Green Army

Well, since you're no longer part of the team, why don't you join us? You told us at BW-3s earlier this year that if you weren't part of the team you'd be part of us.

As for your question about the group size. I'm not sure if you're trying to be snarky or something, but just read the posts here and on the GA boards and you'll see part of the reason why we may be a bit smaller. If the FO doesn't fix things we'll probably be even smaller next year.

 

Oh, for starters, how about better communication with the fans. Our captain gets kicked off the team and there's no mention of it anywhere. Hell, even if he wasn't kicked off. We have no way of knowing that. There's more to that issue. But communication is a big one.

How about a coach that gives a damn? Yeah, Rod might care, but he hasn't done anything to show it. He's one of the least animated coaches I've ever seen. All he does is sit on the bench. But I see little emotion/passion from him regardless of our play on the field and our result. Now, I get this might be a personality/style thing. But he really comes off like he doesn't give a shit. We rarely see him communicating with the players either. Maybe he's one of those guys that think you win the games in practice and once game day comes around all his job is is to sub. Also, I don't see how he can have a good view of the entire field from sitting on the bench. Especially with the way the field is made for drainage with an elevated center. At least stand the whole game, I mean, the GA does that. Now, if he's got some kind of disability where he can't do that, I'd understand. I admit that the sitting issue is a minor thing, but it pisses a lot of us off because it just adds to the persona that he doesn't care. Also, our tactics are terrible. We don't try to maintain possession at all or string together even two passes. It's just hit the long ball and hoof it up the field or praying for a lucky counter attack. Ultimately, regardless of the above, our results are terrible. It seems our communication on the field is terrible. And there is one person where the buck must stop on these issues. Like I said, some of the above may seem superfluous and non-essential to performance, the sitting/personality/animation issue. But the performance isn't happening either. How long are they going to keep this guy on for? Are they really happy with his performance?

Bedford Stadium is terrible. Yes, I know there's nothing they can do about this now. But I'm talking about for next year, right?

They can also keep the team pastor away from us. He doesn't need to come around making snarky comments. Oh, gee, we don't know the whole story? Maybe that's because the team didn't give us a single peep except for a leak by a staff member. Not only that, but he clearly doesn't understand the fan mindset.

It also seems like the team doesn't care about the product on the field, they're more concerned with the special events or dropping cows from helicopters. Yeah, I realize that they're trying to get fans into the stadium, but we did pretty well during the last two years without some of this BS.

A lot of the problems are just the general vibe we're getting from the FO. It's hard to explain. But better communication could go a long way. When you get rid of a fan favorite w/o any explanation or mention. Well, that's just poor. Even just a simple mention of so and so has left the team would have been acceptable. The way we found out was that he just wasn't on the roster anymore and we couldn't see him on the sideline. Then we heard something from a staff member that may or may not be true. But since the team said nothing, that's all we had to go on. Then the team pastor, of all people comes over and says we don't know what we're talking about. Now can you see where we're coming from? This organization has become a circus sideshow.

There are more than these as well, I'm surprised no one else has pitched in. But if you read these forums you can find them.

 

Agreed, City Dave. Even my girlfriend mentioned Sunday how annoying the t-shirts being thrown into the stands during the course of play was unprofessional.
But, I suppose this is "pro soccer in Cleveland" these days. It's not for us, it's for the youth teams that can purchase fifty tix per match.

 

Also, I can't believe I forgot to mention this. It's the pervasive lack of heart throughout most of the team. Most of us aren't just bitching and pissed because we're losing this year and we're at the bottom. It's HOW we are losing. Our first two seaons our players never said quit. They always acted as if they were in the game no matter how far behind we were. We won or tied many games coming from behind. We were all heart.

This year, this attitude is severely lacking. We saw a glimmer of it the week of our Open Cup win over St. Louis followed by the 3-0 win over Rochester. But then it was gone.

It really seems as if the results on the field are secondary.

Oh, and we also heard from a source with the team that the players had been discouraged, at least at the beginning of the season, from celebrating in front of us or associating with us in general. Something about someone in the FO not really getting our purpose or understanding supporters' culture. Now this could be BS, but we've seen signs that back this up.


We also miss Mark Geissbauer a great deal. He was great for the club in our opinion.

 

I knew your original question was just baiting. Please, tell us how you really feel.

Did I complain about the marketing? I'm well aware of what a team needs to do to draw in fans and survive. Did you fail to read this? "Yeah, I realize that they're trying to get fans into the stadium, but we did pretty well during the last two years without some of this BS."

WTF do you know? How long were you with the team? Why aren't you with them anymore? Were you there the first two years?

I'm not naive, I do not expect the FO to cater only to fans like the GA. Nor should they. They need all fans to come to the game, families and casual fans included.

And did you even read my last post?

Here, let me say it again: "Most of us aren't just bitching and pissed because we're losing this year and we're at the bottom. It's HOW we are losing."

Your last comment is ridiculous anyway, because that's the case in every sport, every league, every team around the world. I get what you're really trying to say anyway, which was hidden in your very first post. You're trying to knock on us for not being real fans. That we're fair weather fans. For running away when we're losing or whatever. That's clearly not the case.

Hell, if this season proves anything, we only sing when we're losing.

I suppose you'd rather us just cheerlead and blindly support whatever the team chooses. Obviously, you're biased from your former relationship with the club, which btw, is years shorter than the majority of the GA. I talked with Mark a few times before we even had our first scrimmage.

Like I said, you're welcome to stand with us next game. I'm sure you'll find that we're not as bad as some within the organization are making us out to be. Hell, maybe you can enlighten us on some things that might smooth relations with the team.

PS - oh, and there was a lot more to my post than just the marketing crap. That's the least of the team's problems. Why don't you try addressing the other issues I brought up?

 

The marketing crap frustrates me, personally, because it seems like so much effort is being thrown at attracting people who will come to one game, maybe two in a season. That's great for your short-term results, but you really need to cultivate a rock-strong base of fans that will come back game after game after game. Pissing off your base to throw money and effort at the casual attendee (I wouldn't even use the word "fan" in this case) is a mistake, looking long-term.

To be successful, you need to cater to both types. And frankly, us passionate fans are the easier of the two. We don't ask for much. Just let us know what's going on and put a team on the field that really cares, and we'll be there for you. We may bitch, but we'll be there for you.

------RM

 

This is a pretty good summary of both my posts in this thread.

 

Exactly. I think it was last year when I was talking to the FO about changing the slogan from "Serving the City" to something they could sell, I suggested "Pride and Passion" which is what every team needs. Sadly, from most of CCS, I see very little of either, on the pitch or in the FO.

 

Yeah, and the other thing is, most people can tell if the players are giving it their all. Even people that don't know much about the sport can see passion. They can see the players faces, they can hear how they talk to each other. This kind of thing can lose or gain casual fans as well. Just because they don't sing and chant doesn't mean that a lot of the people in the stands aren't paying attention to the game. Heck, it doesn't even mean they are casual. I've talked to some of them, and I've sat in other places a couple of times. They can tell the difference, too.

If the players don't appear to care, then why should the fans? The opposite is true as well. Passionate die-hard players will draw the crowd in. Especially in a small stadium like Bedford. Krenzler was even better for this because it was right on the field.

 

Somebody sent me a PM. I won't say who. I'll leave it to them to come in and own up to if they want to. But since they addressed my posts here and mentioned that some players apparently heard about them and were upset I decided to copy my response to him and put it here. Mostly just in case some players actually were pissed at what I and others have been saying.

This is what he sent me followed by my answer:

So, with the negative posters in the GA section, trashing the team's coach publically and questioning the player's commitment here with BS you hope all that will change? Seriously? The players I've spoken to are pissed at what you've spouted here. I'm at a loss why you never sent your resume in to the FO after Rennie left, or why you never showed up at the open trials to show Coach and Aaron what real heart looks like. What kind of heart are you showing as a fan? What change do you think your complaining will accomplish? Will it encourage the team to put out or convict the FO to fire our coach? Maybe it will rally the GA or fans in general to a greater level of support? ...or do you just like to hear yourself complain and encourage others to as well? Think about it. Great strategy dude! [/quote]

He asked, I answered. Obviously, I don't think all of the players don't care. I, and the rest of the GA, show heart when we show up and sing and scream during the match. Yeah, we may have slacked off the past year, but we still come out and cheer on the team. How do you show yours? And if I've pissed off some players maybe it'll motivate them more. Why should they care enough about what one stupid fan thinks to get pissed off? Tell them welcome to professional sports.

Btw, if your doctor makes a mistake are you not allowed to criticize or question him because you didn't go to medical school? What about politicians? I guess becase you didn't run for office yourself then you can't argue against anything they do. That whole, if you think you're so good why don't you try it argument is cliche and bullshit. Along with the you don't have a right to critique or complain for the same reasons. My 13 weeks at Parris Island is enough to show me or anyone what true heart is about. Not that I need to do anything to have a right to say what my opinion is about the team.

Unbelievable. Really. I don't think there is a coach alive that hasn't been trashed publicly. I'm just one freaking fan, dude. Someone asked my opinion so I gave it.

And as I said, I don't think all of the players lack heart. And I blame the coach for what I see lacking on the field more than anything. I may be wrong. But I'm sure as hell entitled to my opinion and a place to voice it.

end of reply

And if there are any players out there actually reading this. I apologize if I've pissed you off. Because if you're pissed about what one stupid fan says then that means you care. So show us on the field. And as I said, there are a lot of guys on the team, I'm not going to mention names, that obviously do give 100% all the time.

Besides, I was just pointing out how things appear to me, and only because someone asked me. The attitude of some people from the team that came and posted on here pissed me off so I may have gotten carried away with my response, but I stand by it. Personally, I doubt many team members read this. And the ones that might have been pissed off like the guy above says they are, well, they're pissed off because he went and told them his version of what I said, out of context. Just like in the children's game telephone.

If I didn't care about the team I wouldn't even be here.

 

I'd just like to add, in case it wasn't clear, that the person that sent me that PM isn't officially affiliated with the team. He's just another fan.

 

There's a really good picture from the 90's of Celtic fans that I think would be very prudent in this situation. These normal Celtic fans were distraught with how the team was being run and wore shirts that spelled out "Support Celtic. Sack the Board!" Support City. Sack the Board.

I chirped my first match impressions in a previous thread and I was back with friends again. The last game, I was upset but for other reasons that I won't get into now. This time I was disturbed at the game for entirely different reasons. The tshirt toss in the 80 minute while City tried to cling to a 0-0 draw was absurd and distracted those actually wanting to watch the match. My buddies commented on it, others around me commented on it. It seems like City has the MLS' business strategy from the 90's, trying to get families and only families to the game. How'd that work out for the MLS?

As far as the product on the field, it was a little better. City actually had a few decent chances and the keeper played out of his gourd, earning City the point.

Overall, if the Front Office is actually reading this, you're losing customers. There's a decent soccer following population in NE Ohio, yet your turning them away. You turned three of them away Sunday, in the form of my three pals, and I'm not far behind them. I have no no previous affiliation with the GA, only been to two matches last year, just being honest. As a soccer fan in Cleveland, I hope that it all works out. It does not seem to be on the right track though.

 

>>So, with the negative posters in the GA section, trashing the team's coach publically and questioning the player's commitment here with BS you hope all that will change? Seriously? The players I've spoken to are pissed at what you've spouted here. I'm at a loss why you never sent your resume in to the FO after Rennie left, or why you never showed up at the open trials to show Coach and Aaron what real heart looks like. What kind of heart are you showing as a fan? What change do you think your complaining will accomplish? Will it encourage the team to put out or convict the FO to fire our coach? Maybe it will rally the GA or fans in general to a greater level of support? ...or do you just like to hear yourself complain and encourage others to as well? Think about it. Great strategy dude!<<

Someone's a little unhappy that we're not drinking the "Everyone be Happy No Matter What" kool-aid.

 

Honestly, a lot of the problems having to do with attendance and other things are a result of the team moving out to the east side. The team lost more west-siders than gained east-siders. A better, more intimate stadium next season would go a long way to improve things.

Let's just remember that the guy who sent that to Dave is not affiliated with the team. It's just another fan.

The players that I've talked to are doing everything to the fans. They want to get the results for the fans. They don't have grudges against the green army. If anything, they want to give the fans a reward for sticking with the team through the tough times. They're not giving up. Maybe it's harder to see at Bedford, but from being around the guys at practice, the drive is still very much there.

 

I would be stunned and disappointed if any of the players were upset at a supporters group for their discontent. The complaints that I have read, both here and at the Green Army board, have all been aimed at the FO and the coach. There's the complaint that "the players aren't showing heart", but that's universally understood as evidence of piss-poor coaching.

------RM

 

The first 2 years, i came to most of the games. The reasons I stopped coming are;

1. They chose a high school football stadium to play there home games. After ripping harrisburg's field with a baseball diamond on it and Pittsburgh for playing at a high school stadium, how could I be proud of the fact that we chose to play there. The football lines and how fast it plays really reduces the enjoyment of the game.

2. Like City Dave has stated, the FO doesnt communicate. They dont act like a professional franchise, which they are by the way. I mean, your GENERAL MANAGER "resigns", and there is no mention of it on the official team website. How can that be? It was in the Plain Dealer, but not ont he website. That is bush league. Bush league wont sell in Cleveland.

How that played out with Mark is how I will remember this season. That and the fact at the last game I went to and some member of the FO was yelling at the GA for one of there chants. But, hey, the Fried Cheese on a Stick was good though

 

Ultra, you work for the team. I know you are try to spin all this negativity. I remember at the beginning of the season you were trying to rip me for it, and now look, everyone is doing it. I respect your knowledge and your passion, but the more you try to make this season into a positive, the more it makes you look bad. I am grouping you in with the FO because you work for them, and the FO cant be trusted, and we have no idea what they are making you say on here or on your tv skits.

Unitl you ask the good questions about why our favorite player isnt on the team anymore or why they can still smile while this dreadful season slowly pushes along, or if we will ever score a goal again, you wont have the respect you should have.

 

Contrary to what your "brilliant" insight might tell you, Mark Geissbauer was not fired. You can shout til you are blue in the face, but you are flat out WRONG about this. If he resigned, why would he still be showing up to the games. Maybe if you actually went to the games, you would know that. Maybe you don't read the news that the team emails. I don't know why you aren't on the list, but the announcement went out to everybody on Saturday, June 6th. It came out in the afternoon. I remember sitting in the airport reading it. And it didn't go to my work email. It went to my personal email that is signed up for the newsletter. But no, the team didn't announce it. Apparently your knowledge of the situation is so much better than mine. You just understand so much more than anybody else does.

And if you're interested, he just got engaged and might be moving back to Germany. He's been living there the past few weeks and just came back to Ohio to get engaged.

In working for CityStars.tv it is not my duty to be asking those questions. That's the job for THE MEDIA. Nobody is "making me say" anything. Maybe you should ask the media why they're not asking the questions. Complain to the TV stations, the newspapers, the radio stations, whatever. You can do whatever you want. You could even start your own blog and show up and ask questions. You could call up the radio show and ask. But instead you choose to sit on the sidelines, on the internet, and bitch at me. It's not my job.

You criticize the players for "smiling." So do you expect the players just to be sitting and crying because the team is having a bad season? Do you think they're not trying? Do you think they don't care?

Nobody likes the stadium. The fans don't. The team doesn't. The players don't. It was the last choice option. More than likely we won't be back there next year. It's a long drive for me to get to the games now. But I don't care. Even if I wasn't doing CityStars.TV I'd still be at every game because I support my team. So do the other members who haven't let a change of stadium stop them from supporting the team.

I'd love to see you at a game. I can tell you more than you'd probably even want to know. Hopefully I'll see you at the August 1st game, but I'm not optimistic.

 

http://www.oursportscentral.com/services/releases/?id=3836863

Here was the announcement about Geissbauer resigning. This was the email that the team sent out.

Also, what are you talking about FO yelling at the Green Army about chants? Maybe if you went to the games, you'd know that the pastor is not a representative of the organization. Just because he doesn't like something doesn't mean the team doesn't like something. And maybe you'd know that he hasn't stopped any of the chants, nor have we EVER been banned from chanting anything.

 

Ultra, I know it was in an email. I have seen it in the newsletter/email. I also do know after talking to a few people, that Mark did resigned. I found out during the long home stand. I put "resigned" in quoatation marks to make a point that the FO does a terrible job communicating. If they would have had it on there website, like every other professional franchise would have, people would not have had to resort to these conspiracy theories. They made it seem they were hiding something. Just come out and tell people what is going on with Mark and "our favorite player". But they dont, they try to hide things so it doesnt become a negative.

Ultra, I know it is unfair to be grouped in with the FO since your doing your work to better your career, and i respect that, and for 2 years, your as big as a CCS nut there is, its that I dont trust this FO at all, and since ur the new face on CS.TV, i have no idea how bad they scrutinizethe stuff you say.

I hope to be there the 1st, I get home from Chautauqua on on the 31st. Maybe we will havescord another goal by then.

 

^^^^
While I agree with you in principal. You have to remember, the CCS front office is made up of volunteers, interns, recent college grads and low-salaried employees. Communication is key. Well intentioned and all good people but not the cream of the crop in the business. Their HQ is a church!!!!

We're not talking Man U. here.

 

Tim, you are right, it is not MAN U. But if you lived in Cleveland your whole life, you know the fans expect top quality, with no excuses. heck, they demand it 100% effiiency at the high school football level. They are a professional franchise, so things need to be conducted at a professional level, no excuses. If it cant be done, they need to call themselves Semi-Pro. The fans wont come if it is not top quality. i.e. Lake Erie Monsters. With the 3 major sports teams in town, that is what is expected. Heck, even the Lake County Captains and Akron Aeros undertsand that. Thats why they have first class stadiums and a staff that can get the job done. Thats why they draw good crowds.