Was not aware one existed. Not attempting to put a thumb anywhere but thought it worth noting that there is alot of "condensed soccer" out there that is not futsal. Like anything, most importantly soccer or anything else do the work and find someone you consider a good teacher. We do not have anyone teaching solid "wall ball" stuff in my area, if we did I' sure we would have given a try.
A lot of kids when under high pressure in the indoor wall game have a tendency to take the easy way out. Meaning pass to no one the no one is to a wall. It much better to try to figure out a way for your team to heep position of the ball. To do that you need team mates to pass to and you need moves to help you hold the ball longer until you can pass or dribble by some one. If you saw the US v Mexico game the Mexicans always tried to beat at least their first defender. That alone creates space for a team mate then you make a pass or try to beat another defender or shoot.
Well, the wall-ball vs. futsal debate exists, but it's pretty one-sided. The soccer powers that be have declared futsal to be among the best training tools available for developing players and, as a result, futsal leagues are spreading like wild fire. Many elite (and even not-so-elite) clubs are going so far as to build their very own futsal facilities to ensure that this resource is available to their players. I'm not sold on futsal. In fact, I have several issues with it. Although I think it is true that good players are good at futsal, I do not believe it follows that playing futsal makes you a good player. Rather, success in futsal requires ball skills, so those who have great ball skills find success in futsal and those who do not struggle at it. I do believe that training (though not necessarily playing games) on a low friction surface creates a natural incentive to keep the ball under close control, but I believe that incentive can be manufactured in other settings through positive feedback by coaches. The ball skills that make players excel at futsal can and should be taught in all forms of soccer. Other problems with futsal include: (1) the vast majority of kids I have talked to do not find it to be very fun, especially when compared to other forms of outdoor and indoor soccer; (2) playing on a hard surface is far less safe than on a cushioned surface; (3) I'm not crazy about kids kicking a weighted ball due to concerns with joint injuries. To me, futsal is a fine thing to do if the weather prevents you from being outside and the only training surface available to you is a basketball court. But if I have an indoor turf field available to me, that's where I am training my team.
Thank you for extrapolating on your ideas of futsal. I hear a lot of parents who seem predisposed to not like futsal so I welcome someone who will list their concerns etc. "wall ball" where I am is not serious at all. Its the fun leagues after work etc. or the blowing off steam not so serious crowd plays. Whereas the futsal culture has been preserved by the Italians and Portuguese so it is far more prevalent as a teaching tool not to mention the more committed kids migrate that way. I honestly do not have much experience with your (1), rather the opposite, kids are on fire to play sometimes to the detriment of their outside game, so much so that it is starting to be a more year round endeavor as in California and other places. I find more parents dont like futsal which is fine I just typically do not hear well stated reasons. (2) Yes. Its played tough, physical, and with a ton of emotion. Mainly my reason for saying it could be helpful to develop aggression. Four guys and a goalie you will find out quickly who your mates are, that ball comes hard and fast and your best defense is to man up and close quick. I like the skills of the pro teams that have futsal as a mainstay of their development. The US has gigantic issues with off the ball movement\intelligence so I think that is why you are seeing all the MLS academies employing futsal.
Interesting. Futsal is a relatively new phenomenon where I live. People have played indoor soccer on basketball courts in my area for decades (before we got our first indoor wall-ball facility, but no one called it futsal and it wasn't played using a futsal ball or futsal rules. I'd say "futsal" started to take root around here about five years ago, around the same time I started hearing lots of talk about it online. When you say that "kids are on fire to play" futsal, are you referring to the masses or to the highly skilled players? In my more limited experience, I find that the highly skilled players enjoy it far more since it plays more to their strengths.
Masses no. Where I live, mostly the only soccer playing populace, though the "better" rooted established teams have some kids that are only futsal players. Here you need to go indoors and play this time of year and I think its a welcome switch for a lot of guys. Great coaches, competitive leagues and tournies have added to the excitement for kids, but the immigrant base has always kept a healthy presence in the area. Maybe the wall ball thing is more prevalent where there were semi pro leagues, I saw recently that Christian Pulisic's father played on a pro team (attached clip). Actually better to the point. Have children watch Christian P play for an example of the proper aggression in soccer. Love the way he gets after it. Small guy with the beast inside him.
Getting used to physical play is important. (That said, U9-U12 refs in Northern Virginia, please feel free to call fouls every once in a while.) It's one of the big differences between Adu and Messi. Adu's skills were superb, but the slightest challenge could disrupt him. I've seen Messi make a great pass, run with a guy draped all over him and score.
Recall there was a discussion on how small U-little's fields are now. Well, futsal courts even smaller and the whole point is to develop faster game speed. Several people here disagree with my position that smaller the field the better for development. It probably has to do with style of play. We're in SoCal and vast majority of teams play possession-based soccer and hardly no one plays over the top or direct style of soccer. If playing possession based soccer, making decision under pressure and in tight spaces are paramount. Soccer is a series of small space game played on a big field. Ball skills can be developed in various conditions but futsal provides rapid game speed like no other. When played properly, it forces the players to make tight and accurate passes and make decisions under constant pressure. Touches has to be clean and soft to control the ball as well as mastering one-touch passes. As for injuries, I've never seen any serious injury on futsal court (not to say that it doesn't happen). I see far more injuries on a regular soccer fields. By similar logic, might you find basketball just as dangerous ?
Yes indeed. Strongly agree with your possession based observations. My sons club is a possession based outpost in the Northeast and they actually do not offer futsal yet everyone joins teams on their own.
I like this point if only, cuz your skills guys can occassionally have a reputation of not playing both ways. Your Messi\Ronaldo type talents.. Yet pay attention to the level of nastiness that these guys have to endure from opposing defenders. Yes they are skilled beyond all get out but they have to be tough as nails. The truth about soccer here is that it gets real tough early. IMO a lot of clubs put heavy emphasis on physicality over teaching skills.
... and since many refs tend not to call anything, that physicality spirals into excessive physicality and is usually rewarded with wins (especially at the younger ages). How often have I heard a British-accented coach yell at his players to "work harder/more work rate!!" which is actually just code for "foul more!!" (with impunity) Apologies, feeling cynical this morning!
Pretty spot on, actually. Refs who don't call infractions in youth games that they deem "trifling" are doing a huge disservice to everyone. I see refs ignoring things like foul throws, stiff arming, etc. The problem is that this incentivizes the players to commit these kinds of fouls. Call the damn foul throw every single time, please. Good youth coaches aren't spending valuable practice time drilling the kids on throw ins. We are counting on the kids learning that through trial and error in the games. My team never gets called for foul throws and I have to be the one to yell out "keep both feet on the ground, Johnny!" Then my team sees the other team's thrower jump into the air and hurl the ball a full 10 yards further than he could accomplish legally, and they say to themselves "Hey, that's what I should do if the ref isn't bothering to call it!" Same thing, but much worse, when it comes to physical fouls, like pushing, shoving and stiff arming. Make the calls and give the players the proper incentives to play by the rules or the game is going to spin out of control, quickly.
From jump, all I have wanted is for the calls\infractions to be consistent.. I also want rules enforced if only because the kids know the rules... A pass back to the keeper that is not called I will hear about all night...(ie if it was called last week on us, and we lose the game every kid will remember and want it called in the future).We have played in two separate leagues but several competitions and my sole consistent gripe is consistency of which there has been very little. Also little to no yellow cards or warnings at all..again this plays to teams that play on the edge and if there is a foul but nothing for persistent fouling it is advantageous for teams to ride that line for all its worth. Do not get me wrong I want good challenges, I want physicality the right way but all of the above has been in short supply.
Agreed, but your emphasis on consistency is misplaced. If the ref is "consistently" calling nothing, the advantage goes to the team that fouls more, creating an incentive for both teams to out-foul each other. So the emphasis should be on consistent enforcement of the LOTG, not merely on consistency. Especially at the youngest ages. I think older kids and adults can say to themselves, "Huh, this ref is allowing foul throws. I'm going to play by these new rules for just this one game," in a way that little kids can't and, frankly, shouldn't. I'm not going to tell ten year olds to exploit the fact that the ref isn't calling certain fouls. I don't think you can ever tell a 10 year old to commit an infraction on purpose without a big risk of sending the wrong message.
The biggest issue to me is safety. The occasional offside call is going to be botched, and we can all live with that. But I'm more worried about the obvious forearm shiver to the back of someone's head that goes uncalled. I'd rather not have 10-year-olds with concussions. That said, I'm still baffled by the ref not calling an obvious back pass. (Happened in one of my kid's games, too.) They're supposed to learn, right?
I am much more about "consistent" from 50,000 ft. My expectations are very low. League refs get somewhere close on how you are going to "interpret" off sides etc. You have to understand where I am coming from, I only state from experience..Literally announced before games weather the ref was going to call off sides week to week (some weeks for "teaching purposes" called in one half not the other,((again this is intentional by design)). I have great understanding and patience but also a very,very low bar. An example, town\rec\travel...Infractions from behind are not called, so the message is...Nothing called. At least the expectation for the kids is set.
I get that you have low expectations; I do too. But I think having expectations set that the ref isn't going to call (or at least isn't going to card) bad fouls is about as bad of a problem as you can possibly have. Because the lesson to be learned from that is "foul at will," and then we are dependent on coaches to exercise discipline over their own teams, even if the other team isn't playing along. This is my weekly battle and it really sucks. I will never stop telling my kids to play by the rules, but we pay for doing so on the scoreboard.
On mastering one touch passing. To make a good one touch pass you have to get a good one touch pass. Futsal it is easier to get a good one touch pass then it is in the outdoor game.
Strongly agree here. Look into the quality of futsal heavy structures ie Barca and Zagreb, the all around quality. Tight spaces in the final third, quick decision making, balls played advantageously to the next man. Admittedly Im a huge futsal advocate but every time I see the final ball played through by Barca, I always say that guy played futsal. Conversely when I see the ball lift after every pass and reluctance to see anyone settle things, I say these guys could use some futsal. Probably unfair but I have seen too many kids benefit I am insanely biased. Find a good teacher, give it 6 months to a year...If you think its dangerous, then try just training with someone.
When you say 6 months to a year, are you advocating playing futsal just during the winter or during the outdoor season as well?
I was more saying give it six months to a year of playing to see the rewards. Our current seasons are end of October to March, basically once the outdoor Spring regular soccer season begins. Play as much as your player wants, I believe you are from NJ as you probably have more year round options. We also look for a futsal camp or two in the summer but really just do the winter presently. We have played futsal for 3 years with roughly the same crew and I describe the experience as exponential in growth of player. We have played the NJ regional and Kansas also and hopefully this year travel to California for nationals... I would not be doing any of it if the kids were not 100% into it. Again, do the homework, try to find a group with solid base and a good history. Try a few practices and see if there is a decent energy. Hopefully you have some options in your area. I don't know if Manhatten kickers are available where you are but they obviously do a fantastic job.
Thanks for the clarification. He played with a futsal ball last winter from December through March and it certainly seemed like his foot skills, particularly with the soles of his feet, improved quite a bit heading into the spring season. He really enjoyed the change of pace from the outdoor game.
Yes... good point. Brazilians in particular,because until 14 thats all you play in some parts will show dexterity with all parts of their feet, watch Neymar with his roll over moves etc.
I remember them when they first started they had a hard time finding fields. They play on the Chelsea pier now a lot of futsal at least indoors on artificial turf. An actress use to run that club Tovah Feldshuh she is in her 60s now. She is a pretty good actress. They are what I like to call a Coerver team. All their kids do are a lot Coerver moves right. They were not that good in fact when they did play in our out side league they always played in the lower division not in the A division. They did buy their soccer stuff from a soccer store that I am a part owner in.