
1). No, los que casi se quedan sin mundial en el proceso anterior son la MINORIA de los que ahora juegan, te hablo de los 14 mas importantes. Lo de Chile si fue toda su culpa, pero para mi fue mas error de Osorio, tan solo con jugar con Dueñas de 5 ante un equipo asesino como Chile fue una locura, sumale que en linea de 4 puso a Aguilar y Layun de laterales cuando no saben defender. 2). Bullshit... no es solo ir, compa, es ir y demostrar estar a la altura, en Europa si no la armas te dan una patada en el trasero y te regresas, como Hermosillo en Belgica, Negrete en el Sporting, etc. Es ir y estar al nivel, ellos no solo no lo estuvieron(la mayoria fracasaba o se regresaba rapido como Garcia), sino que ademas muchos tenian la chance de jugar en Europa y decidian quedarse en Mexico. No les quitemos meritos a los de ahora hablando de la ley bosman y demas cosas.
I agree with @Kaney these players are mentally stronger. Not only that but sports athletes evolve forward and today's players are smarter, bigger, stronger, faster, healthier, etc... Sports technology and medicine also advances. Ignoring coaches, any previous generation against this group would get their asses whipped.
Los americanistas critican mucho a La Volpe por lo de Blanco y por la final anterior pero hay que ser objetivos, esa selección jugaba bien y a partir de esas performances en torneos internacionales es que varios jugadores mexicanos salieron a Europa. Esa combinacion del mundial sub-17 del 2005 y el buen juego del tri de La Volpe fue el inicio del boom de mexicanos a ligas europeas, que ahora ya esta marcado el camino, actualmente todos los jovenes de 15, 17 años ya traen en la mente jugar allá.