Advice (again...) for working with a tinkerer referee

Discussion in 'Referee' started by Flyer Fan, Apr 25, 2009.

  1. Flyer Fan

    Flyer Fan Member+

    Apr 18, 1999
    Columbus, OH
    OK, I come seeking advice again for something that happened this morning that just seemed strange. I had two games this morning with the same crew, 8:00 and 9:30. I was an AR for both games. While chatting before the first game, the other 8:00 AR says that this is his first season which concerns me a bit as he was scheduled as the center for the 9:30 game. It was a U-12 boys game, but it's in a relatively high-level league (the "premier" league for teams from Dayton, Cincinnati, and Columbus). Also, for what it's worth, this guy did not have a badge or even a bag with any other gear. Now, in the first game he was the fans-side AR and actually shouted back-and-forth with a coach; neither the center nor I were amused, and the center got on him at half.

    The first-game center and I talk to each other between games, and we wonder what we should expect during the second game. We're concerned about, well, if the guy will handle the game appropriately. While we're stretching and discussing the upcoming game, we see the second-game center talking to the two coaches - he apparently told the coaches that he was going to allow substitutions at any stoppage in play in direct contravention to the league's printed rules. The other AR and I, after the center told us this, explained to him that what he was doing was against the rules to which he replied, "Relax, this isn't serious. Have some fun." I told him that the problem is that he's becoming "the last ref..." and possibly causing problems for referees down the road, not to mention openly going against the competition's rules. I mean, in the grand scheme of things substitutions are relatively minor, but it kind of put us in an awkward position. The other AR was livid, and he kept pushing the issue.

    In addition to the substitution issue, there were other things like not wanting to check in the teams, not even wanting to keep their cards, not checking the goals (I made sure to check them, though), and my favorite: no coin flip for opening kickoff but rather a best two-out-three game of rock, paper, scissors (yes, I actually just wrote that).

    So, after this novel: How do you handle situations where you feel as if the referee is not exactly acting in the most professional manner, purposefully and explicity working in opposition to stated rules, etc? I assum it's a matter of knowing which battle to pick, but boy was it frustrating.
     
  2. refmedic

    refmedic Member

    Sep 22, 2008
    Call the assignor. They should take care of him by making sure that if he wants go get another game beyond his "first", then he had better toe the line.
     
  3. d|hogan

    d|hogan New Member

    Mar 11, 2009
    San Diego
    Club:
    AS Roma
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    +1. Call the assignor and see if you can have him come out and assess the referee. He shouldn't be doing competitive matches if he feels it "isn't serious."
     
  4. jkc313

    jkc313 Member

    Nov 21, 2001
    Tell the guy he simply cannot decide when to allow subs and he has to follow League guidelines. Also tell him you will be in touch with the assignor asap and if he wants to continue getting assignments he best follow the rules. You have to wonder what other rules and Laws he's going to decide to change to suit his whims.
     
  5. dadman

    dadman Yo soy un papa

    DC United
    United States
    Apr 13, 2001
    Reston, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If I were a parent new to the game, I wouldn't have a problem with this at all. Just because I wouldn't know.

    As a parent who grew up playing the game, I would be wondering wtf he was doing. :eek:

    You're right to be concerned about the ref team that comes after this guy, and rightfully frustrated at the time.

    I'm wth your fellows: Contact the assignor, and suggest an assessment soon. I know there are cronic referee shortages, but this guy is doing no one any favors picking up the whistle.
     
  6. whyref

    whyref Member

    May 26, 2006
    Seeing as how I am in your area I read your post with some trepidation. I'm pretty sure I know exactly who you are describing. Drop me an email at Ciscooh@aol.com if you would like. Actions such as these are components that we need to remove from MOSSL, BPL, and the other leagues in this area.
     
  7. keeper1031

    keeper1031 Member

    Jul 5, 2006
    Cbus ohio
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Strange is right. Call the assignor.

    But, i must admit i have used the rock-paper-scissor method once or twice :rolleyes:
     
  8. constructor

    constructor Member

    Dec 21, 2007
    Out in the sticks
    Rock Paper Scissors is pretty bush league. If you forget your coin, just write a 1 or 2, A or B or something similar prior to asking the visitors to pick and then show what was written in the book.
     
  9. jkc313

    jkc313 Member

    Nov 21, 2001
    Even or odd number of fingers behind the back also works. Not wild about rock paper scissors but that pales compared to the other problems this guy was causing. I'm not sure I'd have even let him center a game with no current badge. I may have politely suggested since he wasn't properly prepared perhaps one of the ARs should take over or loan him a badge.
     
  10. nonya

    nonya Member

    Mar 2, 2006
    Personally I would not have done the game, and I would have went to both coaches and suggested that they might not want to play either. You are opening yourself up to loads of trouble if you know before the match started that your referee was going to disregard the rules of the league, neglect his duty to keep an accurate record of the game, and to neglect players safety. I would have simply told the referee that I can not do the game with him, and let him know that I will contact the SRA, the league administrator and assignor. This referee has obviously no respect for the game, the players or himself. You have an obligation to report this individual, otherwise you are no better than he is. Simply by ignoring the rules of substitution you may have to replay the game if a coach wishes to protest. As silly as it may sound, I know of a USSF match that had to be replayed because there was no coin toss, the referee did the 1/2 thing behind is back. And for not checking the goals for safety to see if they are anchored is inexcusable. Telling your assignor is not enough in this situation.
     
  11. boylanj64

    boylanj64 Member

    Nov 7, 2008
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm sure you mean well, but please never do that. We are not there to fill out a set of forms properly, we are there to ensure the players are safe, play the game how it was meant to be, and have fun ourselves. No coach in his right mind would refuse to play because a ref is being stupid. You should certainly let them know you will report the issue to the league, but please remember these are 12 year old kids who just want to have fun on a saturday. There is no need for them to be deprived because someone else ie being stupid, and you are being sanctimonious.
     
  12. boylanj64

    boylanj64 Member

    Nov 7, 2008
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I know some 6's who haven't gotten current year badges yet. I did a PDL match last year wearing a 2005 badge. The players can't tell the difference between years - they can certainly distinguish between something and nothing, so I always keep spares with me in case someone forgets. I know it is a tough pill to swallow, but he is evidently certified, was assigned to the match, and he should do it. You may not like it, but it is his first game EVER! I've seen ten year referees do worse things - if we deny him the chance to do the match, how can we expect him to grow as an official?
     
  13. Flyer Fan

    Flyer Fan Member+

    Apr 18, 1999
    Columbus, OH
    More strange. I looked up this referee on our Ohio South referees' site and it says that this guy has been a referee since 1996. Heck, in 1996 I was in my third year of college. Why would someone say that this is their first assingment if they've actually been certified for approximately 13 years? So strange.
     
  14. ThreeCards

    ThreeCards New Member

    May 31, 2005
    Texas Hill Country
    So pre-game aside, how did he do during the match?

    It may be that he let his certification slip and has only recently started doing matches again. Or it could be that he started playing back in 96 and factors these years into his referee experience. :rolleyes:
     
  15. jayhonk

    jayhonk Member+

    Oct 9, 2007
    He is the one digging the hole, there is no need to hop in there with him.

    The OP did not say it was his first ever. What it sounds like is that he is coming from a rec or low-intensity background, and doesn't realize that this league is made up of teams that take things seriously, even at 11 years old.

    You did what I would have done, talk it over with the other AR, get ready to intervene if necessary during play, and let nature take its course. The world won't end, but hopefully his attitude will change to meet everyone else's expectations.
     

Share This Page