@JamesBH11 What is the name on the PSV Jersey that Ronaldo wears in this picture? Season 1995/96! Also what is the name on the Barca Jersey that Ronaldo wears in this picture? Did you say Adidas in your previous post. I am afraid Barca never signed Adidas in the 90's nor Ronaldo ever!
ADIDAS was a main supply for PSV from NIKE got a contract with Philips at PSV in mid 1995 *when R9 was close to move to Barca OK? So that pic you showed was in 1995 end season! Quickly R9 was bought to Barca and left NIKE with PSV alone LOL \\ So fact said: NIKE followed R9s footsteps of success - not the other way around like you IMAGINED Because of the close ties with Philips, PSV have had the same jersey sponsor without exception since 1982, the year jersey sponsorships were introduced in the Eredivisie. This is a record in Dutch football. PSV’s first clothing sponsor was Le Coq Sportif, from 1970 to 1974, when it switched to Adidas. They remained sponsor until 1995, when they were replaced by Nike – who are still sponsoring the club as of today.
Exactly! Which contradicts your claim that he signed his contract only until 97/98 season. Shot your own toe. In the end of the day, Nike president himself said he signed Ronaldo in 1995. Which is the only FACT here. Its between James and Nike president. So Nike president statement is the only fact, while James statement is just self made mumbo jumbo. So you are telling me, that I should not listen to what the folks who signed Ronaldo are saying and instead listen to you? Give me a break! You have already failed to present any proof since you wrongfully claimed Barca/Ronaldo was sponsored by Adidas which is FAR from reality. 1995 PSV = Nike! 1996/97 Barca = Kappa! You are wrong on all counts. Stop claiming facts and dismissing others as nonsense when it is clear you are the one who got every thing wrong.
Bottom line NIKE followed R9's footsteps to every single club (to PSV, to Barca and Inter) = not like you imagine Period
And for your own INFO! Nike signed Romario, Maldini and Bebeto in 1993! Nike signed Ronaldo R9 and many others in 1995! Nike signed PSV in Summer of 1995. Before that PSV was Adidas (pre-1995 season). Ronaldo arrived in summer 1995. I know this cause I was 18 years old and was among the millions of Dutch teenager watching his presentation to the fans life! PSV is my foremost main club. For your info. Until 1994, Brazil NT "Selecao" was sponsored by Kappa. Kappa was a daughter company of Nike. Nike owned major shares in Kappa. After the success of WC94, Kappa terminated his contract with Selecao to make way for Nike. Nike signed a 100 million US Dollar contract with Selecao for 10 years. At the same time they signed Ronaldo. In the Selecao/Nike contract it was stipulated that Ronaldo should be given priority to have playtime in at least 50 friendlies for the coming seasons. This was confirmed by many Brazilian posters like Celito in the RoRo thread. Of course, back then you denied this. Another official FACT you denied. Nike renewed his contract with R9 in 1998. Because he became the main superstar in the world of football and his PSV season contract with Nike had to be adjusted to reflect his stardom. His new contract was raised to 100 million USDollars for unlimited time. (in 2008 Nike reprimanded Ronaldo for his adventure blunder with 2 transvestites in a hotel in Rio. Nike warned Ronaldo about his contract obligations to keep a clean image otherwise he might lose the contract) this was also a FACT here is the source which confirms the 100 million US dollar contract: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/05/03/brazilian-soccer-star-ron_n_99975.html FC.Barcelona was sponsored by Kappa since 1992. Kappa was main jersey sponsor between 1992-1998. After this Nike got the contract which is extended till today. Romario wore Puma until 1988. Between 88' and Summer of 93 he wore Lotto! He signed with Nike at the same time he signed Barca in summer of 1993. Romario was the first major Nike sponsored player along with Maldini. The boots is the famous classic Nike "Tempo". James, apart from your extensive use of stats on Ronaldo, you cannot teach me a tat on R9, cause i have seen a lot more about R9 you ever have. I have seen 95% of all his matches ever. And to top it up, I can be among the few here on bigsoccer who can claim to have seen Ronaldo in real life 2 x times playing for my Club PSV in Phillips Stadium. Have you ever seen Ronaldo in person? I have in Phillips Stadium when I was 18! So do not try to challenge me on Ronaldo. And do not ever call me a hater again. It is just not fair.
What you mean with "not like I imagine"? To start with, I am not the one here who claimed him to have signed until Barca. It was you! Instead I was correct in all my claims. So do not turn the table on me and pretend I was wrong cause I have shown you proof with pictures! "Like you imagine" Gosh where does that come from? The thing is you fabricate your own rules of debate as we go along. You use the word FACT openly without even know what the definition of the word is. Then when you seem to lose valid points then you will say "whatever, you are a hater". I hope many posters will read our exchanges in the last few pages and see your nonsense claims of FACT, and how you change your position and statements when the heat is on you. Bad loser.
@JamesBH11 take the following advice seriously. For it might improve the way you communicate with others and improve mutual respect between you and your peers. here are a few definitions of the words (from Wikipedia) you are so obsessed with in your posts and arguments -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- FACT A fact is something that has really occurred or is actually the case. The usual test for a statement of fact is verifiability, that is, whether it can be demonstrated to correspond to experience. Standard reference works are often used to check facts. Scientific facts are verified by repeatable experiments. PROOF A proof is sufficient evidence or an argument for the truth of a proposition. NONSENSE Nonsense is a communication, via speech, writing, or any other symbolic system, that lacks any coherent meaning. DELUSION A delusion is a belief held with strong conviction despite superior evidence to the contrary.[1] As a pathology, it is distinct from a belief based on false or incomplete information, confabulation, dogma, illusion, or other effects of perception. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ So next time, when you feel the "itch" to quickly dismiss your peers as IGNORANT or FANBOY for disagreeing with you, before you have even read carefully what they have written, read and read these definitions above over and over again. Cause you have gained quite a reputation for your arrogant claims of FACT without presenting the evidence to your peers. No evidence means no proof means no FACT. All else is just NONSENSE and DELUSION.
Delusionist (loike you) would think/Imagine NIKE can turn a player into TOP10 (or around) greatest all time Tell NIKE to make Beckhama and CR7 as closer to R9 can you? LOL Last and not least there is NO absolutely any evidence to the least of your illusion period 1- Stop hating 2- Stop turning into another Romario debate (this is R9 vs Messi under 23)
NIKE only paid a serious huge contract to Ronaldo when he moved to Inter Also NIKE paid the world record (after Jordan of 80s) ~15mils for R9 to prepare WC98 1998 was NIKE FIRST EVER WC event participation. At time NIKE was nothing in World Football ... (that 15mils ad was just the big start for NIKE into Football) ADIDAS was always the first choice AD KIT for WC until now At time R9 was already 2times WPOY
This is the very first NIKE (biggest) contract to R9 ... and look at his face and "SHAPE" Do not tell me that was R9 in 1993 LOL (note the NIKE Chief of the contract was not shown the face) ... That was 1997 when R9 arrived to Inter For the info: Canavaro 94, Figo 95 were all wearing and were NIKE stars for the shoes way before R9 ==========================================================\ BOTTOM LINE: By WC1998: NIKE borrowed R9 fame to make their first ever AD in WC with 4+billions people watching that event
It's all "of the tangent" responds, none are vindicating your earlier baseless claims. This has nothing to do with your baseless claims in the previous posts. Let me remind you It was you who claimed that Nike signed Ronaldo only in 97/98, which is false! On the other hand, I in turn, have shown proof that Nike hired Ronaldo since 1995. This is a fact. So now you have lost the argument, you have to change your original claims and and make a few more baseless claims. In the end, Nike signed first contract with Ronaldo in Summer 1995. Nike own president words. And this is what matters. This is the proof. All the things you say here is noise and contradict Nike's own statement. There is no reason to listen to you anymore, cause it is clear you have a problem with accepting real facts. Go on fabricating false facts with other gullible posters who knows little. But with me, you have no chance. Neither your beautiful big pictures of Ronaldo and your BOLD CAP SLOCK WORDS, will convince nor persuade me or any serious poster. Only dumb people will listen to your noise. Again, Nike herself told the story on TV, and confirmed they signed a contract with R9 in 1995. This is the only fact that matters. Not James's fabricated and delusional fact. Wake up from the fantasy world James!
The picture above is not proving anything James. Between 1995 till his retirement (even after retirement) Ronaldo has been seen in many Nike pictures. Even this week you can see Ronaldo promoting his trademark football boots on Nike website! It is clear you do not know what "proof" and "fact" means. Stop using these words without a clue.
This comment above has nothing to do with me. Any poster reading my previous post will know I never said that. Besides "going off on a tangent" as usual is the case, you are also putting words in my mouth too. You know no honor. clearly you are a bad loser! I have got nothing to tell Nike. Nike themselves have told the world on TV they signed their first sponsorship contract with Ronaldo back in 1995. It is all over the internet and even on TV! You are the only person (besides religious fanatics) I know off who would turn the blind eye and dig his head in the ground and pretend not to see the clear cut evidence and proof. You live in denial James. Have ever heard of the old "three wise monkeys" phrase ""see no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil"? This is James! Again you are showing how great a liar you are. I am not going to comment on the "stop hating" point cause I am sick and tired of that old excuse of yours. Any poster who disagrees with your R9 fanatic propaganda automatically gets your famous quote "stop hating". As soon as you run out of excuses and lose ground you will change tactics and resort to dismissing posters as "haters". How pathetic. But on the second point you made here, it is obvious how big a cheater and bad loser you are. You have no honor. You do not have any appreciation for ethics nor care about dialogue. Everyone who reads our last two pages of exchange of words will notice immediately that I have not even once brought up Romario into this debate. To the contrary, it was you who mentioned the name Romario first to try distract me and make me look as a fanboy. But any serious reader would read our post in the last two pages and notice that you are the one between us not listening. So now that you ran out of steam and excuses, you have to bluntly lie to the readers that I want to turn the original "Ronaldo vs Raul UCL2003" and "Ronaldo's Nike contract history" debate into a Romario debate? It was you who tried to use your old cheap tactics to turn this original debate on UCL 2003 and Nike contract into a Romario debate, not me. You mentioned Romario more then 3 times since we started debating. Liar! James, you are a very naughty and dishonest poster. I hope many posters read you comments and notice your lies and realize who you really are. You cannot even have a normal discussion with any one. It's all big pictures of idols and copy and paste of news paper/magazine articles topped up by your obscured stats lists and blunt claims of baseless facts. But a real dialogue on equal terms like grown ups is something you lack. So why should I take your claims of FACT seriously? In the last two pages, the only FACT is the one of Nike president himself! Nike president Mr. Cees Van Nieuwenhuizen goes on TV and says "we signed Ronaldo in the Summer of 1995", then in the same documentary PSV manager/coach Dick Advocaat adds "it was with the help of Nike that we managed to outrun other Clubs in the race to sign the young Ronaldo". But Jamesbh11, has to play the "three wise monkeys" and live in denial!
OK mate ... let's stop here ... it ain;t going anywhere You can keep your imagination that NIKE can make a legend from their money I will keep my fact: NIKE followed R9 success and endorsed him more and more (like they did with Michael Jordan: Nike never make Jordan a great legend of basketball player, for they used his name)
Last piece of information about NIKE (straight from NIKE document of history): NIKE only learned the FIRST time how important a WC in football meant (thanks to the WC94 was organized in the USA) Look an estimate of 30+ BILLIONS men watching the WC (all games) driving the hunger of NIKE to get into Football Market. NIKE made a list of all good names: Romario, Ronaldo Canavaro Totti Figo ... as the ones they will plan to endorse big time ... They followed Brazil NT as winner (WC94) and learned : Romario got older and will return to Brazil (no longer attractive) while the "new KING" was only 17 named Ronaldo was doing great in Brazil and PSV That's how they started MONITORING R9 talents and achievement from PSV to Barca before they made a WORLD RECORD endorsement of 15mils in late 1997 (before WC 98 started) - Given fact Brazila and Ronaldo were so favorite to win that WC. Here is the first NIKE kit for Brazil in WC98 (with Ronaldo signature)
In the end of the day, you were wrong on all your claims you went even as far as telling lies about me turning the topic into a Romario debate when I never even talked about Romario not even once, but it was you who mentioned the name first and then you pushed the name Romario in the subject in the hope to cause confusion and to take the heat of you. Which I found very dishonest on your part. It is not the first time you did this to me. It is clear that when you seem to run out of arguments that you will resort to dishonest tactics to discredit your opponents. Oh yes, James, I know your style. I hope you realize now, that I am not an easy push over and that I cannot be fooled nor toyed with. So do never try again to lie against me or put words in my mouth cause I am sharp as a knife and can detect this cheeky little nasty tactics. Hit and Run tactics do not work with me. Today my discussion with you was not about whether Nike was the driving force behind R9 career success or that Nike followed R9 success or the other wat around. Instead it was to show you that your blunt claims of FACT are not FACT at all! While you tried hard to present some nice posters of R9 in 1998, I in turn presented real hard evidence from R9 own bosses in PSV and Nike confirming all I have said about the "when" and "how" he got sponsor contract. The following was presented by me: 1. Real pictures of R9 in Nike PSV jersey dating 1995, and Nike boots in the midst of WC94. 2. Accounts from Nike president who sponsored R9 confirming when and how they got R9 sponsored. 3. Accounts from PSV manager Dick Advocaat who signed and coached R9, stating how Nike helped PSV sign R9. All the three points above debunked and disprove your blunt claims of FACTS. But even with the most convincing direct evidence of what really happened, you still choose to be in denial. Like the "three evil monkeys" I posted earlier. So as you can see, we should take whenever you make bold claims of FACTS with a pinch of salt and not believe blindly in what you say. No I have said what I felt I had to say. And I have no further to say. The truth has been told. have a good one!
I have already answered and you denied to read the fact? the one denial tend to thinks others wrong? LOL 1- Ronaldo signed for PSV in 1994 (PSV were still with ADIDAS since 1974), and until 1995 NIKE (followed R9) did make the deal with PSV - replace ADIDAS 2- Yes NIKE officially , by the end of 1997 made a breaking record 15mils for R9 (when he was moving from Barca to INter) shown on the picture of NIKE history (In previous post) 3- Wrong info and Advocaat was BS ... in 1994, fact said ManU, Udinese (by Zico) and Barca tried to sign R9 before PSV by Romario (but R9 DID LISTEN TO ROMARIO advise: come to smaller club and be a key player instead of a sub for big club) to join PSV, ontop of the fact PSV finally made the highest salary offer (than both ManU and Barca) =============================================================== Like I mentioned, why not NIKE made a FIGO (signedby 1996 before Ronaldo), Beckham (signed by 1999) or CR7 (after Ronaldo 2004) and lately Neymar (2009) another fenomeno? There is only one Ronaldo fenomeno (even Mourinho a Portuguese coach confirmed with CR7 LOL)
But wait a minute. Are you telling my own story now mate? to be honest that story you are telling here about Nike, I have told it myself many times over in the old Ro-Ro. Almost in the same lines as you did, only you slightly changed it to sound like its your original idea. But didn't you dismiss it back then and called me hater for telling the exact same story you are telling here right now? What made you change your mind all of a sudden? I can go back to Ro-Ro thread and copy my own posts and past them here and you will see that you rewriting my own old comments I made 2 years ago when I told you this story of Nike, but as i remember didn't you dismiss me as delusional back then? To other posters who might be reading this, i'd like to inform you that I have personally made these comments 2 years ago in the old Ro-Ro. A story I told with good intentions. Many posters back then repped my post and said it was very insightful. But as I remember it, James was the only poster who dismissed it and called me delusional and R9 hater. We also posted a 30 minute long documentary produced by one of the most reputable Dutch national TV broadcasters in which Nike president of the time who hired Ronaldo and PSV manager Dick Advocaat confirmed my story. The interviews were translated by PuckVanHeel into English who spend 5 extensive pages dedicated to explaining posters. The translation and the video can be found in the Romario vs Ronaldo thread. Again, back then James was the only poster who dismissed this hard evidence of what I have so many times commented and he even called me delusional and an R9 hater. But suddenly, today, he seems to post a comment telling the exact same story about Nike which he himself 2 years ago dismissed as fabricated stuff. This is James hypocrisy. Ironically when I told the story in the exact line of yours here above, but 2 years ago, you dismissed me as hater and nonsense story. But now, all of a sudden, you bring up an old story I had told so long ago and post it here as if it is your original idea. You should have listened to me back then and repped my post instead of dismissing it and criticize me only to change your mind later. We would have avoided many disputes.
Dear lord! Look how shallow do you interpret things mate. Celito was right. This is why you don't get it. Because you do not know how the corporate business world works. When Nike signed PSV in the summer of 1995, the negotiations had already taken place a year earlier. Which is in the documentary Puck posted 2 years ago. You did not watch the video and you did not read Pucks translations where Nike president told the whole story how they liaised with 1. Ronaldo in 1994 just after WC94 2. CBF parreira and Teixeira 3. PSV representatives in the summer of 94. You refused to look into the only account on Nike sponsorship of PSV and R9 that exist on the planet because you didn't want to blow the fantasy bubble you live in. See no evil, hear no evil! And now, you show your ignorance on how the corporate world works. Did you really think that when Nike signed PSV in summer of 1995 that the negotiations took place on the same day? in what world do you live James? Everything about the contract, the negotiations, the talking, the introductions, the payments etc took place since summer of 1994 in preparation for when ADIDAS contract expired a year later. Do you understand now? Be glad I have the patient to even explain to you the very elementary basics on how business enterprises go about sealing contracts. You have learned something new today. Be glad. But do you see why you're so biased with your fact claims? it is because you do not even understand the basics of the business side of football. I did not even argue about this. But since you brought this up. Yes, this took place as I still remember the headlines and the hype. But this was not Ronaldo's first Nike contract. Instead It was a renewal and upgraded version of the already contract. Which is something that happens all the time James. Messi just got an upgrade on his already long existing contract with Barca. Now his upgraded version of the contract has a higher salary. But it is not to be confused as if this is his first contract with Barca doesn't it? Gosh! So in 1997 Nike revised Ronaldo's contract and made an upgrade to reflect his new stardom as the best player in the world! But it was not his original contract cause the fact is the Mr. Cees Van Nieuwenhuizen signed Ronaldo since summer of 1995! And in 1997 after Ronaldo became the number one player in the world they had to upgrade his existing contract on new terms to reflect his new status. But he was already a Nike sponsored player since 1995! Capiche? You are confusing and mixing things up here. First, Yes, he spoke to Romario just after WC94. But that took place only after he was approached by Mr Cees Nieuwenhuizen and PSV scout. There were many Clubs who were in the race to sign Ronaldo. One of them you missed which was mentioned by Van Nieuwenhuizen and PSV scout was Ajax! But Nike rushed to offer more money. They said that Nike had informants eavesdropping on Ajax moves hence they knew how to beat all the other Clubs. Also they said that because of the amount of money they put on the table (by Nike!), they won the race. This is in the Ro-Ro thread for you to read. Thanks Puck for his time translating the interview. Next time do not tell me delusional or hater when all I was doing was being honest and telling the truth. You see you came in a bit late James. Your version of the story is only half of the whole. You should have watched the documentary and read Pucks translations. Today you would have not been misinformed and we would have spared the disputes. (as a side note. You are the only person I know who will dismiss what an official manager states about players they themselves have hired and coached. I do not know how you do that. Dick Advocaat and PSV scouts obviously knows more about what took place in 1995 when they sat on the negotiating tables with R9 agents and made offers. This is the most self evident thing. But somehow you seem to dismiss God's own claims of the bible. Like the client arguing against his lawyer in court about how to interpret the law. Like a student dismissing his own teacher on how to do the maths. Like having a little daughter arguing with her mother on how to give birth! Like an amateur driver telling Schumacher how to drive a car. Have you seen an amateur driver arguing against Ayrton Senna on how to drive faster? James this is exactly what you are doing)
for you bold part ... I am always go with FACTS not Speculation like you. Sorry there was NO official documents *at least NOT by NIKE history, nor PSV history that NIKE "convinced PSV" to sign R9 = biggest BS Fact said PSV signed R9 first *and recorded in R9 biography that he did want to follow Romario's foot step, and then 10months later NIKE signed with PSV. ========================================== \ This is my LAST post about this speculation of yours: Until the day (?) NIKE will successfully make another "Fenomeno" (in 10years? or ever?) then may be your assumption will be less nonesensical!
I do not get it. How do you do this mate? Its mind blowing how hard headed you are. Honest. So the president of Nike Mr. Cees Van Nieuwenhuizen going on TV to tell the story himself is not official to you? So you dismiss Nike own boss. The guys that runs the place and pay the check to hired Ronaldo. You dismiss him and expect me to believe in you instead? Its like watching Barack Obama today on CNN making statements and then dismissing any person tomorrow who would tell you Barack Obama was on TV the day before. Actually in your case even worse, cause you go as far as saying that Obama making statements of his own policies are not officially historical because it is not written somewhere in a document. Are you serious? Where is the logic in this James. Give me a break. You want official document but the guy that hired Ronaldo back in 1995 along with the PSV managers and scouts who were there are dismissed by you. You know what James, I think right now many posters are reading this and they would think that I am a real fool for wasting my time trying to reason with you. And I cannot blame them .For I am a fool trying to reason with you for more then 2 years now. What am I thinking. I am out of here. Have a good night its already morning here in London. is that so? FACT said? Ok lets play your own game now. Can you show me documents which clearly sates and proof that PSV signed R9 before Nike came into the scene? Come on show me the document. Make sure whathever document you present here are official PSV or Nike documents. Do not come with amateur reports made by some unknown journalist working for a backstreet small magazine. Make it like you said "official". I am looking forward to your documents. You demand facts, then show some real facts yourself this time. I'll be waiting
Hahah! Now you are leaving. Because you cannot proof! Where is the documents that states PSV came in first before Nike james? Oh now that I have used your own rhetorical shit, by asking you for historical official proof you leave. You claimed to have presented facts in your previous post right? Show me the documents! Pathetic.