Donovan Cut - is this the end of Landon?

Those are excellent names, and original. So much is illuminated by looking through a Jond'iced eye.

 

No, it's not "who is better out wide?" It's "Who is better, period?" Let's not move the goalposts.

In addition, let's nip this whole Davis thing in the bud here. Davis got on as a MF, and when Landon went out on the wing he did poorly last time. Landon at forward did well. That was where he played for the US in the GC, not out wide. He takes a spot from Wondo/AJ/Dempsey/Jozy. The Julian Green gripe at least makes sense, assuming that you assume that he was part of roster spots 20-23, or ones that don't really play, in which case you can give those to anyone. The Brad Davis one makes much less sense.

 

Not as excellent as the names I named earlier today, but I don't mind a compliment.

 

So some of you are saying the guy can't take a break after 15 years on? He took a break, came back and things were rosey so wtf is the problem? Oh because he's fatso vs. Mexico.

He was so fat, the team photo was taken from satellite.

 

Well, since nobody has actually said that in several days -- and then again, only a small few; most ppl have been saying that they merely understand where JK might be coming from, which is quite different from what the majority of posters were saying at the time --, maybe you can revive one of the threads about his sabbatical, quote a shitload of posters and call them to task. Sure... it might take a while, but it'd be worth it.

Well, "rosey" is being generous.

He came back from winter off season a little heavy for him, which I'm sure set off alarm bells for his coaches, both club and country. Then he wasn't very productive for club.

Again. You can justify his club performance left and right. I'm a Galaxy fan, so I know that the schedule hasn't been conducive to the team getting its groove on. He's played several different positions. I have been convinced by a poster here that he was actually pacing himself in preparation for the WC.

But going back to what a former NFL player friend of mine told me -- the guy that said you have to pace pride tests like the beep tests in order to maximize career longevity: it's a major pet peeve of coaches when players do not show up to training camp out of shape. It immediately puts you in the dog house. Plus, you start off behind. It just smacks of unprofessionalism.

Can you at least admit that? That showing up less than stellar shape to AZ wasn't a wise move in the eyes of the coaching staff?


note: my buddy built his career studying longevity in the NFL. At *age 17* he figured out that if he were to make the NFL, he would have to switch from running back (less than 3 years in the league on average and essentially deformed for life) to safety b/c even with the lower salary the lengthened career makes up the difference (I think also bc of players retirement pay is scaled, with major jumps after 5 years.)

note, vol.2: he also noticed a correlation btw short careers from guys whose entire life revolved around the sport vs. guys who led a balanced life. Basically, coaches can turn on a player on a dime. So if you go from being a coach's favorite to all of a sudden being in the dog house, if your entire life is football, those guys have meltdowns.

Whereas guys who have a full life can go home, leave work behind, get their minds on other things, and show up to work the next day renewed. They're more likely to last through the ups and downs.

This guy stayed in the NFL 9 or 10 yrs. Frickin' brilliant professional.

I bring all this up b/c it backs up LD's need to find a "balanced life". Again. I was one of the few who supported Landon back during the walk-about...

 

One thing that somehow hasn't been mentioned in this thread yet is the exact nature of the injury Donovan has been struggling with this spring: tendinitis. The physicians around here can correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding is that tendinitis is an overwork injury. So Landon might have been better off if he went to Cambodia again this year.

 

Not a physician; I have no physical therapy background.

But. Professional athletes by definition overwork their bodies.

 

Gotta recover well. Many athletes have strict dietary and workout regimens during their season to try and avoid those kind of injuries while maintaining top form. It's a balancing act, because on one hand you want to build up strength and stamina, you have to go all out over and over again, week in week out, and on the other hand you're also going to need to try and rest up so that you don't injure yourself.

 

What I am saying is that all the reasons that many people are giving to support the decision are simply not legit. Even JK seems to agree, by saying weird things like most coaches would take Donovan.

So its a bigger issue. It might end up being a good decision, but right now with what we know, I just don't see it as anything close to a reasonable or defensible decision.

Only a few last brave posters are holding the line that this some how makes actual soccer sense,a nd half of them admit we should have taken Donovan.

But, I understand what you are saying and its a good point.

We may never know why Donovan got cut. I think I am just trying to cut away at the invented answers.

People are trying to make

Good point. It started on Bigsoccer as a wat to read through the lines of what JK meant and why he was cut.

So its more a rejoinder against those saying at the begining of the issue that he was someone fat and out of shape.

 

And Gulati finally speaks.

Says the decision had to be a hard one, but the team needs to move on for the sake of the WC.

Then says the goal is to get out of the group. When pressed on JK's contract, he says the contract is there to create some stability, but is not a free pass for this WC. Goal is to advance from group... if that doesn't happen, they have to re-evaluate.

My gloss.

Not necessarily a glowing endorsement... if you break it down what I hear is: JK better get out of the group if he wants to keep his job.

I also have to believe that Gulati has been feeling the pressure as well since Donovan was dropped, from friends who are sponsor, donors, and other higher ups in US Soccer.

I still believe that this was a move by JK to impose himself and his vision over what he sees as the weaknesses of the entire US Soccer system. Its a big gambit, but if he gets us out of the group, and if he does something special, he has proven his point. I think he knows that if he doesn't he is out. He is all in, which you have to admire on one level. My worry is that he overestimates his own abilities.

 

I agree Bruce can be a bit of a jerk, my point being the precedence of him basically passive-agressively criticizing JK. I think however Bruce is probably spot on in his assessment.

I also find it interesting that a former coach would criticize the current coach in such a way, I believe that is unprecedented in the US.

Things to think about.

 

Well, Bruce is a brusque guy, and kind of a jerk, so he's certainly not the kind of person that would pull punches when talking about a guy who just left off his star player! The 'unprecedented' part is a little misleading. We've only had a couple of NT coaches since 1990, and not all of them did well (and as such would never think about criticizing a former coach because of a lack of cache for their opinion) and Bob Bradley is way too professional and focused elsewhere to care too much about JK's decision-making. Bruce is pretty much the only other guy with enough NT success to justify himself even talking about another NT coach.

 

Of course he's pitted against the weakest link.
Had this squad been made up out of 12 players, the discussion would be 'why Bedoya, Diskerud, Zusi or Altidore were picked over Donavan'.

I would pick Donavan over Jozy-in his current form. But why would I leave Jozy for Donavan when we have Brad Davis in the squad?

 

You'd take 24 guys to the WC?

But seriously, who would you leave at home? (I'd like to start a couple of threads about that)

 

Can you speak more to this statement?

What are those "weaknesses" that JK sees?

And how how does JK's roster for WC2014 impose his vision to address those "weaknesses"?

How does Donovan, or any player on the 23 or 30 lists, specifically fit into this?

Certainly the "weaknesses" (and the "vision" designed to correct/address them) are bigger than any one player (or manager), right?

 

Wtf.

Like Donovan is the only player pacing himself for the WC? Seriously? We don't know this happens like, every WC year?

 

Here's the thing:

Nobody is supporting The Decision here outside of a small group of posters who come in and bail after one post.

Explaining the logic behind The Decision doesn't mean you support the decision, just like when a doctor explains the biology of a specific form of cancer doesn't mean the doctor is pro-cancer.

 

Take it up with Jurgen. Write your Congressman.

 

The kind of person who would even have an opinion on another person's happiness is the kind of person whose opinion is worthless.

LANDON IS NOT YOUR SLAVE.

I hope that most of the people attacking Landon and defending Jurgen aren't the kind of people who think Landon is their slave. But I think I'm probably wrong about that.

Just because many, many fans have a completely wrong-headed understanding of their relationship to star players is no reason for the rest of us, the sane, to go along with it.

 

It seemed to have been more like 50/50. At least on these boards.

 

Who is attacking Landon? I'm just not seeing it on these boards.

I'm seeing ppl understanding where JK is coming from, ppl attempting to take an objective, global view of the entirety of the sabbatical and its fallout.

But I'm not seeing many attacks on LD, other than criticism for saying what he said late last week b/c it was a distraction in their view.

P-lenty of attacks on Klinsi, but he's a coach, so it goes with the territory.

 

"Landycakes is a pussy", "Donavan is a slacker", etc.

 

Looking forward to the USMNT and Galaxy games today. Here are the conditions under which I will let this issue go, give Jurgen props and move on:

1. USMNT shows well AND Landon is less than stellar.

OR

2. Either Julian Green or Brad Davis plays better for the USMNT than Landon plays for the Galaxy.

To me, either of those combinations indicate that Jurgen may well have made the right call and his decisions should be accepted and respected. Proof is in the pudding.

 

Link to a post in this thread?

 

bigsoccer.com/forum