Gamechanger.... looks like our SD MLS messiah has arrived!!

Discussion in 'San Diego' started by marford21, Mar 6, 2015.

  1. athletics68

    athletics68 Member+

    Dec 12, 2006
    San Diego & San Jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yes exactly. They can’t just “declare victory” as was suggested if they solely defeat SoccerCity. If SDSU West also fails to pass, SDSU football is up shit creek. There won’t be another vote until at least 2020 by which time their lease at the Murph will have expired leaving them homeless. And there’s no guarantee they can put together s new plan and get it on the ballot in 2 short years after an SDSU West defeat (or that an SDSU West Part 2 would then pass).
     
  2. mike4066

    mike4066 Member+

    Jun 30, 2007
    Chula Vista, CA
    Club:
    Fulham FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The city has said that SDSU can extend for a number of years beyond 2020 but not indefinitely. This was announced after SDSU renegotiated the rent.

    Also Petco Park has said that the Aztecs can play there for a maximum for 2 years so the situation is not as dire as you say.
     
  3. Threeke

    Threeke Member

    Feb 26, 2016
    Exactly. The city extended the lease by 2 years like barely a month ago. if neither plan wins in November, they'll likely just extend it again (hopefully with better terms for the city this time) until whatever redevelopment project get's approved in like *84 years.*

    To suggest that the university needs SDSU West to pass this November for the sake of the football team is somewhere between disingenuous and **disintelligent.**


    *slight exaggeration
    **joking but you catch my drift
     
  4. Threeke

    Threeke Member

    Feb 26, 2016
    The November 2020 election takes place before the newly approved existing lease expires on December 31st 2020. They'll never be homeless. Worst case scenario they stopgap somewhere while some permanent option is constructed.

    The real winners if SoccerCity loses are the developers who get a second chance to build out whatever project does eventually get approved. They'd lose out entirely if FS Investors get the entire parcel.
     
  5. owian

    owian Member+

    Liverpool FC, San Diego Loyal
    May 17, 2002
    San Diego
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is my biggest concern if neither of them pass, it gives more time for other developers with no plans to build a stadium to get involved.

    I also have a question, couldn't the city council come up with a solution on their own plan if both these are voted down? I mean I know this is San Diego and we have one of the most dysfunctional local governments in the country but that could happen? I understand their would have to be a vote if they sold the entire parcel to one developer, but my understanding from the Chargers situation was that there are ways around that.
     
  6. mike4066

    mike4066 Member+

    Jun 30, 2007
    Chula Vista, CA
    Club:
    Fulham FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    They technically could but the feeling I get from them and the Mayor is they don't want to touch this. I think they don't want to make a decision as it would "expose" them politically.
     
  7. owian

    owian Member+

    Liverpool FC, San Diego Loyal
    May 17, 2002
    San Diego
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    https://www.voiceofsandiego.org/top...it-will-pay-for-everything-in-sdsu-west-plan/

    Interesting article about Measure G the SDSU west proposal. Raises a lot of the fears I have around what SDSU specifically wants to do and how they will pay for it. SDSU's response continues to be "trust us".

    One question I have is does SDSU HAVE to build a stadium? What if Hypothetically, SDSU commissioned a big report about the future of college football and their role in it and the report comes back that they will be in basically the same spot in 20 years. The report recommends that they drop football completely and instead use the land for different purposes. Is there anything in measure G to stop them from doing this?
     
  8. Threeke

    Threeke Member

    Feb 26, 2016
    Not that I've seen. The entire SDSU West argument is "trust us, we're the university" as you said. I heard Fred Pierce basically argue that the university has an "extraordinary incentive" to build a stadium on the quick because they are planning on using borrowed funds, but that's not what's in the initiative.

    This is from the City Attorney report on the initiative:
    In the report, the city attorney asked and answered specific questions:

    Q: Will adoption of the initiative require that the development outlined in the initiative be built?

    A: No.

    Q:Does the initiative require a stadium to be built?

    A: No.

    Q: What happens if a stadium is not built?

    A: There is no remedy for the city if a stadium is not built within seven years of the sale, or at all.

    Q: Does the Initiative require the purchaser to build a River Park?

    A: No. There is no remedy in the initiative if the River Park is not constructed within seven years or at all.

    Q: Will the Development include affordable housing?

    A: That is unclear. The city could not enforce those (affordable housing) requirements against the state.

    Q: Would the initiative require city taxpayer funds?

    A: That is unclear. The initiative doesn’t state who will pay for River Park improvements on city land.

    Q: Can the purchaser transfer its interest in the site?

    A: Yes. The State Board of Trustees will make the ultimate use and development determination for the Existing Stadium Site including whether the site will be sold to a third party.
     
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  9. Threeke

    Threeke Member

    Feb 26, 2016
    I think the council could, but I have no faith that they will. Might depend a bit on how this November goes and if any of the incumbents are replaced, but its hard to say what the immediate next course of action would be if they both failed.
     
  10. mike4066

    mike4066 Member+

    Jun 30, 2007
    Chula Vista, CA
    Club:
    Fulham FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    SDSU isn't going to drop football. As we all know football is king in the US and keeping the program DIV1A is goal #1.

    As for trusting SDSU, I can't speak to that but I can speak to SoccerCity and there is no provision in there that they have to give back the land if MLS doesn't choose San Diego as an expansion city.
     
    athletics68 repped this.
  11. owian

    owian Member+

    Liverpool FC, San Diego Loyal
    May 17, 2002
    San Diego
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Probably host another used car tent sale :D
     
    mike4066 repped this.
  12. owian

    owian Member+

    Liverpool FC, San Diego Loyal
    May 17, 2002
    San Diego
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't think this is a conspiracy or anything I completely believe that at the moment SDSU wants to use the land to build a football stadium and totally expect them to do that if they win. Just aware that there are a lot of fluid things going on with football. You have two different factors which will make it a much more expensive endeavor in the future. The first is the push to pay the players. Can see a world where the top programs break away from the NCAA and create their own competition where they don't have to worry about losing millions of dollars because their star RB got a free haircut.

    The second part is the head trauma aspect. Insurance is going to have to go up and exposure to law suits is also going to rise as we learn more and more. I'm not saying Football is dead and soccer will replace it or any of that stuff, just that the costs are going to rise and their may come a time, sooner than we think possible, that the math no longer works for mid majors like SDSU, and the process of building the stadium is going to force that calculation sooner rather than later.

    As for trusting SDSU, I can't speak to that but I can speak to SoccerCity and there is no provision in there that they have to give back the land if MLS doesn't choose San Diego as an expansion city.[/QUOTE]

    Fair point, which is why I was hoping MLS would take a bigger active role in the campaign. Their silence has been noticed and makes me a little nervous.
     
  13. owian

    owian Member+

    Liverpool FC, San Diego Loyal
    May 17, 2002
    San Diego
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Community Event
    Thursday, October 18, 2018 at 7:00 PM
    what
    What’s the Story? SDSU West & Soccer City

    location
    Kensington Community Church

    details


    Soccer City, Measure E, and SDSU West, Measure G, are competing on the November 6th ballot. Vying to develop the former Qualcomm site, the proponents’ plans have similarities but differ in many respects. Representatives from each side will present their plans and answer your questions. Know the story before casting your vote. Sponsored by Kensington-Talmadge Community Association and Normal Heights Community Association. To reserve your spot call (619) 563-1249.

    Just wanted to let people know about this event I saw. Looks like a chance to get a lot of the questions answered.
     
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  14. mike4066

    mike4066 Member+

    Jun 30, 2007
    Chula Vista, CA
    Club:
    Fulham FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Fair point and it may happen eventually but won't for at least the next 10-20 years as TV contracts are still what drives most of the value right now. Also, players have been getting payments for the last 2-3 years via stipends. Obviously the bigger schools offer more money than the smaller schools.

    Another fair point but like I said, football is king and this isn't going to effect big time college football. If we do see less players then you'll see the smaller schools stop playing football. As for insurance, I am sure the lawyers will find a way to cover the schools but its a fair point.
     
  15. owian

    owian Member+

    Liverpool FC, San Diego Loyal
    May 17, 2002
    San Diego
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I guess the question is does State count as "big time" college football? With their recent on field performances and a new stadium I answer yes. But I don't think it's a clear answer.

    I'm just frustrated that we couldn't get everyone together and build something that helps the whole city and be smart about it. Guess it's not the San Diego way.
     
    mike4066 repped this.
  16. athletics68

    athletics68 Member+

    Dec 12, 2006
    San Diego & San Jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Measure E has lost a ton of momentum. The Stadium coalition just endorsed G in the latest blow. This after Labor, police, fire and the Democratic Party all got behind G.

    I hate to say it, but the MLS via E dream appears DOA. Hopefully Stone can make it work in the confines of what G proposes, assuming it passes.
     
  17. mike4066

    mike4066 Member+

    Jun 30, 2007
    Chula Vista, CA
    Club:
    Fulham FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Hopefully it makes him and FSI see the writing on the wall and brings them back to the table. I doubt it happens though and we will see an new investor group next year.
     
  18. Threeke

    Threeke Member

    Feb 26, 2016
    Which of the two are you voting for then?
     
  19. Threeke

    Threeke Member

    Feb 26, 2016
    I don't think we'll see another investor group for anything higher than USL if Measure E loses. FS has been at the table. Pretty sure its SDSU that flipped it over and stormed off...

    None of that really matters unfortunately at this point. The election is set and now we just have to wait for the outcome.
     
  20. CoronaOrange

    CoronaOrange Member

    May 23, 2017
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It wasn't FS who walked away from the table, but rather SDSU.
    Whether they did that for the right or wrong reasons is up to each individuals opinion.

    IMO with the St. Louis bid coming back from the dead, I don't think San Diego get's another chance for an MLS expansion team if E doesn't come to fruition.
    Best they can hope for will be a relocation.
     
    Threeke repped this.
  21. mike4066

    mike4066 Member+

    Jun 30, 2007
    Chula Vista, CA
    Club:
    Fulham FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    We can see another investor group for MLS, just depends on when/if their option for a franchise expires.
     
  22. Threeke

    Threeke Member

    Feb 26, 2016
    Not here in San Diego. I'm perplexed as to why you think that's an option.

    Never say never obviously but we're talking about decades from now if ever.
     
  23. mike4066

    mike4066 Member+

    Jun 30, 2007
    Chula Vista, CA
    Club:
    Fulham FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I am perplexed as to why you think it won't happen.

    My understanding of FSI and their MLS option is that it is finite.
     

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