"Missed ever more" to you is creating constant stress and danger for the defense for me. These are negative plays in your bizarre ranking system but to me they are great pieces of play, he is creating danger where other strikers would not, and constantly putting himself in dangerous situations.
Like I said, team dynamic got the ball to him in that position. You could say that his team mate crossed and another was pressuring the mistake, so the ball got to him.
So let me get this straight. For you player is performing better if he misses great chance's team dynamic creates, rather than the team dynamic doesn't create any chance's him to miss?
Muller is creating them just as much as the rest of the team, anticipating where a loose ball might end up, beating defenders with quick turns and dribbles. If you think all the examples you posted are just Muller missing chances given to him on a plate then you are crazy. When you combine the fact that he "missed" so many chances with the fact that he scored 10 goals, you realize he is consistently getting himself in goalscoring position more often than other players. This is a skill and if you do not understand that then you have a very poor understanding of football.
But he isn't getting the defenders away from marking him, the team dynamic does. Also Muller dribbled 4 players the whole tournament, compared players like Messi and Maradona who dribbled 46 and 53 players respectively. Actually they are pretty much on plate, he isn't being marked away because the team dynamic, which enables him mostly run few yards to a chance, or not run at all. Muller was involved 13 of 17 team goals which makes him important player, but there really isn't relative quality in there. That's why he isn't considered best ever, because players like Messi and Maradona were just as important, but brought so much more individual quality to the performance.
I am not saying Muller is better than Messi or Maradona, but I think the main point you fail to understand is how many goals Muller scored in his career that Maradona or Messi would have never scored if in the exact same situation. This is because they do not constantly move in the box the same way. All these rebounds and miscontrolled balls that Muller turns into goals would amount to nothing with Messi or Maradona in his place because they would be standing around watching.
I don't see any situation that Maradona wouldn't score, or Messi wouldn't score with higher frequency if team dynamic allowed the space and time. What goals do you have in mind?
Regarding the below, and similar such opportunities that are being considered as "bad misses" for various players in this comparison with Messi - Well, for some reason I couldn't find the same above standard being applied, to consider this below opportunity of Messi vs Germany to be a "bad miss" - If GIF is not loading, same can be seen in this video from the 9:10 mark onwards - Now of course I couldn't go through the entire thread, but I did look at two posts wherein I felt that it should have been mentioned i.e. the original Messi vs Maradona WC final match comparison post (link) as well as the original Messi WC 14 tournament stats overview and vids/gifs linking post (link) from this thread.
Round 6 http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads/maradona-86-vs-messi-14.2008702/page-136#post-32761522 G.Müller vs Uruguay Created one goal scoring situation which ended as only goal of the game, and missed one 1on1. Pretty equal performance with Romario vs Sweden in this round, both involved the only goal, both creating one chance, Romario finished one of his three chance's, Muller didn't finish the only chance he had. World Cup Performance Index, considering statistics, the best (and worst) plays, importance and relation of quality of opposition and own team. Color highlighted as gold, silver, bronze ball, or not in Top 3. Round 1 http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads/maradona-86-vs-messi-14.2008702/page-136#post-33209718 Round 2 http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads/maradona-86-vs-messi-14.2008702/page-136#post-33209821 Round 3 http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads/maradona-86-vs-messi-14.2008702/page-136#post-33210200 Round 4 http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads/maradona-86-vs-messi-14.2008702/page-137#post-33214366 Round 5 http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads/maradona-86-vs-messi-14.2008702/page-137#post-33215623 Round 6 http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads/maradona-86-vs-messi-14.2008702/page-138#post-33217608 1. Maradona 86 vs Belgium 2. Ronaldo 02 vs Turkey 3. Schillaci 90 vs Argentina Rossi 82 vs Poland 5. Kempes 78 vs Peru Cruyff 74 vs Brazil 7. Suker 98 vs France 8. Pele 70 vs Italy Jairzinho 70 vs Italy 10. Romario 94 vs Sweden G.Müller 70 vs Uruguay 12. Messi 14 vs Netherlands Forlan 10 vs Netherlands Ronaldo 98 vs Netherlands 15. Robben 14 vs Argentina Zidane 06 vs Portugal 17. Eusebio 66 vs Soviet Union 18. Charlton 66 vs West Germany
I have to give a nod to Overath there (a player I sometimes tend to 'rate' lower than some do in my estimations) - obviously he finishes very well but that pass, which I'm not sure I'd seen, is top notch too (not unprecendented in that many similar passes or equally good passes have been played in football history...but maybe the best example of that type I'd seen from him). France Football did award him a 5/6 for that game, while Muller was given a 3/6 but takes credit for the assist even if it seemed an obvious play - it still had to be executed and it was put just where Overath would have wanted it.
Watching the games, Overath, Seeler, Müller and Beckenbauer came up most, and if I had to say bewing intuitive without concentrating on his performance, Beckenbauer seemed like the best player of Germany. Could be wrong though.
G.Müller WC70 10 goals from 25 great scoring chances 7 great scoring chances created 4 players beaten by dribble (OPTA) 0 tackles (OPTA) Goals (Scored + Assisted + Involved) 13 (10 (1p) + 3 + 0) out of 17 team goals = 76% importance Goals Scored Morocco 1 Bulgaria 1 Bulgaria 2 Bulgaria 3 Peru 1 Peru 2 Peru 3 England 1 Italy 1 Italy 2 Great Scoring Chances Missed Morocco 1 Morocco 2 Morocco 2 Bulgaria 1 Bulgaria 2 Peru 1 Peru 2 Peru 3 England 1 Italy 1 Italy 2 Italy 3 Italy 4 Italy 5 Uruguay 1 Great Chances Greated Morocco 1 Bulgaria 1 Bulgaria 2 England 1 Italy 1 Italy 2 Uruguay 1
G.Müller WC70 performance may come surprise for some. Usually associated on great and ruthless finishing scoring 10 goals and watching highlight reels you would think that? At least for me it came as a surprise that he wasn't actually that effective, at least in WC70. It's same kind of performance than Eusebio WC66, 10 goals from 25 great chances, minus the advancing play and defending, and less creativity, which why it isn't as good. I rank it as high as Schillaci WC90. Scored in relation the same the chance's they got, slight differences in advancing play, creativity, defending and importance both ways. Round by round almost a tie. World Cup performance index, considering statistics, the best (and worst) plays, importance and relation of quality of opposition and own team. Color highlighted as golden, silver, bronze ball, or not in Top 3. 1. Maradona 86 Messi 14 3. Kempes 78 4. Jairzinho 70 5. Robben 14 Cruyff 74 7. Forlan 10 8. Romario 94 9. Eusebio 66 Pele 70 Rossi 82 12. G.Müller 70 Schillaci 90 Suker 98 15. Ronaldo 02 Charlton 66 17. Ronaldo 98 18. Zidane 06
Kudos to Bada Bing for his effort in creating these gifs! The gifs is all I care for, not his subjective assessment. By providing these gifs, Bada Bing allows anyone frequenting this forum to form his own opinion and that is a great service to all.
How many goals from bicycle kicks has Messi scored? Just wondering. Pelé I think scored a ton of them.
I mentioned this in a discussion with greatstriker11 and Pipiolo: I'm pretty sure I've never seen Messi doing a bycicle kick, and absolutely certain he never scored that way. Pity.
Me neither. That thought just crossed my mind when I read Bada Bing critizising Müller for not dribbling enough and thus lacking quality. That'd be akin to a Pelé fan arguing that Messi almost never even tries to score with a bicycle kick and hence lacking quality.
With a bit of googling you can figure out he attempted it a dozen times in 2014 and 2015 (at least). "Never" is certainly not true and it is doubtful whether he attempts it less often than the average forward. Three examples: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2n3cvc Of course, most of them don't reach youtube or are deleted by the 'armada' (like the late August attempt of this year).
How the hell did yo get to this conclusion....oh you just made it up? Cue use of the world logical or logic now in order to try and gain some creditability!!!!!!!!!!!!
You're right, he did try. But what I said is that I'm ALMOST certain I PERSONALLY have never seen him trying (I might misremember, but that was my strong impression and I've seen lots of Messi matches) and that he has never SCORED by doing it (of this I'm 99% sure). But if Messi is actually trying it, then great! I'm happy for him and for football and I hope he scores a wonder goal with it
(sorry for the cap locks, I wanted to use italics but I'm writing from my mobile andfor some reason it's difficult to use italics from here!)
I have to say I particularly like the second video you linked. Stop with his chest and overhead kick. Great class.