Bedoya: "Congress, Do Something Now, End Gun Violence"

Discussion in 'San Jose OT' started by don gagliardi, Aug 5, 2019.

  1. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
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    Maybe go back to interpreting the second amendment like it was before the NRA took over one of the two political parties (I won't name the party to avoid being political) and got them to blame everything from video games to mental health (apparently not problems elsewhere)...

    How the NRA Rewrote the Second Amendment

    "A fraud on the American public.” That’s how former Chief Justice Warren Burger described the idea that the Second Amendment gives an unfettered individual right to a gun. When he spoke these words to PBS in 1990, the rock-ribbed conservative appointed by Richard Nixon was expressing the longtime consensus of historians and judges across the political spectrum.
    ..
    Four times between 1876 and 1939, the U.S. Supreme Court declined to rule that the Second Amendment protected individual gun ownership outside the context of a militia.​
     
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  2. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
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    That's a great polemic, but the history and "correct" interpretation of the Second Amendment is more complicated.

    Here's the seminal, now 30-year-old, Yale Law Journal article on the subject from a highly-regarded and very liberal University of Texas law professor. It provides a more sober and nuanced view, absent the current partisan fractiousness.

    https://digitalcommons.law.yale.edu...le.com/&httpsredir=1&article=7254&context=ylj
     
  3. SoccerMan94043

    SoccerMan94043 Member+

    May 29, 2003
    San Jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    My brain hurts. I don't come to BS to learn about history, I come for the BS :p
     
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  4. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    I blame Bedoya. :)
     
  5. SoccerMan94043

    SoccerMan94043 Member+

    May 29, 2003
    San Jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I've watched him play... he offers plenty of BS. So he's all good in my book.
     
  6. MtnGardener

    MtnGardener Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Jul 21, 2017
    Okay. The Mods say this isn't political. But how is this not in the "OT" forum: https://www.bigsoccer.com/forums/san-jose-ot.964/

    This is NOT Quakes related. I say it isn't there because some people want it here because they are attempting to get more eyes on it. I say put it where it belongs. I don't come here for social discourse on any topic.
     
  7. markmcf8

    markmcf8 Member+

    Oct 18, 1999
    Vancouver, WA, USA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    What about beer? Don't we like to discuss beer?

    And do we have a constitutional right to drink beer? (Yes we do. It's in the tenth amendment!)

    And don't we talk about parking lots? And food trucks? And the quality of the stadium? And the lousy alleged music that the DJ plays?

    That said, I see your point. However, we are having a moment as a nation, and the ability to discuss these issues in an open public forum is a crucial piece of our democracy. So ... I willing to let this discussion slide.

    We desperately need to do something about guns in our society. We have way too many mass shootings in this country.

    Go Quakes!!
    Be safe Quakesfans!!

    - Mark
     
  8. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
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    More like the 21st Amendment (repeal of Prohibition). :)
     
  9. markmcf8

    markmcf8 Member+

    Oct 18, 1999
    Vancouver, WA, USA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The repeal of prohibition was excellent, and a restoration of our rights. However:

    The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.​

    That's really ridiculously broad and includes an enormous raft of liberties, rights, and freedoms. Basically, we're free to do as we want, provide we don't infringe anyone else's rights.

    In any case, we need to do something about gun violence in our nation. I'll conceed that most gun owners are responsible folks, but clcearly some are not. And as a friend of mine likes to ask: "Why do need to be able to kill things?"

    Go Quakesfans!!

    - Mark
     
  10. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #35 xbhaskarx, Aug 8, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2019
    Looks like the whole mass shootings problem has been solved...

    The problem of not enough video of crowds fawning over Trump that is:

    WaPo:
    During El Paso hospital visit, Trump compared his and O’Rourke’s crowd sizes at political rallies, video shows



    Beto is such a loser he didn't even inspire any white supremacists to gun down crowds of innocent civilians... sad!



    The video really strikes the right tone after a weekend of carnage.
     
  11. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
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    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
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    San Jose Earthquakes
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    #36 xbhaskarx, Aug 8, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2019
    You urban elites just don't seem to understand that in rural areas REAL Americans needs to be able to gun down 30-50 feral hogs before they can slaughter innocent children (so within 3-5 minutes)...







    1158490154090188802 is not a valid tweet id


     
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  12. TyffaneeSue

    TyffaneeSue moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 15, 2003
    Upstairs
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Moved to OT -- cause while I agree that this is an important topic, it's not specifically Quakes-related. Don't hate me! Hate the system.
     
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  13. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
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    You quote the 10th Amendment concerning the powers reserved to the States, whereas I believe you meant to cite the 9th Amendment: "The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people." (Emphasis added).
     
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  14. markmcf8

    markmcf8 Member+

    Oct 18, 1999
    Vancouver, WA, USA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    As yes, thanks. I must be getting old. Damn!

    And yeah, OT is fine for this topic.
     
  15. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Nothing can be done, both parties the same, etc.







     
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  16. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
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    We have the actual numbers for the deadliest mass shootings in modern US history:

    --7 of the 40 deadliest mass shootings since 1949 occurred in 10 years before 1994 assault weapons ban

    --2 occurred in 10 years the ban was in effect

    --13 occurred in the first 10 years after ban expired

    --13 occurred in the last 5 years​

    Now fact check Republican ideas to prevent mass shootings, like
    -not enough thoughts and prayers
    -video games
    -not enough prayer in schools, not enough saluting the flag
    -mental illness (after making it easier for the mentally ill to get guns)
    etc.
    etc.
    ********ing
    etc.
     
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  17. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    #43 don gagliardi, Aug 8, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2019
    As I suspected, the data is cherry-picked. There is no magic to 1949, apart from the fact the Smithsonian falsely attributes the first mass shooting to that year.
    There were many mass shootings predating 1949 (and probably others unaccounted for in the statistics you cite prior to and while the 1994 legislation was in effect.)

    . . . Three years ago, Smithsonian magazine ran an article headlined “The Story of the First Mass Murder in U.S. History.” It was an account of World War II combat veteran Howard Unruh, who in 1949 went on a 20-minute “walk of death,” as one newspaper called it, indiscriminately shooting neighbors in his Camden, N.J., neighborhood with a German Luger. Before his capture, Unruh killed 13 people and wounded three.

    It was a shocking tragedy, and the Smithsonian article is riveting. But it wasn’t the first mass murder in U.S. history. Or the second, or the third, or the fourth, or the fifth. It wasn’t even the only mass shooting in that decade. There were at least two others.

    In the 1930s, there were two more mass shootings, which followed a psychotic farmer’s 1927 attack on a Bath, Mich., schoolhouse . . . [and so on]


    https://www.realclearpolitics.com/a...rica_anatomy_of_a_hyped_statistic_137960.html

    https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/story-first-mass-murder-us-history-180956927/

    Mind you, I'm not arguing with you about your underlying point that reviving an assault weapon ban would be beneficial (assuming it passes constitutional muster). What I am suggesting is that you be more skeptical of the stuff you read. Seemingly hard data is often (usually?) false.
     
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  18. TyffaneeSue

    TyffaneeSue moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 15, 2003
    Upstairs
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    A 20-minute walk of death...that killed 13 people. That's not even fathomable now. 900 gunned down in Las Vegas in ten minutes. Ordinary shmoes have access to killing machines...does anyone (other than the NRA) really think that the founders of this country had that in mind when they wrote the Bill of Rights?
     
  19. FUAEG

    FUAEG Member+

    Oct 18, 2005
    San Jose
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    San Jose Earthquakes
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    Absolutely. The founders wanted Ordinary shmoes (as part of a militia) to have access to weapons of war (killing machines) to overthrow a tyrannical government.

    A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
     
  20. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    And perhaps the El Paso shooting, as well. Reportedly, the perpetrator's own mother called the police to express concerns about his fitness to own a gun a few weeks before the massacre.

    https://www.cnn.com/2019/08/07/us/el-paso-crusius-gun-warning/index.html
     
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  21. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
  22. SoccerMan94043

    SoccerMan94043 Member+

    May 29, 2003
    San Jose
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    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  23. mjlee22

    mjlee22 Quake & Landon fan

    Nov 24, 2003
    near Palo Alto, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The Timbers posted a statement about the MLS ban of the iron front symbol that has been appropriated by antifa. I’m not exactly sure what this statement says, but I think they are allowing people to wear t-shirts and pins with the symbol but banners and flags are not allowed?

    Anyhow, I’m posting this here because the statement at least explains the difference between political and human rights issues, where i think they are equating gun control with human rights.

    I am hoping you lawyerly types can better explain this in plainer language...
     

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