PBP: (EURO 08 Finals) Germany v. Spain [R]

Yes I have been hyper-critical. I am proud of the team because it really shows the strength of the German spirit that it took us all the way to the final when we had so many problems in every area of our play.

I would be far more concerned if Germany played really well and lost. There is lots to improve and we have two years to make the necessary changes. I think Loew can grow with the current team and we have a good chance at 2010!

 

End of the day Germany is the best European team ever, Spain wont do ******** all again for another 40 years, same as England (well England will be lucky at all)

Italy is the nest best team in Europe, records wise

 

You can be taken seriously once Germany ends their 12 year trophy drought

 

Guys, this is ridiculous. Our team has done a great job, reaching the final. Of course the final itself was a disappointment, but you have to give credit where credit is due. Spain has played a phenomenal Euro and they were just the best team. And we still almost made it...I'm thinking about the hand-ball in the penalty area or that scene at the end when Rosetti called a foul by Gomez in the penalty area that clearly wasn't one.
Now don't get me wrong, I don't want to bitch about the ref. Spain totally deserved this title. All I'm saying is that in spite of our crappy performance, it was still a close match.

How many other countries do you know where losing a freaking final is such a disappointment?

Being a Germany supporter isn't so bad after all. The first tournament that I can still remember was the Euro 88 where we got to the semis. Then there was the WC title in 1990. Then a final appearence in 92, the Euro title in 96, another final in 2002, coming in third at the World Cup in our own country and now another final. No other European country achieved that much during the last 20 years.

 

Trophy's are what counts, not finals appearances

 

Well, I saw the repeat on ESPN last night & I'm convinced our team was stoned. They didn't particularly mind casually passing back balls to the Spaniards in front of our own goal, no one looked particularly alarmed when that happened repeatedly. Nice attempt on goal by Metzelder, it would have been even better had he picked our opponent's goal instead of our own. Or would that have harshed his mellow?

The only thing Spain can be critized for was their pisspoor finishing, they should have been up by more than a goal by the end of the game.

Rossetti was a poor referee, lot's of goofy decisions all night long for both teams.

 

Here's the "Sportbild" player ratings:

http://www.sportbild.de/sportbild/generated/article/fussball/2008/06/29/9655200000.html

I agree with all ratings except for Podolski, who deserved a 5 as well.

 

Best analysis so far. And it explains so much!

But seriously, everytime Germany loses a final, I die a little bit inside. And this was the 2nd final in a row without even scoring a single goal.

The only thing that makes this not as hard is that it was so unbelievable deserved and that we don't have any rivalry with Spain. I mean noone really begrudges Spain this title.

To be honest the last ten minutes for me were the most disappointing, they were flat and had no means at all to score or even scare Spain.

 

Congratulations to Spain for a well-deserved win. They were the best team last night and the best team throughout the tournament. Congratulations to our boys who fought long and hard in Euro 08, were put threw their paces by the Austrians and Turks and emerged victorious on both occasions, and gave us a lot to cheer for. A big hurrah!

Now, let's get down to some post-match analysis and reflect on the tourney that's been.

Last night the better team won. Spain simply had more quality than Germany, as a team and individually. In fact, I remember thinking as I was watching the game, "their centerbacks are better than ours, their midfielders are better than ours, and their lone striker was better than ours." That about says it all.

I thought the Spanish were very organized and disciplined as a unit. They moved up and down the pitch in a tight 4-5-1 unit, and, except when they were harried by the Germans after the addition of Kuranyi, looked composed and calm, and in control of the match.

I think the high quality of the Spain meant that German players who had shone against weaker sides earlier looked very average last night. This is true of Podolski, Ballack, Frings, Friederich, Klose, and especially Metzelder and Mertesacker.

Special kudos to a player I used to hate but now love--Schweinsteiger. He played consistently well against quality opposition, including the Spanish. I thought he was our most creative and dangerous player last night. Pencil him in as our starting right midfielder from here on out to South Africa.

Unfortunately, it's hard to comment on Lahm because he was substituted at the half, probably due to an injury. Loew would be insane to sub him for any other reason. Torres was oportunistic and predatory, and so I can't fault Lahm. It was more an error in judgment rather than a lack of ability. Torres could have been called for a foul as he did make contact with Lahm.

Germany's glaring weakness in this tournament was its vanguard, the trifecta of Mertesacker, Metzelder, and Frings. Frings looks like he's lost more than a step; looks as if he's lost a leg. He is not the same player he was 2 years ago. He was regularly beat to the ball by opponents, lost to many challenges, and even simple passes went askew. Loew needs to give the Jones a serious look now. Metzelder was trying hard last night but he just doesn't have the quality, not in defence or attack. And to say that Mertesacker looked shaky is an understatement. Defenders should win one-on-ones easily most of the time, but each time Torres took a run at him, it looked as if he'd get beaten. He even got beat in the air on a regularly, which I can't understand for a guy so tall. He got progressively worse with each game. Honestly, after watching him for 90 minutes six times in the last month, I don't understand why so many are high on him. Can someone tell me why Mertesacker is such a great CB? Because I don't see it.

If I were Jogi the bear, I'd give Frings a big thank you and a bear hug, and then look to Jones. Metzelder, for all his effort, isn't going to get any better at this stage of his career, so I'd try out some other CB. Finally, Mertesacker can no longer be considered an untouchable; he hasn't demonstrated the quality to be deemed such. More than any other area of our game, I think Germany's vanguard of Merte, Metz, and Frings was our weakest link, and the first area that Jogi needs to look to improve.

I think Germany was strong in other areas. The flanks with Lahm and Schweini were a source of creativity and our strength; Podoski was alright. Every game, he had two or three threatening runs but then kind of drifted out of the game. He's better now than two years ago. I'm not bothered by Gomez not having a breakout tournament. I thought he wasn't utilized well. Ballack was fine, but I think he needs to play with higher quality players than with what we have, as his strength lies in his short passing game and playing on the periphery. Ballack's not the type of player who you can expert creativity or dazzling moves from.

And, finally, (I've run out of things to say and I'm getting tired) a special thanks to Jens Lehmann for saving the best for last. He's been a tremendous goalkeeper over the last two/three years for us, and a wonderful personality to have on the National Team.

Good on all the boys for their hard work and effort. Once again, Germany gave us so much to cheer for.

 

Trophies? We have 6!

 

Unfortunately it was not only the worst performance in a final but also the worst performance in a semi-final!

It's a mystery how that could happen after the good Portugal match...

 

Great post. I pretty much agree with everything you said.

I think defensive/holding mid is an issue. Loew needs to go with Rolfes or Jones (or both), going forward. I think Frings, at the international level, is done. He had a season of injuries, and never got back to full form. He has lost a step.

Metzelder and Mertesacker were very shakey, to say the least. Both are slow, and both are sloppy, and both can get caught napping. Trouble is, I don't see too many high quality young German center backs coming up. I think also that it's a bad idea to go with two slow moving redwood trees in the center. One is fine, but have a smaller, speedier, more tenacious guy to go with him.

Lehmann had a good final game, but was shakey throughout the rest of the tournament. I think, at 38, his international time is up. Time to go with Adler, Hildebrand, Enke, Weise, or others.

Klose had two decent goals, but was otherwise annonymous. Since going to Bayern, and being Robin to Toni's Batman, Klose has been in lesser form from his Bremen days. Gomez did not impress, but still has a lot of ability and I'm sure he'll be a star of the future.

Poldolski had a good tournament (3 goals, two assists). He was dangerous as a left/attacking midfielder. But being midfield, he needed to help with defense, which is not his strong suit.

This tournament was Schweini's breakout. He was superb - goals, assists, constant hustle, good running with and without the ball, creativity. Were was all that for Bayern during the regular season? Perhaps it was tactics and personnel mix.

 

Unfortunately that's true. Despite reaching the final, I fear that we ruined our improved image from 2006 with these 4 games (Croatia, Austria, Turkey and Spain)...

How I mentioned in another thread (and I don't care whether I get criticized for this or not), I rather lose a semi-final after a good performance (as happened against Italy 2 years ago) than winning it with an awful game and getting humiliated in the final then!

We have won enough trophies & reached so many finals in the past ... that I rather prefer good quality & entertaining soccer instead of boring effectiveness!

That's just my opinion.

 

So what did we do to the Portuguese? Don't you think that the key to surprise them and win the game was the flexibility to change the 4:4:2 to a 4:5:1 system?

Did you really expect Löw to switch back to the 4:4:2 against Turkey & Spain (who played a 4:5:1 as well) after we were outplayed by the Croatians in the 1st half?


Btw: This discussion should take place in the "Löw" thread and not here.

With the performance shown against Turkey, definitely NOT!

Believe me or not: I was a lot more proud after the semi-final loss 2006 than after our semi-final win 2008!

Well, maybe I've just another mentality (as being BMG fan...

I don't think that anybody has a problem with losing the final against such a great team like Spain! It's about the way we lost it!

In 2002, we lost the final as well ... but in contrast to last night, we played well and didn't get embarrassed!

C'mon, be realistic! He was a little bit better than Ballack & Podolski ... but still clearly below the level of the Portugal game! How many good shots, passes, cross balls & free-kicks did you see from him?

Don't think so!

His only shaky game was against Turkey!

 

I agree.

 

Could not agree more
Good post !!

 

I agree. Ballack is still the best player we have and he still has lots to offer. I can imagine him playing alongside a Jones or Rolfes in a continued 4-5-1.

 

I feel the same way. In 2006 we played with style, it was really a joy to watch. Being defeated in the semis was painful, but the other aspect made up for it.

During this tournament, we saw way too many square balls, in some games almost no movement off the ball, bad passing. It's disappointing, but not surprising that few neutrals came to this forum to wish us good luck before the final.

Some of the old stereotypes are obviously alive and well. You only need four bad games in a few days to breath new life into them.
Therefore the attacking style is the first thing we have to return to now, although I'm still puzzled why we lost it at some point.

 

The problem is that Ballack obvioulsy isn't a real playmaker for a 4:2:3:1, as he often prefers playing deeper and coming from the own half! However, as we noticed ... he was way too defensive in the 4:4:2 against Poland, Croatia and Poland!

In a 4:5:1, I'd play him this way in the future:


-------------Frings------------

----------Ballack

Schweini------Özil/Kroos-------Marin



But well, that's "off topic" in this thread.

Just read the international press after the semi-final and final...





Have a nice day/evening.

 

People who believed those stereotypes to begin with will never be convinced otherwise, not even if we put on a display like we did in '06.

Lets just hope, for the sake of the team and its real supporters, that Loew and Co. get back on track and figure out what went wrong and set it straight. They have a lot of work ahead of them in the next two years.

Maybe a call to Klinsi would be appropriate.

BTW, I agree with Borussia about Balkack's role in the 4-5-1, I'd love to see him in a more withdrawn role ahead of the DM and behind the attacking line.

 

People still want or even have the thought to consider Frings as a starter? Give it a rest guys, that guy should be done for the national team, absolutely terrible performance this Euro.

One thing that pissed me off a lot was the fact that the 2 announcers especially I think Andy Gray kept bashing Germany, espeically in the final. Everythign remianed between the retarded luck of Germany and incredible can do no flaws at all Spain. Their bitterness and so annoying, iwanted to mute it but others were watching with me. That seriously bothered me so much, as they exagerated everything, which will give people who don't know much about games make Andy Gray's ignorant biased opinion about Germany for the future.

 

Lol, you should have heard the German commentator.

 

Was this Jansen's mother? Insane.

 

He was terrible against Croatia & Austria ... but solid against Poland, Turkey and Spain (best German field player in the semi-final and final).

If Frings was awful, then tell me how Ballack has been (I noticed 1 good, 1 solid and 4 bad games).

Don't know what you mean.



Btw: I've just seen the final for a 2nd time. Damn, what a humiliation that was during the last 20 minutes...

 

He has not bossed the midfield in ONE game after first game where every German practically played good, even a terrible player like Fritz. He was aweful, his position is bad and he doesn't threaten the midfield. His passing hsa got to be worse than our CB, which really says a lot. He gets the ball and passes back. Frings best player in semi-final and final? I think there is no point to comment when someone makes such a comment. I guess the part where Spain completely ran the midfield appart really showed me Borussia just how GREAT he was in the final.....