Madrid had 3 shots on target until Dybala was red carded. Juve were a man down for 25 minutes after which Real produced 3-4 clear chances. Up until that point, both teams had 2-3 shots each on target through 65 minutes. Real are difficult enough to eliminate never mind when down a man for 25 minutes on top of a PK given. Again, it's not about who merited whatever more. Both teams battled. For a fan what is maddening is the inconsistencies in the calls. Juve supporters were criticized for claiming a PK on Cuadrado at the end of the first leg because Carvajal's contact was "too soft." Yet the same thing happens today except that a PK is given. Which one is it? Both occur from 5 yards out, the defender is behind the attacker, contact is made.
that depends on the ref and you know it, virtually none of the rules are cast iron, how do you determine how much contact is enough? the bigger issue is they are bringing in VAR and most of the rules are still shades of grey not black and white should be fun
But see you are making the point. The lack of clarity in the rules allow too much subjectivity. VAR needs to be implemented, but at the same time the rules need to be defined more strictly so that there is consistency. This tie was decided on two similar incidences that were called differently. I agree that how much contact is permissible is dependent on the judgment of the referee. That's the problem! Any way you slice it, if you look at both contacts at the same time on a video monitor, either they are both PKs or none are. Calling one and not the other is arbitrary. Even in terms of context, from my understanding referees review the decisions made in the first leg. The Benatia contact shouldn't have been called not because there was no contact (there certainly was), but because the same thing was waved off in the first leg. You could even make the case that the referee should have booked Ronaldo for going to ground. Instead he waved for him to get up twice. Meanwhile in the first leg Dybala went to ground and immediately was booked for simulation. Yesterday's referee would have reviewed that and understood the context of the tie before officiating the 2nd leg. For Real to receive a PK and Dybala a red card is egregiously inconsistent.
but you contradict yourself saying you want clarity yet you say it would be okay in a league game but not something of this magnitude, thats not clarity.
With VAR there should be no shades of grey. Over the weekend Mertens of Napoli clearly dove in the box and was awarded a PK. VAR was used and the call stood. The reasoning was the Chievo defender put his hand on Merten's shoulder and was a foul regardless of the dive. It was ridiculous but it was the letter of the law.
My memory is so crap I already forgot how Dybala got a red card, but when a guy is 1-on-1 with the 'keeper and just about to shoot towards the gaping net, you have to call the foul! I don't see any argument for the contact not impacting the play there. VAR wouldn't have saved Juventus.
The same play you are describing was not called in the final seconds of the first leg when Carvajal made contact with Cuadrado 5 yards from goal when he was in the act of shooting. It's the inconsistency of the calls which are maddening. Just last week Juve supporters were met with "it was too little contact" "it was soft" when complaining about the Cuadrado non-call. So which is it? Is contact in the box from close range a PK or not? It's unfair to call one and not the other. Dybala got a yellow for going to ground in the box when Casemiro made light contact on him. Yesterday the referee waved Ronaldo to get up on two separate instances. Yet Dybala is given a yellow and Ronaldo isn't. Again it's the inconsistencies that cause these controversies.
To me it looked like Cuadrado just whiffed on his own. If there was contact then obviously the ref just didn't see it (neither did I). That's where VAR would come into play though. Inconsistency is often an issue but I'm not sure this is a great example of it.
How is the Serie A coefficient this season compared to what it ended with last season? Did we bypass what it was last season at the end yet? Juventus did make the final last season, but a lot more Italian teams were out earlier than this season.
Should a penalty kick not be awarded because the same situation was not called a penalty by another referee in another game? I don't think so. I want consistent calls, but previous games should not determine what the referee does. If you look at the Laws of the Game to determine if a penalty should be awarded, thinking about previous games isn't one of the factors. Furthermore, imagine that people criticize Referee Y for awarding a penalty, when in reality Referee Y didn't want to give a penalty but did so because he felt obligated to be consistent with Referee X the previous week.
Yes you have a point. I can understand the frustration with the players, but I am not saying it was not the correct call. If I was a Juventus player, I would probably feel annoyed as well, but you are right though, previous games should not determine that.
You bypassed it. You had a 14.416 in 2012-2013 that dropped out and have 17.000 so far. You have the highest five season sum you've ever had, but keep in mind that when the UEFA Cup became the Europa League there was an increase in the amount of games and coefficient points available. With games remaining, the sum of the top five countries for the five seasons ending 2017-2018 is 23.6% higher than the sum of the top five countries for the five seasons ending 2007-2008.
Lazio and Leipzig out. Only Arsenal left in Europa League. One from each country in UCL. This is getting really close.
Lazio ruins Serie A's good week. Now they are left with 1 team in Europe, same as we would have predicted at the beginning of the week.
They have a reputation of choking eventually. They look good for a while but do often choke later on.
ah well atleast you had your real champions league final mate LOL I suppose Salzburg Lazio was the real europa final too eh
Video reviews showed that Carvajal's right knee made contact with Cuadrado's trailing leg as he was shooting. Carvajal's other leg makes contact with him after the shot goes wide. Even in the Tottenham match that Juve had to win. Yes eventually they did 2-1, but in the first half Vertonghan tackled Costa from behind. When both issues were discussed at the time, some called Juve fans out for whining because the contact wasn't enough. All I'm suggesting is that this had become too subjective. Even in the 2015 final, Alves took Pogba to ground late in the 2nd when it was 1-1. Yet, that was deemed "too soft." So with all thosr instances, this latest tie vs Real was settled by a call that wasn't made in the recent past. What is done is done. My hope is that at some point the rules of the game evolve along with the technology so that there is less gray area. That is what is causing all these controversies.
These instances are brought up to show that referees are given a lot of discretion. The laws of the game require an application by a human on the spot with tons of pressure and emotion involved. The referee is within his right to call that a PK and I can understand why he did. However that doesn't change the fact the the subjectivity in these big instances has led to an inconsistent application of the laws of the game. In a league 38 round format, this effect will balance out. Even the most controversial calls rarely determine a winner. In two legged KO ties, refereeing decisions have decided ties. In a perfect world, Cuadrado and Vasquez are both awarded late game PKs where extra time would have decided a winner. That didn't happen and Real are in the semis in part for that reason.
The final is the final END of Spurs were a better footballing side the juve if you want to play that game