Autism and vaccines

I think the connection between Autism and vaccines is so strong in the minds of many, despite very limited evidence, because of the temporal relationship between the typical age of onset of Autism and the typical age of vaccinations. There is a temporal relationship, but this does not infer a causal relationship.

One of the main arguments for a causal relationship purports that mercury found in some vaccines is the culprit. However, this does not seem valid as mercury levels in vaccines and other products are lower now than ever, but rates of Autism appear to be increasing.

I certainly don't pretend to have the answer, but I do not believe that vaccines cause Autism. Could the stress of a vaccine trigger Autism in a person genetically predisposed for Autism? I think it probably could, as could many other stressors, such as an illness.

As a final remark, know that when you say "Autism" it may mean different things to different people. There is a diagnosis of Autism, but people also refer to Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD), which would include other diagnoses, such as Asperger's Disorder.

 

Never underestimate the power of people wanting an explanation no matter how far-fetched when faced with a complete unknown. Autism is a scary disease - no known cause and no known cure. People in uncontrolled situations are latching onto something that they can point to and say "that must be the culprit".

So instead of preventing known diseases that range from mild to debilitating to fatal, people are focusing on a fear of the unknown. I'd say, you shouldn't gamble with your child's life and get them vaccinated against known horrors such as polio and measles.

While I would debate about the US vaccination schedule (four shots at once is pretty traumatic) versus the European vaccination schedule (spreading the shots out over time and fewer of most vaccines), there is no reasonable argument against vaccination based on scientific literature.

 

a huge debate in my house. Not sure what I think yet. I've got books, searched the web. I can't come up with an opinion that I stick with.

 

What scientific evidence have you found for the pro side of the debate?

 

scientific evidence that vaccination is good? 60% of children under the age of 10 in Sweden contracted pertussis (whooping cough) during the 15 year period following 1979 when immunization was suspended. only about 20 children died, because of effective medical oversight, but pertussis claims about 300K deaths a year in developing countries.

 

Sorry.. pro vaccines causing autism.

 

cool.

the standard riff is that there used to be an incidence of autism on the order of 1 in 1500. now the incidence is 1 in 150. the inference is made that immunizations have increased in numbers -- we used to immunize against 8-10 diseases; now we immunize against twice that number -- so the amount of bad stuff that is in vaccines, mercury-based compounds in particular, have caused the autism problem.

btw, i'm not using exact numbers, just rough estimates to demonstrate the situation in broad terms.

there is some conspiracy theory going on here. anti-vaccination folks argue that the drug companies are cutting corners and there is too much money involved to trust that the oversight is making sure that the vaccines are safe.

 

Yes, we in the west are over medicated, over vacinated, and I believe it is ruining the next generations mental and physical health, the kids generally now look weaker than the ones I grew up with, they dont seem to have as much life, or vitality about them.

Two of my sisters 3 kids have autism, one badly, the other one slightly, and for this she blames early vacinations done at hospital without her consent.

New parents out there, dont let these so called caring nurses ever take your baby off you.
Just have the kid, cut the cord, wash his/her body give it a feed and a nap, get dressed and then just get the hell out of there.

Women used to give birth to their youngsters in the backs of wagons as they trundled across the prairys, no vacinations, no 5 days in bed, they just had the kid, and they turned out mostly well enough.

 

I don't know for sure if vaccinations do cause autism. Celebrities like Jenny McCarthy have been roundly criticized by the established medical community in the US for saying that they absolutely do cause autism. I DO know that vaccinations have saved millions of lives all over the globe and prevented a lot of needless suffering - like my uncle who had polio and was affected for life. That is good enough for me. All my kids have been vaccinated.

I saw a family on tv with 4 kids and each had autism to one degree or another. That just screams "inherited" to me. But again, I'm no doctor.

People in the "good old days" also lived to age 50 if they were lucky and died from horrible things like TB.

 

well that autism is increasing alot, so somethings causing it, if not vaccinations, then what?

 

Yeah, the ones who lived past age 5.

 

Or we have better diagnosis. It used to be that kids who were autistic were called "stupid" or "retarded" or "insane" or (being generous) "special". And that was just the ones that got diagnosed. I can remember a neighbor's little brother was just called "slow". Sweet kid, just a bit "slow".

Look behind the statistics before being entranced by them.

 

You ask a simple question for which there is no simple answer. You could write a dissertation or four trying to answer that question. But I’ll try to provide some very basic information…

First, your basic premise that “autism is increasing a lot” needs to be clarified. Yes, the number of individuals diagnosed with autism has increased each year. However, an increase in diagnostic frequency does not necessarily mean an increase in the prevalence of the condition. For example, currently, Autistic Disorder is conceptualized as a single condition within the larger autism spectrum, which includes Autistic Disorder, Asperger’s Disorder, Pervasive Developmental Disorder, and others. Therefore, because more diagnoses are under the rubric of autism, the number of cases increases. Also, society in general is more diagnosis conscious… 15 years ago, Uncle Fred was eccentric, now he has Asperger Disorder (“high-functioning” autism); Cousin Billy was mentally retarded, now he is an individual with Autistic Disorder and low adaptive functioning.

Some of the increase has to do with awareness… 20 years ago autism wasn’t a hot topic. It was not a diagnosis that was on the minds of primary care physicians, special ed teachers, and mental health professionals, so kids were diagnosed with ADHD, Bipolar, learning disabilities, emotionally disturbances, etc., rather than autism. Many who were diagnosed with Childhood Schizophrenia back in the 1970s would be diagnosed with an Autism Spectrum Disorders today.

There are numerous other reasons, specific to autism, why the diagnostic rates have increased. I am not saying that the prevalence of autism has not increased, maybe is has. I am stating that there are numerous not-so-obvious factors involved in the “simple” statement “autism is increasing a lot.”

Second, let’s look at the last half of your statement: “if not vaccinations, then what?” Well, if I had the answer to that question, or the related question of “What causes autism?” I would not only be able to help countless families in dire need of assistance, I would be filthy rich, so don’t expect anything conclusive. The truest answer is that nobody knows. Part of the problem is that the diagnosis of an Autism Spectrum Disorder is based on the behavioral presentation (e.g., communication skills, social skills, repetitive motor movements, etc.), rather than the underlying cause (chromosomal abnormalities, congenital infections, brain injuries, etc.). Therefore, there are likely numerous etiologies for “autism.”

It would be nice if there were just a single cause of autism spectrum disorders, such as mercury or thimerosol in vaccines or allergic reactions to gluten, but the data do not support these hypotheses.

 

I'm sorry but this post reeks of ignorance. Your sister is not a scientist, her 'diagnosis' means nothing except that she has no idea what causes these diseases...

What you said about women in wagons... Yeh, infectious diseases used to kill millions upon millions of people every year. Ever heard of smallpox? How about polio? These diseases were eradicated using vaccination. If you don't vaccinate your children you are putting them under serious risk and putting others under serious risk as well.

Your little anecdotal evidence is pretty stupid as well, people are dying more of lifestyle related diseases, yes thats true, but health and over all life expectancy has increased in the past century, not decreased...

 

Well, that is what most of us do, wait until a problem that seems so largely hypothetical becomes our own.

Part of the fear that inoculations-may-cause-autism engenders is because becoming a parent makes you feel soooo vulnerable. I'm generally pretty confident, I don't regret much in my life (though I would probably be more successful if I did regret some of my boners), and yet, having a kid makes you second guess yourself. We've got this little life that we are supposed to grow and nuture and mature, and autism is so scary, that anecdotal stories can make us lose all rationality.

I'm pretty much past that stage of life. My kids are 13 and 11. My youngest has Aspergers, pretty mild, but enough that we send him to a special school. I don't second guess myself about the innoculations, but on particularly sad days for my son, I sometimes wonder....

What is funny though, is hyper-protective parents who don't inoculate and escort their kids to every playdate through their teens, and yet let their kids start driving. Even encourage it (so that the parents don't have to drive so much). Much more causal relationship between death and teen driving than their is between inoculations and autism.

 

I won't let my kids play with other kids who don't have their shots.

 

Do you actually ask, or do you steer your kids away from parents you know have made this sort of a public declaration?

 

If, in fact, the kids today are weaker and have less "life" and "vitality about them" it probably has much more to do with diet than with medicine. As others have pointed out, the population is healthier overall, with a longer lifespan. However, there is no doubt that kids today eat far more processed foods than in decades past. This is one way in which we are probably less healthy than decades ago--but on balance, I'll take modern medicine and vaccinations over the "good ol' days"

 

Steer away. Luckily, for some reason, parents who don't believe in vaccination feel the need to tell you all about it. I've never asked. I've seen first hand what the lack of vaccinations can do to a person. It blows my mind that parents would deliberately choose to not vaccinate.

Yes, I know there are some kids who are allergic to a vaccine. That of course is a special case.

 

Ain't that the truth? I think parents inherently know the risk, and while I disagree with the logic behind making the no-vaccines call, I get the feeling that in making their decision something of a crusade, they have to re-convince themselves.

I mean, let's say you do you fervently believe that vaccinations cause autism. What a scary choice to have to make as a parent: polio or autism. That would keep me awake most nights, I can tell you.

 

Vaccine-Autism Study Is Retracted.

I can't quite tell if this is the genesis of the meme or not.

 

Nah too much vacinations now, too much immunisation way too much, its just weakening our immune systems, were meant to get sick now and then, so our bodys build up immunity through the attacks to help it combat a serious threat to it.
When that superbug does come along some day, generation Y will probably get annihilated by it.
Agreed about the processed foods, kids dont get enough healthy fruit and fibre into them now, if it was in my power all fast food franchises in Australia would close tomorrow never to reopen, no more KFC's, mcD's, HJ's, Pizza Hut or Krusty Cremes.

Also kids now dont exercise as much, and are encouraged to give up when it gets too hard, competitiveness which creates the champions, is discouraged by the silly no losers mentality now taught at schools.
Australia is fast heading for a generation majority of fat weak physically hopeless kids, were probably halfway there already with gen Y.