Houston Dynamo v. Minnesota United, Wednesday, September 11

Discussion in 'Houston Dynamo' started by newtex, Sep 2, 2019.

?

Result?

Poll closed Sep 11, 2019.
  1. Dynamo win

    2 vote(s)
    28.6%
  2. Dynamo tie

    1 vote(s)
    14.3%
  3. Dynamo lose

    3 vote(s)
    42.9%
  4. Can $1 hot dogs ease the pain? Maybe so.

    1 vote(s)
    14.3%
  1. Ethos

    Ethos Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    Apr 28, 2019
    Houston
    So, I fully expect to be flamed if not banned for this. But, I am a man of honor so here it goes. Kevin Garcia has played a hell of a game tonight.
     
    DonJuego repped this.
  2. Westside Cosmo

    Westside Cosmo Member+

    Oct 4, 2007
    H-Town
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    VAR overturned the goal on offsides, but didn’t call Garcia for the handball before it!!! Ha!
     
  3. ElNaranja

    ElNaranja Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    United States
    Jul 16, 2017
    Considering his body of work, doesn't change my opinion. He should be let go.
     
  4. Westside Cosmo

    Westside Cosmo Member+

    Oct 4, 2007
    H-Town
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Announced. 13,166 - my bid is over and I am out on The Price is Right. I guess I wasn’t able to accurately gauge what figure the Dynamo FO was going to fabricate
     
    nbrooks503 repped this.
  5. Ethos

    Ethos Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    Apr 28, 2019
    Houston
    We won boys!!!!! Let's go!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  6. Ethos

    Ethos Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    Apr 28, 2019
    Houston
    Fair, but tonight he showed up. Dynamo win baby!!!!!!!
     
  7. Dynam0

    Dynam0 Member

    Arsenal
    Feb 3, 2018
    Houston, Texas USA
    Nat'l Team:
    Panama
    Wow... we didn't blow a lead. That is awesome.

    No way they had 13K tonight... the visuals posted on FB are just awful. I would guess 8K
     
    DNez2001 repped this.
  8. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    goals were nicely taken and a pleasing win.
     
    Ethos repped this.
  9. Westside Cosmo

    Westside Cosmo Member+

    Oct 4, 2007
    H-Town
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's inaccurate every game, but tonight it was pretty far off. They probably gave out a ton of ticket to first responders groups but I think the Astros did as well so most probably went to baseball instead.

     
  10. Westside Cosmo

    Westside Cosmo Member+

    Oct 4, 2007
    H-Town
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  11. Westside Cosmo

    Westside Cosmo Member+

    Oct 4, 2007
    H-Town
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  12. nbrooks503

    nbrooks503 Previously Held @Dynamo Hostage From 2008-2019

    Jun 1, 2008
    Disgruntled Former STH - Fairweather Bandwaggoner
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Seems legit- 2nd half I abandoned my luxurious club seats and decided to sit with the peasants (CoachH). I'm thinking I probably should have taken a 360 degree photo because I failed to capture the 10 thousand behind me in the supporters section. IMG_20190911_204849.jpg
     
    Westside Cosmo repped this.
  13. nbrooks503

    nbrooks503 Previously Held @Dynamo Hostage From 2008-2019

    Jun 1, 2008
    Disgruntled Former STH - Fairweather Bandwaggoner
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Section 105 had people with comp'd tickets who had apparently indicated they were interested in upgrading.
     
  14. Westside Cosmo

    Westside Cosmo Member+

    Oct 4, 2007
    H-Town
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    See, there’s the demand for club seats they were talking about so they don’t have to disclose pricing to you!!!!
     
  15. AcetheTigah

    AcetheTigah Member+

    Apr 6, 2005
    Woodlands, TX
    Soo lucky Minnesota didn't score two goals. We benefited from poor play by Minnesota in the final third and some good saves by Willis.

    I thought we really had a drop off from passing out of the back. Fuenmayor is not really helpful in possession. If you paired him with Figeroa it may cover up some that deficiency some but really I see Struna is better with the ball at his feet and as good or better in the air.

    Kev Garcia played well and threw his body around which showed great commitment but great defenders rarely have to do this. He played aggressively and made some good plays.

    Midfield looked pretty good defensively for a change. Memo did not play as good as Martinez for once. It almost looked like he didn't care much.

    Nice movement by the forwards. Nice finish by Manotas and good assist for the unconventional Ramirez goal.

    This team still could not make the playoffs if the season restarted but it is important to win at home even when you aren't that good.

    I am not sure I want them to win because they get a higher draft pick but then again they are so bad at the draft it may be not worth finishing at a lower spot of the table.
     
    CeltTexan repped this.
  16. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    #41 juvechelsea, Sep 12, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2019
    I ran the numbers of curiosity. Last year, 38 points, 1.1 ppg. This year, to date, 34 points, 1.2 ppg. [2017: 50 pts, 1.5 ppg]

    Last year we had 27 pts/1.6 ppg at home. This year so far, 28 pts, averages out to 1.6 ppg. Wash, technically improved no matter what happens. [2017: 40 pts, 2.4 ppg]

    Last year we had 11 pts/0.6 ppg on the road. This year 6 pts, 0.4 ppg. This is where the drop has occurred. [2017: 10 pts, 0.6 ppg]

    GF of 40 is on pace for 46.9, 11.1 down from 58 last year. This is where the drop has occurred. [2017: 57 GF]

    GA of 49 is on pace for 57.4 which is roughly the 58 we allowed last season. Wash. [2017: 45 GA]

    Diagnosis: The similarity from 2018 to 2019 suggests continuity didn't work. Manotas and Quioto fell off, and the offense that was consistent 2017 to 2018 dropped in roughly that amount this season. In the area we have changed, defense, we dropped off from 2017 and basically equaled last season. The changes didn't work. We suck on the road, and worse this season, but this issue is actually consistent over time for years (including 2017). The fall off is at home, where we are stable the past 2 years, but down from the playoff season. But strictly speaking, we have not become a worse home team year to year, just in terms of the playoff year.

    To me this would put in question the diminishing returns of the offense where some want to retain most of the players. The band was kept together 3 years and in year 3 fell off markedly. The fact the GA is flat suggests those moves weren't worthwhile, and the fact that we fell out of the playoffs 2017-2018 with the same GF year to year but more GA suggests defensive repair might be more of a priority than some will admit. The pivotal factor in reduced home effectiveness, resulting in table fall, seems to be defense, not offense, as offense stayed up the first year we missed out. That being said, a revived offense itself might help lower the GA, as 2017 suggests. Either that or we had a better defense that just got old very quickly.

    The constant road issues no matter how many or few goals we score or allow -- and across coach and system changes -- suggests talent/payroll is the issue. The last good year on the road was 2013. What does that tell you?
     
    ElNaranja and Westside Cosmo repped this.
  17. CeltTexan

    CeltTexan Member+

    Sep 21, 2000
    Houston, TX USA
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    For sure when our guys are in possession and play with intent and pace, we are a decent football team. As soon as our guys stop playing the ball so quickly and stop moving off the ball for each other with intent to open up the game, man is our team a stinker of 11 men our there. Last night showed were the parts of the game we owned MinnU and then the parts where we let them back in the match. Which if there is ONE THING our boys do well is let a team back into the fight. Drop points. Why Juve's stats from above speak to our team being consistently inconsistent.

    Yes sir! That outside of the boot, dink over the on rushing goalie was a beaut!!! Tough to execute at pace and Rameriz showed class to slot the ball home. I went bonkers as well!

    I noticed that too! Kevin really showed an honest uptick in his game. Very pleased to witness this from him.
    I am a critic on our players, every sport Houston turns up in, and take their play/dedication to the cause very serious. I.e. be good at the job and if you cannot be good every night at least be f'n professional. BE SOMEONE!
     
    Ethos and Westside Cosmo repped this.
  18. Westside Cosmo

    Westside Cosmo Member+

    Oct 4, 2007
    H-Town
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Good analysis. It tells me 3 things: (1) Dom was a good coach for grinding out results: (2) payroll/talent is an overall issue due to underinvestment but also has Jordan properly allocated what resources he has to work with (3) 2017 was fool’s gold because so many of the results that drove the stats, record, and playoff run were isolated to the first two months of the season at home against weaker teams and the late run into the playoff (along with KC and Dallas collapsing and Portland losing everyone to injury).
     
  19. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    #44 juvechelsea, Sep 12, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2019
    Having stepped back a moment, I would read the stats as saying that duh overall competitiveness -- manifest particularly in road play -- is payroll. The numbers are the same for years dating back to Kinnear in 2014 who played a totally different and even more defensive system. That suggests at some point we simply became less competitive which shows up on the road. At the tail end of the "playoff regulars" teams, we were league semi level talent, and got road results. Hmmm.

    The stats to me suggest that we can do the moneyball thing but it will become hoping for a rare alignment of planets manifest in more home success. Unless you find an overwhelming offense on the cheap it will be subject to diminishing returns. Again, duh. But even more pivotal in that home success might be defense. 10-15 or so fewer GA would make us a marginal playoff team, albeit not at a high level. That would take payroll.

    It all lines up, particularly if you discount the difference between making the playoffs and advancing in 2017 as down to injuries. We enjoyed that but if you view how far it went as a fluke, I think that gives you a sense of the dynamic we're in. On this payroll, if the stars align, low seed playoffs. If the stars fall out of alignment or the defense sucks, out. The diminishing offensive returns suggest that fairly potent offenses (but not exceptional ones) of which we are proud one year may not keep up the next. To overcome that you probably need the talent to score into the 60s. At which point, see my point about payroll.

    We are also highly elastic to whether we have a defense going, and that itself may reflect the payroll disparity, ie, playing at a disadvantage makes us depend on how well the moneyballed defense can stop a better paid offense.

    At least one theory this would support, that I have had, is that if we remain cheap we should chase defense instead of offense because a stout if cheap defense would work towards negating the payroll advantage, while putting the money in offense, while appealing to fans, leaves us with a cheaper imitation of the expensive offenses, and without a good defense to stop their better paid offense.
     
    Westside Cosmo repped this.
  20. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    I spent most of my time on 2017-2019 because I wanted to see what changed. I didn't really stare a hole in the trends going back to Kinnear. What I did notice, is I looked back to see the last time we had a markedly better road record and that was 2013 with 5 wins and several ties. That was a semi season, and the two years before that were finalists. That suggests in our history a high level of success links up with road play, and verging on tautology that road play reflects talent. When we have talent we go far and when we go far the road record is better. The first part of that is duh. The second part is interesting.

    In terms of giving Kinnear complete credit, meh. His last two years are non playoffs and the road record sucks similar to now.

    I think this would instead support a payroll/talent argument. The first two years we had a championship caliber team that won titles. I think at that time it was a hard cap with grandfathered players plus 1 DP. By 2013 I think we're up to the 3 DPs but at that point we were just getting where everyone used it, and few teams spent big. We made a couple finals but slipped to playoff regular behind LAG who would spend. Then several teams became spenders, new and old, and we shuffled down. That's this era. That era for us started in 2014 during Kinnear. Since that point we have made the playoffs once, 2017, when some stars aligned. The old man defense went off a cliff year 2 and there went playoffs. By year 3 the offense, which is prime age, itself began delivering diminishing returns. This suggests serious limits to moneyball hoping the stars align. At minimum it would suggest you should try to align the stars with younger defenders because once that imploded we ceased to be competitive, But it also says if we get second tier offensive power (good but not great) it will have diminishing returns within like 3 years as teams catch on or talent continues to progress.
     
  21. Ethos

    Ethos Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    Apr 28, 2019
    Houston
    I went back and rewatched the highlights, Garcia did have a horrible pass that resulted in Willis being drawn out and that header and beautiful clear by Fuenmayor. Other than that, and that was a big mistake, he played wonderfully. I hope it continues. Last night was fun. The boys played like a team, like they wanted to be there. We didnt lay back, we played hard. It was a good day for me, went to bed happy, slept happy
     
  22. Varus

    Varus Member

    Feb 5, 2015
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    My pet theory on '17 is that the league took time to adapt to Cabrera's 4-3-3 gimmick and that made everyone on the team look better, defense included. Everything went downhill after that was unpacked, but we had a techy player in Sanchez that suddenly caught fire and gave us a plan B enough to muddle through a weak playoff bracket.

    Arnaud finally did something different and got Manotas/Ramirez on the field together and it looked better. Good. Keep a two-striker line-up out there because the only success you've had so far is with that.
     
  23. CeltTexan

    CeltTexan Member+

    Sep 21, 2000
    Houston, TX USA
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Correct!
    The old tried and true 4-4-2. With a traditional big man #9 in Ramirez and a smaller, poacher #7 to play off his strike partner in our man Manotas.
    It works whem the two are in form and on the same page. Both scored last night! There ya go Coach Arnaud!
     

Share This Page