Is Zico the best Brazilian Footballer? (Pele not included)

Discussion in 'Brazil' started by Mibu Clan, Jul 24, 2006.

  1. mak9

    mak9 Member

    May 21, 2005
    Toronto, Canada
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    does anyone have clips of some zico plays versus a team.........like the liverpool one on youtube
     
  2. old_carioca_in_nyc

    Jan 26, 2007
    Here are some of "the rest of the gang"

    - Djalma Santos
    - Carlos Alberto
    - Jairzinho
    - Vava
    - Mauro Silva
    - Falcao
    - Castilho, Pindaro, Pinheiro !!!!!:D

    Is there a list of the "greatest 50 or 100 players" of Brasil soccer like they have for the NBA in basketball?
     
  3. Kulspruta

    Kulspruta New Member

    Jul 26, 2007
    BH, Brazil
    Club:
    Cruzeiro Belo Horizonte
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    I wish I had footage of all of Zico's freekick goals. I'd learn to make videos just to make him justice. I wish I could've seen him stopping time live.
     
  4. kingkong1

    kingkong1 New Member

    Nov 12, 2007
    Rio, Brazil
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    And Ademir 'Queixada', Chinesinho, Canhoteiro, Dorval, Coutinho, Julinho Botelho, Pepe, Zito, Paulo César Caju, Canário, Evaristo, Telê Santana, Sócrates, Raí, Müller, Manga, Julio César 'Uri Geller', Geraldo, Mozer, Aldair, Djalminha, Kaká, Romário, Bebeto, DUNGA, Careca, Branco, Éder, Nelinho, Dirceu, Márcio Santos, Paulo Borges, Zózimo, Altair, Tim, Romeu, Carpeggiani, Reinaldo, Dirceu Lopes, Luís Pereira, Zagallo, Ronaldo, R. Gaúcho, Cafú, Roberto Carlos, Júnior, Leandro, Rivaldo, Dida, Dequinha, Pinnga, Ferreira, Alarcón, Edinho, Piazza, Clodoaldo, Dino Sani, Amarildo, Ricardo Gomes, Roberto Dinamite, Altafini, Robinho.

    Just there we have more than 90 (with the ones you and I mentioned above).

    Be sure though there are many more than 100 Brz greats.

    (In bold more tricolores for you)
     
  5. Denilson70

    Denilson70 Member

    May 29, 2001
    England
    1 - Pele
    2 - Cerezo
    3 - Sao Taffarel
     
  6. old_carioca_in_nyc

    Jan 26, 2007
    Thank you very much. This brings tears in my eyes, remembering what the escrete canarinho meant and will mean for me forever!!!!! :D

    - Jairzinho goals 1970, the Amarildo goal against Spain 1962, the last goal by Carlos Alberto 1970...

    Lets beat the crap out of Bolivia tomorrow! Avante Brasil!!!!!!!!!
     
  7. Lockeroom

    Lockeroom Member

    Apr 11, 2008
    Why wasn´t The Big Cerezo in the squad in the 1986 + 1990 World Cups ??
     
  8. Denilson70

    Denilson70 Member

    May 29, 2001
    England
    Was in contention for 1986 but was injured and cut in preparation in Mexico. Perceived to be too old in 1990 at 35? Fit as a fiddle so probably not! Ask Sebastiao Lazaroni!!
     
  9. Colorado_GAUCHO

    Nov 16, 2004
    Porto Alegre-BRASIL
    Club:
    Internacional Porto Alegre
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Cerezo wasn't there because he SUCKED, was too slow and people were running circles around him. Never liked that guy.

    ZICO WAS THE BEST AFTER PELE

    no questions about that.
     
  10. Denilson70

    Denilson70 Member

    May 29, 2001
    England
    One of our best midfielders was Cerezo. No doubt.
     
  11. kingkong1

    kingkong1 New Member

    Nov 12, 2007
    Rio, Brazil
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Cerezzo was not a fuoriclassi but was a player any coach would like to have in his team for his consistency and efficiency, besides being able to score too.

    Same level as Rivaldo.

    Zico was not the best player second to Pelé, but was the best Brazilian player since Pelé retirement to our days.
     
  12. old_carioca_in_nyc

    Jan 26, 2007
    How about some non-Brasilian players who we admire and respect for their great skills?

    - Puskas
    - DiStefano
    - Cruyff
    - Maradona
    - Franz Beckenbauer
    - George Best
    - Michel Platini
    - Eusebio
     
  13. kingkong1

    kingkong1 New Member

    Nov 12, 2007
    Rio, Brazil
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Yup.

    Imagine a game between:

    Gilmar
    D. Da Guia
    Nilton Santos
    Didi-Zizinho-Zico-Gérson
    Garrincha-Pelé-L. da Silva-Rivelino

    vs

    Yashin
    Bobby Moore
    Maldini
    Beckenbauer-Platini-Di Stéfano-Cruyff
    Maradona-G. Best-Puskas-Eusébio

    Who do you think would win?...
     
  14. old_carioca_in_nyc

    Jan 26, 2007
    Brasil 6 - gols by Pele, Garrincha, Didi (folha seca) Gerson canhotinha de ouro, Rivelino from 30 meters out and Zico ....

    World - 2 Cruyff and G. Best

    This is just a wonderful dream, of course!
    They would have to play in Maracana... :D
     
  15. kingkong1

    kingkong1 New Member

    Nov 12, 2007
    Rio, Brazil
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    7 x 3!...

    Let's add one goal by Maradona dribbling everybody + one by Leônidas da Silva 'de bicicleta' :p ...
     
  16. old_carioca_in_nyc

    Jan 26, 2007
    The problem with Maradona is that we have Nilton Santos!!! Nobody dribbles past Nilton Santos, except Garrincha at age of 16... Garrincha went to Botafogo to practice, and Nilton Santos could not stop him, so Nilton Santos told Botafogo to hire the kid with pernas tortas immediately! LOL
     
  17. kingkong1

    kingkong1 New Member

    Nov 12, 2007
    Rio, Brazil
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    NS was known as a gentleman.

    I'm sure that, with 7 x 2 & at Garrincha's request, he'd let the Pibe pass...

    Gilmar woud even get the ball in the net smiling ;) ...

    And, following the example, all of us - along with those year 2000 Agentinian teens (nowdays respectable 'pais de família') - would send him as bonus Internet votes for 'Player of the Century' :p ...
    _______________________________________________________________________________________________

    PS: By the way, let's concede, in that Brz team cited above, in my opinion, only Gilmar, Rivelino & Gérson were - category wise - under or similar to Zico (the 1st inferior, the 2nd almost as good, the 3rd in the same - maybe even in a little superior - level).
     
  18. old_carioca_in_nyc

    Jan 26, 2007
    I saw somewhere that it was Gerson's canhotinha that really decided the 1970 final game with that canhotaco from far away into the Italian net.
    :D
     
  19. kingkong1

    kingkong1 New Member

    Nov 12, 2007
    Rio, Brazil
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    So, among my Brz All-Time 11, Zico is at the most among 8th and 10th.

    As a consolation to us Fla rooters, I have to inform to the outsider, that, besides Zico, 3 others in that list are from Flamengo: Domingos da Guia, Zizinho and Leônidas da Silva.

    In my appreciation Leônidas is the all-time 3rd (after Pelé & Garrincha); Zizinho 5th (after Didi); with Nilton Santos, Domingos da Guia one step below & Gérson, Zico, Rivelino, Gilmar coming next.

    Let's put it this way:

    Fla: 4 all-timers (Domingos, Zizinho, Zico, Leônidas)
    Botafogo: 4 all-timers (Nilton Santos, Didi, Gérson, Garrincha)
    Santos: 2 all-timers (Gilmar, Pelé)
    Corinthians: 1 all-timer (Rivelino)

    If we give points 11 to 1 pts from 1st to 11th (Pelé 11, Garrincha 10, LS 9, Didi 8, Zizinho 7, NS 6 or 5, DG 6 or 5, Gérson 4 or 3, Zico 4 or 3, Rivelino 2, Gilmar 1) we'll have:

    Botafogo = 28 or 26 pts
    Flamengo = 26 or 24
    Santos = 12 pts
    Corinthians = 2 pts

    PS: Sorry to the other Brz teams, but nothing (or almost nothing) can be made about the above list...

    NOTE:

    Always remembering that Gérson was footballistically formed in Flamengo (from 18 year-old to 23 having played for the red & black, & only in 1963 he got transferred to Botafogo, winning then his most important titles) and could be classified as having played for both clubs - what would give the edge to Flamengo...

    Nowadays we have: Julio César GK, Juan CD, Juan LD, Adriano CF.

    Not too long ago we had: Aldair, Djalminha, Marcelinho Carioca, Mozer, Bebeto, Jorginho, Júnior, Leandro, Adílio, Júlio César, Paulo Henrique, Toninho Baiano...

    All 'born' (or consecrated at Gávea)...

    Not cited ones from the 50s/60s: Evaristo, Dequinha, Índio, Dida, Moacir, Paulinho etc - all NT level.

    Now you can have idea of the true 'craddle' Flamengo has been to Brzln and world football - besides being the most popular team of the country (and/or planet).

    And that's why people strive to underrate it so much :eek: ...
     
  20. kingkong1

    kingkong1 New Member

    Nov 12, 2007
    Rio, Brazil
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    That 'somewhere' was a post of mine a few days ago in the other thread...

    The goal:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_3nRplehGk&feature=related
    (see 00:40 to 00:51 min)

    Just that goal there is enough to put him (a little bit at least) ahead of Zico...
     
  21. old_carioca_in_nyc

    Jan 26, 2007
    Exactly! Thanks for the movie.

    I still listen sometimes to Globo Radio Esportes
    -> Gerson doing commentaries about Brasil games, he is one of the best, even today! :)
     
  22. morph09

    morph09 New Member

    Jul 18, 2009
    Can anybody tell me which were the greatest matches of Zico?

    I knew in 1981 against Liverpool was a great one and i ordered it, but please tell a few more great match please. Thx u very much.

    Cu
    morph
     
  23. kingkong1

    kingkong1 New Member

    Nov 12, 2007
    Rio, Brazil
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    That's something Zico shared with Pelé: regularity.

    Even his defeats (Italy x Brazil, for example) were great games.

    Just access Zico on YouTube & there you'll have plenty.

    Anyway go for Fla x Atlético Mineiro (1981 Brasileirão final), all Fla x Vasco Rio de Janeiro Championship games of the late 70's/early 80's, all of the 1982 Brasileirão and you'll have lots of fun.;)
     
  24. Denilson70

    Denilson70 Member

    May 29, 2001
    England
    One of the few players never to be dropped by Brazil. Only missed a game through injury.
     
  25. celito

    celito Member+

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXAUMHdoIt0&feature=related"]YouTube - Zico Brazil passing_1[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-iNbr1EMgQ&feature=related"]YouTube - Zico Brazil passing 2[/ame]
     

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