explain for me (someone who rarely watches MLS and didn't catch much of the recent friendlies) how do Zimmerman/Hedges/Walker/Birnbaum compare to the likes of Gonzalez/Besler/Cameron/Brooks?
I get the sense that Arena really likes Birnbaum, which makes me question whether he watched him play for the NT prior to being coach. Not good enough, IMO. I think Hedges is a very good defender. I think he's already ready to step in and play important games for us, but I'm not sure I'd have him more than 3-5 on the depth chart. Zimmerman is similarly good, but he might need more seasoning.
Yup. I believe Brooks has the highest ceiling of any of them. He's only 24 and a Bundesliga starter. After that everybody is really kinda in the same grouping. If healthy and match-fit, Cameron would probably start next to Brooks. But he's not healthy and match-fit at the moment............................. Arena is really comfortable with Gonzalez. I won't be surprised to see a Gonzalez/Brooks parternship for our WCQer against Honduras. Its kind of a "twin trees" pairing, but we're playing Honduras..........not Spain. Hedges and Zimmerman both might have a higher ceiling than Birnbaum, but they have much less international experience. For this do-or-die WCQer against Honduras, we may go with Birnbaum. He can get the job done. I thought Besler has had a pretty anonymous last year. He's gonna have to prove to me in MLS play that he's back to being in the USMNT picture. Time to phase some of these guys out, as we have a lot of U24 talent on the way.............................. Michael Orozco? Out Tim Ream? Sorry. Out. Need to provide opportunities to Zimmerman, Parker, Carter-Vickers, Miazga, and the list goes on.
Besler was injured and dealing with injuries pretty much all of last season. That would be like criticizing Cameron for a lack of games this year. NT games matter, he performs better than any of these players for the NT, and even during his injuries, he was still performing the best of our CB's for the NT, so I certainly don't agree. One of the problem's that I think Arena is approaching is too many immobile CB's. Brooks doesn't move that well, Gonzalez doesn't move at all, Hedges doesn't move at all, Zimmerman doesn't move much better than Gonzalez or Hedges, Birnbaum doesn't either. And a lot of these players aren't good passers either. I think some choices have to be made when it comes to CB roles. I really don't think more than two of Gonzalez, Hedges, Zimmerman, Birnbaum, Miazga can be on a roster, and two might even be stretching it. Maybe only one of them. If 5 are selected, two probably works. If you only go with 4, I think one.
Injuries were part of it. I just thought that when he did play......................he didn't look that great. He's now the wrong side of 30. At some point we need to stop calling up aged depth guys (like say........Chad Marshall), and give younger guys like Zimmerman the chance. Our position in WCQing meant that Arena was mostly looking at guys that can help NOW at January camp. We understand that. Next January camp should be a lot of younger players (Zimmerman, Parker, Glad.............hopefully Palmer-Brown or Redding). And we know that our foreign-based catalog of young and youngish CBs is also interesting, being led by Carter-Vickers and Miazga.
Interestingly enough, I don't feel like I have any real feel for who Arena likes most at the moment. He played enough of the players significant amounts of time (23 I think) and he didn't say anything negative about anyone. I got the feeling that he was going out of his way to make positive comments about whomever he was talking about without really meaning much by it. He was very high on Zusi, for instance, after the Jamaica game. Do I think he really felt he did an outstanding job? I don't know what he thinks. there are a few that he seems to have gone out of his way to single out and he did play Birnbaum in both games so there is that but I don't have the feeling that what he said or even what the lineups were give too accurate of a picture.
I like coaches who keep it positive in public and air their complaints in private. One of Klinsmann's biggest faults in my opinion. No on e likes be humiliated in public even if it's warranted and usually then have a grudge against the boss. Shouldn't have affected a pro like Brooks but I feel it did. Even pro's are still just people and most play a lot harder if they feel the coach has their back.
Hoping Hedges-Zimmermann get a helllllll of a look during the Gold Cup. I gotta think theyre a better option than Gonzalez or Ream. Not to mention they've got the all-important chemistry card too.
I'm up for pretty much anything. I haven't watched Hedges-Zimmerman as much as I've watched Birnbaum (although he deservedly based on his early MLS play was left off this roster), but it was very clear Ream and Gonzalez were not used to each other. Both made good individual plays at times, but organization was lacking.
Agree although the last bit only matters if they're starting together, which they wouldn't be if Brooks is healthy/available. I'd like to see that as our starting pairing for the Gold Cup though, with 2 of Besler/Gonzo/Birnbaum as reserves.
Yeah, and the big problem isn't just they haven't played together enough, but that neither one of them has the personality or wherewithal to organize things. The US has had plenty of guys at that position through the years who could play with whoever next to them and just take charge and tell them who to be. I don't think that's Gonzalez's personality, and Ream seems unsure of himself. I miss Carlos Bocanegra. You could always count on Boca to be in the ear of his linemates making sure they were organized and not getting too out of shape.
The importance and talent level of Carlos Bocanegra is criminally under-rated on these boards. [Perhaps most undervalued player after Stevie Cherundolo.] I remember Bob Bradley mentioning in an interview that the first thing he did during the 2010 cycle was try to nail down his #1 keeper and CB combo. That quickly became Howard with Boca/Gooch. Just horrible luck that Gooch went down with that nasty injury in the WCQer against Costa Rica. Lest we forget, that was just after he signed for AC Milan. I'll say that a second time. AC Milan. His career never really got back on track. For me the key for Arena now is to just nail down his starting CB combo. Klinsmann chopped and changed and we never really knew what was going on. I doubt the players did either. Stick with Cameron/Brooks in important games for now. Get some of the other vets like Gonzo/Besler in there, and give the up-and-comers like Zimmerman & Miazga some time in the Gold Cup. We're playing Nicaragua and Martinique in the group stage there for Christ's sake. Those aren't necessarily easy games, but are the perfect time to give a guy like Zimmerman a chance in a game that matters. One thing I know is that its very unlikely both Hedges AND Zimmerman are called up to the Gold Cup. USMNT coaches work with clubs to ensure they don't do something like that.
Boca/Gooch or Gooch/DeMerit or Boca/DeMerit 3 solid defenders in the last decade. Boca is probably the best MLS defender we ever had who played in Europe. Ryan Nielsen might also be it (well for NZ)
The top MLS defenders are the KC duo, the Dallas duo, followed by Spector and Birnbaum. Guys like Zimmerman, Opara and maybe Parker deserve looks in January. However, Besler is the only one currently contending for an A team role, along with players like Brooks, Cameron, Gonzalez, Ream, and Miazga. Hedges had his chance but will likely fall way down the CB depth chart.
JMO. Besler and Brooks are our two best CB's. Cameron's #3, but he's not best as a CB, he should not even be considered a CB, other than if we really need to play him there. Miazga should be in the team. Spot 4 for the WC can go to Palmer-Brown, Hedges, Zimmerman or Carter-Vickers. Likely in that order. The first and last on that list are totally dependent on their playing time. 2 and 3 still need to prove themselves with the NT, as plenty of good MLS players don't turn into good players with the NT. Gonzalez is not a bad player, but he needs to be off the NT. We already have too many big, immobile CB's who don't pass the ball well. He's the worst player of those CB's, so he's on the outside of the equation. In some scenario of needing other CB's this cycle, Ike Opara is a possibility, Justen Glad is a possibility, as is Nick Hagglund and Tim Parker. So this is my depth chart. 1. Besler 2. Brooks 3. Miazga 4. Palmer-Brown 5. Hedges 6. Zimmerman 7. Carter-Vickers 8. Opara 9. Glad 10. Hagglund 11. Parker Cameron is #3 if he's considered for the CB position, although I consider him a starter in CM.
1.Cameron 2.Brooks 3.Miazga 4.Opara 5.Besler 6.Gonzalez 7.Ream 8.EPB 9.Zimmerman GCam has been the most consistent performer this cycle. Besler was poor enough at one point that Vermes benched him.
Brooks, Cameron, Gonzalez, Miazga and Besler seem like a solid pool for Russia. isn't Zimmerman making a move to Hoffenheim? It might boost his chances at being among the 30 selected to train in May.
I want to see more Miazga in this Cup and other friendlies. He has the tools to be a great one for the US.
The play of Besler and Gonzalez, in this tournament, would make me very nervous if they were put on the WC roster.
You would seem to contradict yourself here. You claim Vermes benching Besler at one point means he shouldn't be higher yet Opara was benched multiple times last season as well and surely Vermes wouldn't have EPB at 8 if he only recently passed Ellis on his own team's depth chart. Besler? You sure you don't mean Hedges. He's gotten pretty unanimous praise as one of our best players so far in this tournament.
So he was rotated out for an achilles injury in the playoffs? You also didn't mention that Besler was playing on one leg for a lot of last season and most SKC fans still thought that Vermes made a terrible decision.
Yeah, I can envision Ream taking a spot over Besler. Realistically, Opara is a long shot to make the team; I just think he is one of the best CBs in the pool.