Sorry, I forgot to say on a longer term basis I might choose Steve Stone for right wing, but O'Neill is surely a good choice. Could even be Storey-Moore but as I said it wouldn't reflect his normal role, as he played RW more at the start of his career and LWF mostly (sometimes more central in attack like the famous game where Joe Baker, another possible candidate, got injured and Storey-Moore moved inside and scored a hat-trick vs Everton in the FA Cup).
Low cap France XI: Marcel Domingo Willy Sagnol Roger Lemerre Mustapha Zitouni Mikael Silvestre Sabri Lamouchi Robert Herbin Rachid Mehkloufi Larby Ben Barek Laurent Robert Thadée Cisowski Any alternatives?
We have to define what is low cap at first. Silvestre and Sagnol have been selected much times even though it is true that Sagnol was barred by Thuram until he was repositioned as centre back (so maybe that he has so to speak relatively low caps but all in all, I don't think so...or yes a little, relatively to the era during which he played, and even...). It is that there is always a reason for they have not more selections. All the players that have been called up to play are alternatives. Then there are the players who have never been called-up or have been but did not play (that would need a lot of research to be sure to not forget any very good club players, once called-up or never...). Among the players around 10 caps I like quite well Poullain at midfield too, or Jean Petit (what makes think that there is the famous René Petit too), Di Nallo in attack and Chiesa...but it's very subjective here even if in terms of talent the two OL players stand out, I guess. At last but it has probably not escaped your notice, Eugène Maës has about the same number of selections and goals than Cisowski concerning the centre-forwards. They have all in all scored against opponents of the same caliber at their respective times.
My idea was indeed a relatively low amount of caps. This also depends on the era. What do you think of replacing Lamouchi with Chiesa and perhaps Silvestre with Sylvain Distin?
I also place it here. This is from October 1979. A co-operation between Don Balon, El Grafico and Shoot. Interesting (and perhaps also a relevant small piece in the puzzle for the retrospective Ballon d'Or thread, where the late 70s and early 80s got discussed) is that this collaboration between three magazines with markedly different backgrounds and circumstances/demography they operated in, resulted in a 22-men selection with 6 South Americans and 16 European players. 19 players were playing in Europe, 3 players in South America (Fillol, Toninho, Passarella - those three all of them in the first XI).
Well, here it is, from that twitter account (with no posts anymore since about 2 years) that I mentionned (+ 2 or 3 others via other sources). As they answered in the 'Focus On', 'Super Focus' etc. : Mark Lawrenson Banks - Kaltz, Moore, Beckenbauer, Breitner - Charlton, Brady - Best, Cruyff, Pelé, Maradona. Ray Kennedy Banks, Kaltz, Beckenbauer, Moore, Breitner, Peters, Charlton, Brady, Best, Dalglish, Pelé. Gerry Armstrong (NIR) Jennings, McGrain, Krol, Beckenbauer, Cooper, Jairzinho, Cruyff, Charlton, Pelé, Law, Best. Ken McNaught (Villa) Yashin; C.Alberto, Krol, Beckenbauer, McGrain; Cruyff, Gerson, Baxter; Pelé, Law, Maradona Mark Wright (when at Southampton) Best ever XI : England's 1966 World Cup winner. Mickey Hazard Banks, C.Alberto, Beckenbauer, Krol, Wilson, Giles, Ardilès, Mardona, Best, Pelé, Cruijff. Mark Swain (Villa) Banks, McGrain, Beckenbauer, Krol, Cooper, Gerson, Bremner, Charlton, Cruyff, Müller, Pelé. Danny Thomas Banks - C.Alberto, Beckenbauer, Moore, Breitner - Cruyff, Gerson - Maradona, Müller, Pelé, Best. Joe Gallagher (Wolves) Banks - C.Alberto, Beckenbauer, Todd, Cooper - Maradona, Netzer, Rivelino - Pelé, Keegan, Müller. Alan Curtis (Swansea) Banks - Kaltz, Beckenbauer, J.Charles, J. Charlton - Maradona, Gerson - Best, Pelé, Müller, Cruijff. Russel Osman (Ipswich) Banks - Vogts, Beckenbauer, Moore, Cooper, Edwards, Charlton, Cruyff, Pelé, Di Stéfano, Best. Ray Wellington (Fulham) Banks - Vogts, C.Alberto, Beckenbauer, Sansom - Brady, Gerson, Hudson, Pelé, Best, Maradona. Nigel Callaghan (Watford) Shilton - C.Alberto, Beckenbauer, Moore, Junior - Charlton, Maradona, Falcao - Pelé, Puskas, Zico. David O'Leary Jennings - C.ALberto, Beckenbauer, Krol, Breitner - Charlton, Giles, Gerson - Best, Pelé, Cruyff. Mark Chamberlain (Stoke) Banks - C.Alberto, Beckenbauer, Schnellinger, Facchetti - Socrates, Maradona, Zico - Pelé, Cruyff, Best Alan Curbishley (Birmingham City) Banks - Vogts, Moore, Beckenbauer, Junior - Zico, Gerson, Platini - Best, Pelé, Müller. Chrys White (Arsenal) Jennings - Vogts, Moore, J.Charlton, Breitner - B.Charlton, Beckenbauer, Maradona - Best, Pelé, Cruyff. Stewart Robson (Arsenal) Banks - Vogts, Beckenbauer, Passarella, Junior - Charlton, Tardelli, Socrates - Jairzinho, Pelé, Best. Gary Mabbutt (Tottenham) Brazil's 1970 World Cup winner. Mark Hateley (Coventry) Brazil's 1982 World Cup team. Alan Ball England's 1966 World Cup XI Nick Holmes The England team which won the World Cup in 1966. Alan Brazil (Tottenham) Zoff - Kaltz, Beattie, Hunter, McGrain - Maradona, Cruyff, Zico - Pelé, Best, Dalglish. David Johnson (Everton) Banks - Neal, McFarland, Moore, Wilson - Keegan, Ball, MacKay, Best - Dalglish, Charlton. Wynton Rufer (Norwich City) Brazil 70. Paul Bracewell (Stoke) Banks - C.Alberto, Beckenbauer, Facchetti, Schnellinger - Gerson, Maradona, Rivera - Pelé, Cruyff, Best. Sammy McIlroy (Stoke) Banks - Vogts, Beckenbauer, Moore, Cooper - Cruyff, Baxter, Gerson - Maradona, Pelé, Best. Rinat Dasaev (Spartak Moscow) Yashin - Breitner, Beckenbauer, Krol, Junior - Ardilès, Neeskens, Falcao - Keegan, Pelé, Maradona. Favourite other goalkeerper : Thomas N'Kono of Cameroon. Mark Walters (Villa) The 1970 Brazilian World Cup team. Phil Parkes (West Ham) The 1970 Brazilian World Cup winning side, but with Gordon Banks in goal. Gary Lineker (Leicester) Banks - C.Alberto, Beckenbauer, Moore, Cooper - Ball, R. Charlton, Tostao - Cruyff, Pelé, Best. ...Luis Arconada favorite players : Sepp Maïer and José Iribar, the two best keepers I've seen. Franco Causio favorite player: Hans Krankl of Austria...Diego Maradona favortite players: Kempes and Pelé...Kempes: Pelé, Beckenbauer, Müller...Rene Houseman: Rene Houseman...Paul Breitner: Gianni Rivera... Liam Brady's childhood hero(es) : Best, Charlton, Giles. Current fav's: Platini even though he took my place at Juventus. And I don't agree with people who siad he had not deserved his EPTOY. Scoring 18 goals from midfield in Italy isn't easy! Then Zico who hasn't hit top form with Udinese but is still top of the scoring charts. The other Brazilian, Socrates. And I wish I could see more of Maradona. Gordon Davies (Fulham) Banks - C.Alberto, Beckenbauer, Facchetti, Schnellinger - Gerson, Maradona, Rivera - Pelé, Cruyff, Best. Norman Whiteside Banks - Krol, Moore, Beckenbauer, Junior - Cruyff, Zico, Maradona, Charlton - Best, Pelé. Paul Walsh (Luton Town) Banks - Kaltz, Beckenbauer, Moore, Breitner, Best, Zico, Rivelino, Jairzinho, Pelé, Maradona. Davie Cooper (Rangers) Zoff - Jardine, Pezzey, J.Charlton, Tarantini, C.Alberto, Tardelli, Charlton, Bettega, Kempes, Best. Frans Thijssen favorite player: Johann Cruyff of the past and now Kevin Keegan... Lee Chapman: Kempes...Trevor Fancis: Denis Law... Tony Woodcok: Law (past), Cruyff (present/ which year exactly=? was at Forest), Gary Shaw: Hoddle...Alex McLeish: Gerd Müller as a child and fav' Ruud Krol...Ivan Golac: Garrincha... Martin Jol favourite other team (he's at Wes Bro) : Atletico Mineiro (Brazilian club) who has Reinaldo, Cerezo and others. Arnold Mühren Shilton - Suurbier, Beckenbauer, Passarella, Krol - Charlton, Neeskens, Zico - Best, Cruyff, Maradona. Tony Morley Brazil's team of 1970. Paul McStay Banks - McGrain, Moore, C.Alberto, Junior, Cruyff, Maradona, Johnstone, Dalglish, Pelé, Best. Kenny Hibbitt (Wolves) Banks - Kaltz, Beckenbauer, Krol, Wilson - Ball, Charlton, Maradona - Best, Pelé, Eusébio. Childhood's hero: Di Stéfano. Jimmy Rimmer Banks - Dunne, Beckenbauer, Moore, Wilson - Ball, Charlton - Finney, Law, Pelé, Best. Chrys Whyte (Arsenal) Jennings - Vogts, Moore, J.Charlton, Breitner, B.Charlton, Beckenbauer, Maradona, Best, Pelé, Cruyff. Simon Stainrod (QPR) Banks - Kaltz, Moore, Beckenbauer, Breitner, Zico, Gerson, Best, Law, Pelé, Kempes. Sub.: Maradona. George Wood (Arsenal's gk) Jennings - McGrain, Beckenbauer, Moore, Cooper - Cruyff, Souness, Charlton, Dalglish, Law, Best. Kevin O'Callaghan (Ipswich) Banks - Kaltz, Beckenbauer, Moore, Cooper - Giles, Maradona, Cruyff, Pelé, Rummenigge, Best. Neil Whatmore (Birmingham City) Banks - C.Alberto, Beckenbauer, Krol, Santos - Gerson, Rivera - Maradona, Tostao, Pelé, Best.
Gazzetta dello Sport made in January 1981 this worldwide superteam ('La supersquadra dei mondiali') "ecco la supersquadra mondiale di ogni tempo" Gilmar; Djalma Santos, Beckenbauer, Rosato, Nilton Santos; Neeskens; Schiaffino, Cruijff; Meazza, Pelé, Riva.
Good find again. Inevitably each nations 'selectors' can often be a bit biased (or just more familiar) re: the players of their leagues and NTs, but still interesting to see and a) All those Italians might have an arguable case in those roles. b) As far as mixing star players and a 'real' looking team goes that to me looks an impressive choice - a team like that probably functions and gels very well, assuming Criujff would be all over the pitch and Meazza not tied to the right wing but part of a fluid front 3 (of course it's also a bit difficult for us to truly appreciate and/or analyse Meazza's game). There's very much a libero/stopper partnership, and the 3 Brazilians at the back did very well together obviously.
Yes, in Italian systems of that time the right sided midfielder/winger was often more advanced/attacking than the left sided midfielder. That's also how a Riva or Prati came usually from the left while being an all-out attacker or striker. So in that way I can imagine it might work, with the very attacking full-backs providing the width.
I'm thinking that for this to work, with two attacking full-backs and a libero it indeed helps to have a scrapper with range and some discipline in the midfield (like Neeskens) rather than a Nobby Stiles or so. You need a holding player who can cover some ground.
Yes, I suppose as you've pointed out before Neeskens could change his role fairly significantly (from almost AM to pretty much DM) depending on what was required. Nice to think of him joining in and combining with Cruyff deep in the opposition half maybe (and it could happen at times with that range) but he'd be required to realise he'd be the anchor midfielder firstly in such a team I'm sure (if it's style is to be a 'typically' balanced one) I don't know if Nilton or especially Djalma would be thought of as attacking by todays standards though (maybe the one position where the role has become more forward oriented over time)?
In this decade the lateral defenders are very oriented to attack but also very vertical. Djalma and Nilton were great for the distribution and creation of game from their sides, Nilton was more offensive than Djalma but both were very solid defensively and of the best in that facet. I think the last great lateral defender who combines all the virtues both defensive, offensive and game creation, even very smart and tactical player is Philipp Lahm but there is no longer any full-back like him.
To revive one of the most creative threads, I was thinking of a manager XI. Player careers are not considered, only player position and manager career. So far: 1. Raymond Goethals 2. Roberto Scarone 3. Bob Paisley 4. Franz Beckenbauer 5. Ernst Happel 6. Vicente Del Bosque 7. Luis Cubilla 8. José Mourinho 9. Udo Lattek 10. Johan Cruijff 11. Rudolf Illovszky
Alan Brazil's Scotland XI : Goram, S. Jardine, McLeish, W. Miller, McGrain, J. Johnstone, Souness, Bremner, Baxter, Dalglish, Law.
Commemorating the 50th anniversary of the Bundesliga in 2013, Kicker asked a host of former managers (Heynckes, Rehhagel, Hitzfeld as well as three Kicker writers) to compile a Best XI for each decade:
In that same "Kicker" special they listed the number of times the selected players were featured in the weekly "team of the day" selection which "Kicker" presents each Monday after weekend league action. The following players featured most often in the "team of the day" (note how highly-placed unsung Bernard Dietz is!): 142 Beckenbauer 113 Vogts 81 Kaltz 78 Matthäus 72 Netzer 70 Dietz 70 K.H.Rummenigge 68 G.Müller 64 Breitner 64 A.Möller 63 Ribéry 62 Kohler 62 Effenberg 55 Höttges 54 Overath 53 Heynckes 51 Hässler 50 Thon 50 K.Allofs 50 Lahm 49 Bordon 48 Littbarski 48 Völler 47 Lúcio 45 Robben 44 Ballack 41 Wimmer 41 Köpke 40 Buchwald 39 Reuter 39 Sammer 38 Kirsten 38 Klose 37 Bonhof 37 Briegel 36 Maier 35 Weber 35 K.Förster 35 Kahn 35 Elber 34 Fischer 32 Magath 31 Seeler 31 Simonsen 30 Schumacher 30 Brehme
The accomplished all-rounder Jimmy Hill in 1990 (I posted this for the interesting/informative commentary by him, not so much the name dropping itself - i.e. Fachetti)
According to their own website Ribery had 6 + 3 + 0 + 4 + 0 in the subsequent seasons so 63 up til now since 2007. Has 6 world class ratings. Lahm had 5 + 2 + 4 + 7 since so 50 in total. Including one in his last game (not an unusual tendency lately regardless of performance; Totti received a 10 from Gazzetta in his last match). That would take him 6 ahead of Ballack, as a reference, who was ranked WC once with Lahm on 5. Ranked world class more often than Ribery and Lahm, and active after 2013, are Neuer and Robben. Neuer (since 2006) has 4 + 2 + 2 + 3 + 4 + 1 (at first Bayern season!) + 1 + 2 + 3 + 0 + 0 + 0 = 22 Robben (since 2009) has 10 + 5 + 4 + 2 + 5 + 8 + 2 + 8 + 1 = 45 From 2009 on Ribery is on 40 inclusions.
I have updated the list. It might be worthwhile to calculate the percentage of Bundesliga games for each player.
These are the percentages: 34 Beckenbauer 31 Netzer 30 Keegan 27 Vogts 26 Ribéry 25 Robben 22 Sammer 22 Breitner 22 K.H.Rummenigge 21 Völler 20 Lúcio 17 Simonsen 17 Ballack 17 Effenberg 17 Matthäus 16 Bordon 16 G.Müller 16 Kohler 15 A.Möller 15 Briegel 14 Elber 14 Heynckes 14 Kaltz 14 Dietz 13 K.Förster 13 Seeler 13 Hässler 13 Lahm 13 Höttges 13 Overath 12 Thon 12 K.Allofs 12 Köpke 12 Littbarski 12 Buchwald 12 Klose 12 Bonhof 11 Klinsmann 11 Kirsten 11 Wimmer 10 Magath 10 Brehme 10 Weber 8 Reuter 8 Maier 6 Kahn 6 Fischer 6 Schumacher 6 Neuer I must stress though that this ranking is not complete as Kicker only compiled the numbers for those players that were selected for the 5 teams. For example, Hans-Peter Briegel didn't make the team thus his appearances in the "Team of the Day" are not listed. He might have managed 50 or so appearances.