Leveraged Sellout - The Arsenal Finance Thread

Discussion in 'Arsenal' started by Rewinder, Sep 14, 2008.

  1. DutchCane

    DutchCane Member+

    Apr 6, 2004
    New York, New York
    Cause everything having to do with Arsenal is discussed from a point of "does it make sense financially". It's irritating, boring and insulting as it deflects attention from the serious errors, gaffes, and mistakes made. BUt hey let's blame it all on us having no money. SMH
     
  2. elessar78

    elessar78 Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 12, 2010
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    My sentiments exactly.

    God forbid we talk about footballing issues alone.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  3. DutchCane

    DutchCane Member+

    Apr 6, 2004
    New York, New York
    Yeah and fans lap that sh*t up. Plus it's a convenient strawman for incompetence. People are still pretending and spinning last years epic collosal failure to win the league as a triumph or some sign that money prevented us from winning or some other wild nonsense involving "lack of ability to outspend/keep up with spending/netspend" foolery.
     
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  4. thebigman

    thebigman Member+

    May 25, 2006
    Birmingham
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Wenger is responsible for last year and the 11 years before it
     
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  5. darcgun

    darcgun Member+

    Jan 11, 2008
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    i don't agree. i think most do, since money is arguably most important thing in contemporary football.

    and we have money, but only this season have we spent big money on players.
     
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  6. darcgun

    darcgun Member+

    Jan 11, 2008
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    if we got more than Cech, we would have won the league, our mistakes notwithstanding.
     
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  7. GunneRy

    GunneRy Member+

    Aug 22, 2006
    Chicago
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  8. darcgun

    darcgun Member+

    Jan 11, 2008
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    interesting reading. Match-day incomee was down slightly from 2015, and property sales were down too.

    We're well-run, we have to be grateful for that, but then why not have scope for Usmanov if he wants to invest, or this Nigerian billionaire guy if he wishes to? if we really want the Champions League or Premier league, this may have to be the course. Liverpool, West Ham, Chelsea, Man City, and even Tottenham can rival us in match-day income soon, so we need more bases to compete from.
     
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  9. mebeSajid

    mebeSajid Member+

    Feb 16, 2009
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    You're reading it wrong. It was 149 million before the acquisitions:

    "That being the case, it is my duty to point out that after excluding debt service reserves and amounts owed to other clubs on past transfers the balance reduces to £149 million.

    "This figure is in itself inflated, due to the seasonality of our cash flows, by advance sponsorship and season ticket receipts for the new season.

    "Against the underlying balance of available funds we have, as mentioned above, invested strongly in player acquisitions during the summer at a total transfer in cost of more than £90 million with additional significant commitments to player wages, agent’s fees and performance related contingencies on top of that."

    Means the club basically used up the bulk of its cash reserves on this summer's acquisitions.
     
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  10. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    No because we can't mix up cash accounting with balance sheet accounting

    Much of the 90m will be structured in the future so the real impact is likely to be on an increase in debt owed to 3rd parties. As Arsenal has little short term debt the club can easily finance this - especially when you factor in increased cash flows.

    Overall the net liquidity will come down some.
     
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  11. crazy150

    crazy150 Member+

    Aug 27, 2006
    North Cuba
    From the actual report, cash was ~230m at close of year. We then spent 90m or so which as jitty says will likely be structured some what one would think. 35m of that is reserved for debt servicing which is where the 190m figure comes from.

    So we spent about what people expected we could easily spend without much issue and that is clear to be true now.

    I think there are no surprises here. The new tv revenue is not there either which will be ~50m? Iirc. All in all, was a good window but should have been done earlier.
     
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  12. darcgun

    darcgun Member+

    Jan 11, 2008
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    This is no problem though, since i agree clubs pay fees in installments. However, it will eat into our cash funds and increase liabilities in some form, but then i agree again it is manageable. That said, we need to aggressively pursue new income sources now, and the club have no excuse not to utilise the Emirates for its cash-generation. We should be looking to match City, even United, in revenue generation.
     
  13. darcgun

    darcgun Member+

    Jan 11, 2008
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    it's also interesting to see where we are vis a vis other clubs. We were ahead of Chelsea in 2015 in revenue terms, City may be further ahead due to more matchday income and getting to CL semis, Spurs even will increase due to finishing 3rd.
     
  14. crazy150

    crazy150 Member+

    Aug 27, 2006
    North Cuba
    The club used to be more detailed about this, but now it's pretty obfuscated. Anyway, minus the clubs commitments to paying off old deals and the debt service the net cash would be 150m.

    image.jpeg

    However, the club is also owed money from old deals which is hidden in the debtors line item. They used to break it down. Was 15m last season so who know what portion of the 62m owed is from past player sales.

    image.jpeg

    But it's still 62m cash that will be paid for past business of some sort.

    Hard to follow it all exactly, but even with the 90m outlay this summer. If they have just structured that over 2 seasons, then the new tv deal will cover that easily.

    Not sure what we will need to do the next year market wise with all the uncertainty--AW, ozil and Sanchez. I could see 2017 as being a restructuring year even if Wenger stays. Don't think we will keep all of Ox. Gibbs, Walcott and Jack. I also think we may have difficulty keeping all of Giroud, ozil, Alexis and Ramsey even though we want to.

    So if 2-3 of those 8 players move then that will be an influx of cash hopefully balanced by purchases.

    In summary, I'd say the club is setup to basically only spend the new tv money over the next two seasons on increased wages and acquisitions. After a season or two, I'd bet that cash pile sits at about the same size unless an ozilesque opportunity comes up.

    If AW leaves, then it may be a different story.
     
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  15. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    agree.

    the club has had too little short term debt in my view.

    and with increased cash inflow this is really no problem in terms of eating heavily into free cash.

    also I expect some dead wood to be sold off soon.
     
  16. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    keen to stream dortmund but the fire I just lit is in the opposite house to the WiFi and the kids are streaming Netflix.

    first world bandwidth problems.
     
  17. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    #1217 The Jitty Slitter, Oct 1, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2016
    x
     
  18. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    #1218 The Jitty Slitter, Oct 1, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2016
    x
     
  19. thebigman

    thebigman Member+

    May 25, 2006
    Birmingham
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Jitty are u in some kind if bavarian log cabin? I imagine u in a leadrhosen drinking beer even though your kiwi

    It confuses me
     
  20. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    Nah - i live in the norf innit? Lederhosen is Bavaria down south

    I am actually south of the river from Hamburg right now in the direction of Bremen
     
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  21. thebigman

    thebigman Member+

    May 25, 2006
    Birmingham
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Cool

    Need to visit Germany properly as I have only stayed over night en route to Italy

    I wanted to go watch bvb but I hear the city is industrial and shite
     
  22. NorthBank

    NorthBank Member+

    Arsenal; NYRB
    United States
    Mar 29, 2006
    Connecticut
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    For atmosphere and scale, I would go to Dortmund's Stadion in a heartbeat! Before that though I'd like to get to Anfield.
     
  23. thebigman

    thebigman Member+

    May 25, 2006
    Birmingham
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Fair. I don't like Liverpool but bvb looks amazing
     
  24. darcgun

    darcgun Member+

    Jan 11, 2008
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    which club has money but spends only 15 million one season? it's part of the many mistakes we make.
     
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  25. GunneRy

    GunneRy Member+

    Aug 22, 2006
    Chicago
    So Swiss Ramble kinda weighs in- "In other words, there is still substantial money available to spend. It’s clearly not as much as the £226 million in the books, but there would be enough available in the January transfer window to further boost the squad if necessary."

    http://swissramble.blogspot.com/2016/10/arsenal-new-sensation.html

    No guess as to how much cash there is, but from my reading, it appears that Arsenal can comfortably spend 50-70 per year now, all in.
     

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